These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Missions & Complexes

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
Previous page123
 

Magnetometric sites need a look at

First post
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Captain Mastiff
#41 - 2011-11-23 02:00:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Captain Mastiff
Ikonia wrote:
Well, as exploration is my main profession, i certainly agree with the initial post about a demanded upgrade to Magnetometric sites. Gathering a bunch items with a value of a few thousand ISK is compared to the time invested not really worth it - even belt rat hunting in 0.9 system brings more income when calculating the ISK/min.

In fact it is always the one big fish you are after, that brings the 100 Million item or better. But those are never in magnetometric sites, but complexes. Leaving the finding of the one big fish to the pure luck to find it makes exploration less an issue of skills, but of pure luck. There is no difference between skill 3 overall and skill 5 overall beside the time invested to pin it which brings it broken down to a difference of less than 3 minutes and a minor chance to find something - which is random, and not stable.

I believe that each profession should have their own specific things or items , which only can be gained by this profession. Not only left in the very high end - referring to WHs and Sleepers - but also in the possibility to have some specific items in the beginning of the profession. Honestly, it is not about the income, but being part of a community, or market.

Compared to the very stable income of mission running exploration is very peaky with tremenmdous amounts of deep lows and far too few peaks on the positive side never weighing up the negatives. Agree, it is more challenging and exciting to explore since nothing will ever be the same, but for the amusement factor onlly? Missioning is while more easy and more profitable in the long term and delivering almost the same goods and items as exploring, but in higher numbers with less investment of time.

There for i think, the existence of some "exploration skill depending items" should be considered as necessary.

But honestly, there is few in Eve that is as exciting as exploration :)

Cheers


QFT

Exploration in High/Low sec isn't really viable as an income, I have been doing it on and off since I started Eve. I recently came back after 3 months away and I was last in 0.0, back in high sec with my tengu fitted for exploration.

I've spent hours each night searching for sites, I frequently come across wormholes... yay and bookmark them for the sake of having a bookmark with a date. I then have found multiple complexes and anomalies as well as mag sites. Even warping to a beacon in space is more profitable than running mag sites. Now I'm not complaining because I'm not making much ISK from one site alone, I'm complaining for a number of reasons.

I use to run L4s and that was as stable as it could get, I minded my own business only ever interacted with other players when I decided to pimp my ship out and went back running them day in day out I got bored but I was making some serious ISK without any effort, I could AFK most missions and where I was, I was safe from gankers and ninjas. I enjoyed that time but felt like I was wasting my subscription on repetitive tasks only to improve my efficiency on those repetitive tasks and it became a vicious circle. The skill set required was actually pretty low barrier of entry, I didn't require anything of serious commitment to get into a drake to begin with and even then I could run levels 4s, albeit slowly. What get's me the most about exploration is it's profit to skill ratio, it's **** poor to shocking. I can't believe how high the multipliers are for Hacking and Analyzing on top of the fact that I MUST have high probing skills which are x 5, x8 for some along with a good probing ship to merely have a chance to find something. This doesn't include the fact that every other high sec system I enter already has someone probing or already cleared of all signatures before I get a chance.

I invest heavily in a Tengu for something different by probing here and there with probing implants and skills to find a Mag site that offers me less than what a Level 1 mission would for the time investment that I could see me finish a Level 5 or 2/3 sanctums in 0.0, I honestly don't see the point. The ISK reward is substantial to someone who has been playing Eve for a week maybe, though the skills required to find that ontop of having a combat ship/module is out of their reach...

It just doesn't add up.... What happened to "Risk Vs Reward?" Mission runners - only risk of being ganked ( easily avoidable ). 0.0 Anom runners - PvP risk ( easily avoidable ). Exploration - Risk of finding nothing of value in multiple sites, risk of being beaten by the other people hoping to scrape a living, nothing spawned altogether ( based purely on chance and nothing to do with skills you have both tangible and intangible. Where as the others... always have a guaranteed income.

Edit: If I hadn't cleared it up in the post above here is what i was attempting to say... ******* boost Mag sites across the board not just in low and 0.0, if anything only boost it in low. Boosting in 0.0 is like giving candy to a fat baby. At least in low sec it is likely to encourage a small population shift. Boosting 0.0 on this is just another reason for power block alliances to form NAPs so they tend to their ISK farms. The skill requirements to scan are the same all round so why make it that High sec mag sites and even most low sec mag sites are just going to be under the "Ignore result" category.
Emperor Salazar
Remote Soviet Industries
Insidious Empire
#42 - 2011-11-23 02:21:54 UTC
Captain Mastiff wrote:


Exploration in High/Low sec isn't really viable as an income, I have been doing it on and off since I started Eve. I recently came back after 3 months away and I was last in 0.0, back in high sec with my tengu fitted for exploration.

I've spent hours each night searching for sites, I frequently come across wormholes... yay and bookmark them for the sake of having a bookmark with a date. I then have found multiple complexes and anomalies as well as mag sites. Even warping to a beacon in space is more profitable than running mag sites. Now I'm not complaining because I'm not making much ISK from one site alone, I'm complaining for a number of reasons.

