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Drones are broken. Please fix them

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M1k3y Koontz
House of Musashi
Stay Feral
#141 - 2014-01-07 22:43:51 UTC  |  Edited by: M1k3y Koontz
Skia Aumer wrote:
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
CCP Veritas wrote:
It's worth noting that in all recent events it hasn't been the high load that directly causes the node death, but rather errors in the programming that only express at high load or in the kind of highly complex scenarios that large fights contain.


Well CCP seems to disagree...

They didnt say drones dont cause TIDI. Or did I read it wrong?


Node death is due to stressing the server, ie "high load".
Tidi is the solution to an overstressed server unable to process things fast enough.

Therefore, drones =/= the problem, blobs are.


If people don't like tidi and lag, novel idea here, maybe they shouldn't bridge 2000 people into a system in a Dominix fleet?!

Both sides use drone doctrines. If CFCRUS are complaining about issues from such doctrines, maybe they shouldn't be contributing to their own pain.

Edit: And people are claiming that drones are the cause of lag, that it CCP saying that drones didn't crash the node, blobs did.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
Xolve
State War Academy
Caldari State
#142 - 2014-01-07 22:45:30 UTC
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
Both sides use drone doctrines. If CFCRUS are complaining about issues from such doctrines, maybe they shouldn't be contributing to their own pain.


Then we wouldn't get to enjoy these tear-filled threads.
Skia Aumer
Planetary Harvesting and Processing LLC
#143 - 2014-01-07 22:46:11 UTC
Xolve wrote:
This thread is what happens when baddies post a terrible thread, and then tell everyone in Jabber to go agree with them.

You can ping your piers to post here "RUCK FUSSIA" and call it even.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#144 - 2014-01-07 22:47:05 UTC
-a- vs -a- is amusing

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Sur Jel
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#145 - 2014-01-07 22:52:29 UTC
I remember the times when Goons + TEST just brought 500 rifters to a fight to screw the node up.

CCP fixed that by introducing TIDI, so now they can bring 2000 rifters if they wanted.
Skia Aumer
Planetary Harvesting and Processing LLC
#146 - 2014-01-07 22:52:50 UTC
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
Therefore, drones =/= the problem, blobs are.

Blob fights (TM) is the selling point of this game.
Yet, developers prefer to work on pirate noobships and re-skinning Revenant. That's weird tbh.
Jindan Belt
Sheriff.
Caldari Tactical Operations Command
#147 - 2014-01-07 23:03:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Jindan Belt
Robert Caldera wrote:
Jindan Belt wrote:
Or immature people, saying "Angry Russians" think that TiDi should be there and we should live in 0.0 where anybody can use it as exploit?


oh yeah -A- who is loosing this war miserably, suddenly come to forums and bothers about overall game balance, not of their own interest or something ofc, no, god forbid!

So do you agree that drones should not cause such TiDi or not? Or you just want to discuss who wins and who loses this war?

Edit:
M1k3y Koontz wrote:

Node death is due to stressing the server, ie "high load".
Tidi is the solution to an overstressed server unable to process things fast enough.

Therefore, drones =/= the problem, blobs are.


If people don't like tidi and lag, novel idea here, maybe they shouldn't bridge 2000 people into a system in a Dominix fleet?!

Both sides use drone doctrines. If CFCRUS are complaining about issues from such doctrines, maybe they shouldn't be contributing to their own pain.

Edit: And people are claiming that drones are the cause of lag, that it CCP saying that drones didn't crash the node, blobs did.

Please read carefully what have been said. High load leads to TiDi, that's OK, and at the same time TiDi occur more often when carrier-drone doctrine is used. So higher load is produced by drones, not by your fictional "blob".
What we're asking in this thread is that CCP to look into this issue and fix that high load.
Flyinghotpocket
Small Focused Memes
Ragequit Cancel Sub
#148 - 2014-01-07 23:26:15 UTC
while we are fixing drones. can we re balance them so the amarr ones are kind of usefull

Amarr Militia Representative - A jar of nitro
shebu
OEG
Goonswarm Federation
#149 - 2014-01-07 23:29:31 UTC
drone asist is cheat
bp920091
Black Aces
Goonswarm Federation
#150 - 2014-01-07 23:29:45 UTC
First off, i dont have a problem with slowcats. I do have a problem with how they are currently being used (ie, drone assist).

Sentry Drones are, in essence turrets. They share far more with turrets than they do with regular drones. Simply put, they dont move, and are extensions of one's own ship (drone based ship in most cases), in regards to damage. The different flavors of sentry drones are also representative of guns as a whole. Shorter range, better tracking, more dps? Better use a Garde. Long range, worse tracking, less damage? Use Bouncers.

People say that drones should be assistable, yet several classes of drones are not. Often called support drones, ECM, Remote Repair, and Salvage Drones cannot be assisted to someone else. While Remote Repair and Salvage drones make sense, being "Support," ECM drones are different entirely. While it is true that they do not deal damage, instead, they directly negatively effect the opponent's status (web, jam, target paint, etc). CCP has decided that this is far too powerful for assisting, and have therefore made these classes of drones un-assistable.

For those calling for Carriers to be "Fighters Only," I do not think that this is the right path either. The Slowcat doctrine is a strong and powerful one indeed, and a removal of the utility of carriers to only be able to field fighters is a rather large nerf that is unneeded.

As for sentry drones, they create the issue of "Perfect Alpha." If this is intended in the game then the only thing that needs to be done is to allow modules to be assisted as well. If "Perfect Alpha" was not something that was intended, and seen as undesirable, remove sentry assist from the game. Regular drone assist is not broken due to other aspects (ie, time for drones to get into position, position of drones in fleet, as well as giving other ships the ability to get on killmails (logi), when they are focusing on other aspects (ie, repping their fleet-members)).