I use to run L4s and that was as stable as it could get, I minded my own business only ever interacted with other players when I decided to pimp my ship out and went back running them day in day out I got bored but I was making some serious ISK without any effort, I could AFK most missions and where I was, I was safe from gankers and ninjas. I enjoyed that time but felt like I was wasting my subscription on repetitive tasks only to improve my efficiency on those repetitive tasks and it became a vicious circle. The skill set required was actually pretty low barrier of entry, I didn't require anything of serious commitment to get into a drake to begin with and even then I could run levels 4s, albeit slowly. What get's me the most about exploration is it's profit to skill ratio, it's **** poor to shocking. I can't believe how high the multipliers are for Hacking and Analyzing on top of the fact that I MUST have high probing skills which are x 5, x8 for some along with a good probing ship to merely have a chance to find something. This doesn't include the fact that every other high sec system I enter already has someone probing or already cleared of all signatures before I get a chance.

I invest heavily in a Tengu for something different by probing here and there with probing implants and skills to find a Mag site that offers me less than what a Level 1 mission would for the time investment that I could see me finish a Level 5 or 2/3 sanctums in 0.0, I honestly don't see the point. The ISK reward is substantial to someone who has been playing Eve for a week maybe, though the skills required to find that ontop of having a combat ship/module is out of their reach...

It just doesn't add up.... What happened to "Risk Vs Reward?" Mission runners - only risk of being ganked ( easily avoidable ). 0.0 Anom runners - PvP risk ( easily avoidable ). Exploration - Risk of finding nothing of value in multiple sites, risk of being beaten by the other people hoping to scrape a living, nothing spawned altogether ( based purely on chance and nothing to do with skills you have both tangible and intangible. Where as the others... always have a guaranteed income.

Edit: If I hadn't cleared it up in the post above here is what i was attempting to say... ******* boost Mag sites across the board not just in low and 0.0, if anything only boost it in low. Boosting in 0.0 is like giving candy to a fat baby. At least in low sec it is likely to encourage a small population shift. Boosting 0.0 on this is just another reason for power block alliances to form NAPs so they tend to their ISK farms. The skill requirements to scan are the same all round so why make it that High sec mag sites and even most low sec mag sites are just going to be under the "Ignore result" category.


You're doing it wrong. Exploration in high/low/null is perfectly viable as a primary source of income. There is plenty of reward. You just need to learn how to do it better. Is it steady isk/hr income? Of course not. Its still plenty viable, just in a much different fashion.
Captain Mastiff
#43 - 2011-11-23 02:42:22 UTC
Emperor Salazar wrote:

You're doing it wrong. Exploration in high/low/null is perfectly viable as a primary source of income. There is plenty of reward. You just need to learn how to do it better. Is it steady isk/hr income? Of course not. Its still plenty viable, just in a much different fashion.


Clearly I'm doing it wrong... it's my fault that the Magnetometric sites are giving out perhaps 50,000ISK worth of items for something that can take a long time to find. The whole "pot luck" is purely my fault and it's only due to my inability to scan and force a game to make the drop table work in my favor is my downfall...

I've been doing alright, I've probably made more money in high sec probing that L4s but I come across Magnetometric and I have made next to nothing on them, it isn't even worth the extra time scanning it because their pay out is so worthless. Out of the hundreds I have done over my time on Eve I have not every seen anything from a Magnetometric site come in at the value of 1 million ISK.

Also as a "newly" returning player I didn't know about the "new" alt feature Oops though suddenly things sound a lot easier. Though it still doesn't affect the fact the reward from a magnetometric is on comparison of a L1 mission where as the work to find them is definitely higher.
Emperor Salazar
Remote Soviet Industries
Insidious Empire
#44 - 2011-11-23 03:02:49 UTC  |  Edited by: Emperor Salazar
Captain Mastiff wrote:


Clearly I'm doing it wrong... it's my fault that the Magnetometric sites are giving out perhaps 50,000ISK worth of items for something that can take a long time to find. The whole "pot luck" is purely my fault and it's only due to my inability to scan and force a game to make the drop table work in my favor is my downfall...

I've been doing alright, I've probably made more money in high sec probing that L4s but I come across Magnetometric and I have made next to nothing on them, it isn't even worth the extra time scanning it because their pay out is so worthless. Out of the hundreds I have done over my time on Eve I have not every seen anything from a Magnetometric site come in at the value of 1 million ISK.

Also as a "newly" returning player I didn't know about the "new" alt feature Oops though suddenly things sound a lot easier. Though it still doesn't affect the fact the reward from a magnetometric is on comparison of a L1 mission where as the work to find them is definitely higher.


I wasn't referring to mag sites. I was referring to your comment "Exploration in high/low sec is not a viable source of income."

Mag sites are garbage. That I agree on full heartedly; its stupid that they are the 1 exploration site where there primary reward source (salvage) can be farmed much more easily in missions. But to say exploration in high/low isn't viable as an income source is silly.