I for one feel that for a ship to fire on someone using turrets (which sentry drones are), they should have to lock you first.

For those saying "Well, -A- supports Dominix/Ishtar Fleets, so they really arent supporting drone assist nerfs, just slowcats," I say this. I dont like sentry assist on ANY platform, including dominix/ishtars. In order for a ship to use turrets on you, it should have to lock you and fire on you. I would be in SUPPORT of a change that would cause Dominixes and Ishtars to need to manually lock and fire on the target that they with THEIR drones to shoot.

Carriers in the past have not been used in this manner because of an inbuilt mechanic, that is, lock time (that, and before the drone mods, sentries werent nearly as good). When you can delegate the damage to one ship, built specifically for lock time and range, the drawbacks for using a carrier are lost, leaving only the positive aspects.

TLDR: Remove sentry Assist or allow guns to be assistable
Dirk Action
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#151 - 2014-01-07 23:32:58 UTC  |  Edited by: Dirk Action
Skia Aumer wrote:
Xolve wrote:
Angry Russians.
Angry Russians Everywhere.

Much of an argument.
Dunked.


it's a waste of time to argue with someone who refuses to see facts

you know, like how Veritas posted saying that the drones haven't actually caused the latest node crashes, despite you pro-blobbers insisting that they do


Roll

instead i think i'll continue to dunk on you ingame Cool
Okapist
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#152 - 2014-01-07 23:33:29 UTC
FIx drone lags
Skia Aumer
Planetary Harvesting and Processing LLC
#153 - 2014-01-07 23:48:10 UTC
bp920091 wrote:
TLDR: Remove sentry Assist or allow guns to be assistable

Basically, you suggest to make drones similar to guns. I.e. to remove their flavor. To make the game more homogenous. And more dumb.
Thus, I will not agree with you.

Also, it has nothing to do with server performance and is thus offtopic.
Kat Ayclism
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#154 - 2014-01-07 23:48:46 UTC
Andski wrote:
-a- vs -a- is amusing

As good or better than the new BoB grrring about BoB?
And drones
And titans bumping
And etc...

GrrrrrrGameNotBeingMyWay
M1k3y Koontz
House of Musashi
Stay Feral
#155 - 2014-01-07 23:49:57 UTC
Jindan Belt wrote:
TiDi occur more often when carrier-drone doctrine is used. So higher load is produced by drones, not by your fictional "blob".
What we're asking in this thread is that CCP to look into this issue and fix that high load.


On your first point, numbers to back your claim?

You're not asking CCP to look at the issue, you want CCP to nerf Slowcats, drone assist, sentries etc. Anything to neuter the fleet doctrine you won't risk the assets to beat.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
Skia Aumer
Planetary Harvesting and Processing LLC
#156 - 2014-01-07 23:54:59 UTC
Dirk Action wrote:
Veritas posted saying that the drones haven't actually caused the latest node crashes, despite you pro-blobbers insisting that they do

Veritas didnt even mention about drones.
Criss Scaurus
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#157 - 2014-01-08 00:00:12 UTC
FIx drone lags
M1k3y Koontz
House of Musashi
Stay Feral
#158 - 2014-01-08 00:08:25 UTC
Skia Aumer wrote:
Dirk Action wrote:
Veritas posted saying that the drones haven't actually caused the latest node crashes, despite you pro-blobbers insisting that they do

Veritas didnt even mention about drones.


Veritas mentioned high load. If drones are indeed creating such server lag as the anti-drone activists are claiming, drones were (indirectly) mentioned.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
Ekhss Nihilo
Dominion.
Sigma Grindset
#159 - 2014-01-08 00:17:11 UTC
ALL SUPERCAPS JUMP wrote:
1Of9 wrote:
uaaaaaaaaaau .. tears ... so delicious

nom nom nom


anyway, on a more serious note.
CCP nerfed areaDD at goons request, because, well, goons could not win.
CCP nerfed sensor boosters at goons request, well, you know, old vets like BoB could pwn them too far away since they didn't had the skills :THEHORROR:..

Then goons discover that NANO was too much, they where getting owned left and right in their ratting pastures. :cry cry cry: and CCP nerfs.

Goons jump into a system bubbled? too many bubbles? NO PROBLEMO, batphone CCP they will remove them for us.

Now getting owned by sentry drones .. what do to? lemme see.. AH YES! let's bat phone CCP once more. ALWAYS WORKED IN THE PAST why not once more?

Next on the cry list: REMOVE caps from game, since goons out number everyone, it's game over for everyone else.

Then, remove MWD, make sure hostiles cant run away.

Why not nerf skilling speed? OLDER chars like SirMolle etc can skill SLOWER so goons and buddies catch up?

Why not make WARP BUBBLES affect only the hostiles and NOT those that are blue to the bubble owner? Goons love sabres..




System with 8000+ abandoned sentry drones was lagging whole day (until they were removed by petition)
With only 50 ppl in local, grid was loading for a few minutes. Do you really like it that way?


There is no need to fix carriers or drone assist...just fix lags caused by them, goddamit!


I approve of this post.

"The object in life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane." -- Marcus Aurelius (AD 121-180)
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#160 - 2014-01-08 00:29:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Robert Caldera
hey, rest of eve coalition, if you'd have choosen a different point in time to express your concerns about drones and their mechanics, you would probably earn some more credibility but as you do said thing during a war you are in process to fckin loose your whine doesnt count for more than like "waahhhhh CCP PLEASE NERF ENEMY SO WE CAN FINALLY WIN!", you understand?

Its a stupid thing to complain about enemys fleet compositions during an active war you are about to loose or at least dont make any progress for months since its begin!!! HTFU and go grow some balls!!