And you don't need an alt, you just need a Tech 3 ship, preferably the tengu, and deep space probes (and the ability to probe faster than the other 10 dudes in system with you; races are fun).
Captain Mastiff
#45 - 2011-11-23 14:51:02 UTC
Emperor Salazar wrote:


I wasn't referring to mag sites. I was referring to your comment "Exploration in high/low sec is not a viable source of income."

Mag sites are garbage. That I agree on full heartedly; its stupid that they are the 1 exploration site where there primary reward source (salvage) can be farmed much more easily in missions. But to say exploration in high/low isn't viable as an income source is silly.

And you don't need an alt, you just need a Tech 3 ship, preferably the tengu, and deep space probes (and the ability to probe faster than the other 10 dudes in system with you; races are fun).


Yeh I was wrong by saying it isn't a viable profession in general, I should of been clearer. I meant to say only using Mag/Lad/Rad/Grav sites not running the complexes. I mean I run the complexes whilst I'm scanning the rest of the system and these are my main source of income, daredevil bpc here and there along with shadow serp stuff it's nice but the actually archaeology side is too rare and too much of a pot luck when you do find it among the race to scan them out against the other people doing it.
Heinel Sidewind
Power-Hug Training Bootcamp
#46 - 2011-11-24 01:28:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Heinel Sidewind
Yeah, I think that if you want to farm NPC ships, there is really not much reason to scan down plexes as it's much more efficient to do L4s. Pick a corp with good LP store and you will have enough isk to buy whatever you want from the plexes, guaranteed. And this is with the benefit of working entirely to your schedule, no competition or commitment.

To me, exploration is not much about shooting NPCs, but about treasure hunting. It is something that could cater to people who think activating modules and waiting for NPC ships to pop is stupid. Emphasis should be put on people having to race others to the reward, but not necessarily in combat ships.

Make the hacking modules usable under covert ops cloak, but put the boxes behind massive defenses that would take hours to clear if you don't sneak past them. People who like ship combat can still clear a path in and earn bounty in the process, but a covert ops frigate should be given the option to skip the bounties and just loot the reward.

Make mag sites large like L4 wrecks but very spread out so it's very difficult to get them all without multiple tractors. They introduced a fancy ship especially for salvaging and it basically is on everyone's alt, however, no effort is put to make it a viable main and this is a design failure. It even has it's own skill path. It needs to be a viable profession, and this can be done with a healthy supply of free-for-all wrecks.

There are so many ways ships can be used in this game but no content to actually make use of them, for that I think this definitely needs a reform.
Captain Mastiff
#47 - 2011-11-24 12:42:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Captain Mastiff
Heinel Sidewind wrote:
Yeah, I think that if you want to farm NPC ships, there is really not much reason to scan down plexes as it's much more efficient to do L4s. Pick a corp with good LP store and you will have enough isk to buy whatever you want from the plexes, guaranteed. And this is with the benefit of working entirely to your schedule, no competition or commitment.

To me, exploration is not much about shooting NPCs, but about treasure hunting. It is something that could cater to people who think activating modules and waiting for NPC ships to pop is stupid. Emphasis should be put on people having to race others to the reward, but not necessarily in combat ships.

Make the hacking modules usable under covert ops cloak, but put the boxes behind massive defenses that would take hours to clear if you don't sneak past them. People who like ship combat can still clear a path in and earn bounty in the process, but a covert ops frigate should be given the option to skip the bounties and just loot the reward.

Make mag sites large like L4 wrecks but very spread out so it's very difficult to get them all without multiple tractors. They introduced a fancy ship especially for salvaging and it basically is on everyone's alt, however, no effort is put to make it a viable main and this is a design failure. It even has it's own skill path. It needs to be a viable profession, and this can be done with a healthy supply of free-for-all wrecks.

There are so many ways ships can be used in this game but no content to actually make use of them, for that I think this definitely needs a reform.


The proof is in the pudding, I just have to look at my tengu to realise it's a L4 fit with a probe launcher. I managed to squeeze a hacking module on but analyzer and salvager are left back at the station the reward for using them on sites minimal where as the trade off is much higher dps and a utility slot. It doesn't seem right...

My worst experience with these so called complexes is where you scan them out, you win the race but when you are sitting there working through it someone warps in and just goes for the overseer loot instantly and disappears. I've started doing the same myself now I just don't see the point of running the site properly when I can just be efficient and bypass a lot of the unneeded crap.

I've been this for a few days straight now and what I've noticed is people patrol a couple of constellations doing a ring around them scanning out the sites and then bugger off to do something else once they're done. On my journey I have come into systems where the hardest things to scan out have been done or left incomplete so they won't de spawn but the Magneto sites always left. It's a rat race that becomes silly because you know if you waste your time you can bet your money that someone else is going to beat you to another site.

I started this expecting to be doing it for the exploration content but surprise surprise it's turned into running the equivalent of Level 2s in a tengu.
Previous page123