These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Player Features and Ideas Discussion

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
 

Non-scannable locations in space

First post
Author
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#21 - 2014-01-07 23:16:35 UTC
FT Diomedes wrote:
I like the idea, but I have some questions and thoughts.

I love that you cannot warp out of it. If there is lucrative content, people will try to farm it. Being unable to warp out inhibits that. I would also suggest that you could not cloak inside it.

Content should be varied and random. I'm envisioning an area very large where there could be: data cans, relic cans, gas clouds, ice fields, pirate installations, ghost site areas... Initial exploration might be an interceptor flying through it to find a lucrative mining field, then leading a fleet of hulks back inside. Or perhaps a T3 with a range of mods and a mobile depot. The point being, it would be unpredictable and random. It would require real effort.

It should not be a static location. Or should it? If it does, it should not have a predictable refresh/respawn. Perhaps CCP could use this to replace some of the random installations and complexes that are currently spread around space?

It could have WH effects in certain grids. Gas clouds, asteroid belts, damage clouds. It could even sometimes have a WH entrance inside of it.

The possibilities are almost endless.


You are typing faster than I am.
I am building a larger post based on Malcanis template.
But the fundamental concept would be of "the unknown", and working for rewards, and dealing with the inherent risk of whatever form of exploration and PvP that would evolve around these areas.

CCP is looking to expand the Eve universe by creating new star systems.
That is fine, but they could also create a new "system within a system" with these areas, and if some of the basic game mechanics we rely on now, like dscan, and warping, are disabled, essentially a new game meta can evolve in these areas.
mynnna
State War Academy
Caldari State
#22 - 2014-01-07 23:16:47 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Wow. What happened to Dinsdale?

Squirrel and lost nuts. Or broken clock, if you prefer.

Member of the Goonswarm Economic Warfare Cabal

Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#23 - 2014-01-07 23:29:59 UTC
Yep. this is exactly the direction I think EVE should go. More systems are meaningless when they simply thin things out. More content inside a system, especially this sort of content adds density which creates interactions & possibilities.
Daichi Yamato
Jabbersnarks and Wonderglass
#24 - 2014-01-08 00:13:31 UTC
Deacon Abox wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
where fleets can hide, or even get lost in.
. . .
I always imagined some kind of area like we saw in the Wrath of Khan, would be a very interesting to spend a few hours, or longer, in.

You guys reacted only to the hiding aspect. I sorta like the getting lost part. Some FC leading his pos bashing fleet or whatever into an ion storm to hide, only to find he's lost and trapped, unable to lock on anything outside to warp to.Lol The amount of "impolite verbal abuse" on comms when game time is wasted and the objective lost would be gold to record.P


indeed, i am thinking of fleets that can build up in WH's with free cloaks on all their ships. like:

Inty warps into nebula and then MWD's to just within the boundary. Fleet warps to inty and then slowboats into the nebula where it cannot be scanned or probed. The anomaly spans several grids, so u have no chance of finding the fleet even if u knew it was there. Then when the fleet is ready, it can slow boat it back out the nebula and is free to warp away.

if the nebula sucks u in if u try to warp nearby it would alleviate this problem at least. and making the warp in point change location within the nebula at intervals might mix things up.

EVE FAQ "7.2 CAN I AVOID PVP COMPLETELY? No; there are no systems or locations in New Eden where PvP may be completely avoided"

Daichi Yamato's version of structure based decs

Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#25 - 2014-01-08 00:18:20 UTC
Daichi Yamato wrote:
Deacon Abox wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
where fleets can hide, or even get lost in.
. . .
I always imagined some kind of area like we saw in the Wrath of Khan, would be a very interesting to spend a few hours, or longer, in.

You guys reacted only to the hiding aspect. I sorta like the getting lost part. Some FC leading his pos bashing fleet or whatever into an ion storm to hide, only to find he's lost and trapped, unable to lock on anything outside to warp to.Lol The amount of "impolite verbal abuse" on comms when game time is wasted and the objective lost would be gold to record.P


indeed, i am thinking of fleets that can build up in WH's with free cloaks on all their ships. like:

Inty warps into nebula and then MWD's to just within the boundary. Fleet warps to inty and then slowboats into the nebula where it cannot be scanned or probed. The anomaly spans several grids, so u have no chance of finding the fleet even if u knew it was there. Then when the fleet is ready, it can slow boat it back out the nebula and is free to warp away.

if the nebula sucks u in if u try to warp nearby it would alleviate this problem at least. and making the warp in point change location within the nebula at intervals might mix things up.


Sure, why not? A Gas cloud can be a fluid thing, made up of electromagnetic swirls and eddies. So why would a bookmark be expected to be static. Or perhaps the bookmark is a static location, and the gas cloud ebbs and flows around it. Suddenly a bookmark 2 km off the edge is 50 km inside 4 hours later. I don't know if CCP can code boundaries like that, but who knows?
Silent Rambo
Orion Positronics
#26 - 2014-01-08 01:01:16 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:

Sure, why not? A Gas cloud can be a fluid thing, made up of electromagnetic swirls and eddies. So why would a bookmark be expected to be static. Or perhaps the bookmark is a static location, and the gas cloud ebbs and flows around it. Suddenly a bookmark 2 km off the edge is 50 km inside 4 hours later. I don't know if CCP can code boundaries like that, but who knows?


I really doubt that it could move, as we don't even have planets and moons that move. Locations inside a system are basically static at this point, and so are bookmarks. A way to make different entrances would be to make them sort of like districts on a planet. This would most likely be the easiest way of opening different ways to enter the "null void" instead of just a single entrance.

From what I've noticed, the EVE engine doesn't do much besides have things be drawn in static location, so I don't think there is a lot of room for dynamic moving content really anywhere in space till the engine is fixed to support it. Changing a bookmark location server side constantly would be the only way I see to fake it.

You really think someone would do that? Just log into EvE and tell lies?

Legion40k
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#27 - 2014-01-08 02:31:20 UTC
I like this idea =D A couple of ideas just to explore (no pun intended oh god my bad)

> limited overview range based on ship lock range? you can only see what your ship sensors can target

> Mobile Micro Jump Units could make artificial corridors to get to where your fleet needs to get to. Imagine if someone screwed up and launched in a wrong direction..lost..scared..suddenly alone [I remember something like that in Battlestar Galactica..to suddenly lose your fleet on a bad jump. The atmosphere and terror would be amazing]

okay i *really* like this idea
Omnathious Deninard
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2014-01-08 02:57:04 UTC
A fun though would be to add WH style effects to the nebulas also.

What kind of shiney could be in these though, to make some one want to enter them for an extended peroid of time?

If you don't follow the rules, neither will I.

Mike Azariah
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#29 - 2014-01-08 03:48:10 UTC
Very neat idea.

I like the concept and the thought behind it

m

Mike Azariah  ┬──┬ ¯|(ツ)

FT Diomedes
The Graduates
#30 - 2014-01-08 03:51:07 UTC
Silent Rambo wrote:
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:

Sure, why not? A Gas cloud can be a fluid thing, made up of electromagnetic swirls and eddies. So why would a bookmark be expected to be static. Or perhaps the bookmark is a static location, and the gas cloud ebbs and flows around it. Suddenly a bookmark 2 km off the edge is 50 km inside 4 hours later. I don't know if CCP can code boundaries like that, but who knows?


A way to make different entrances would be to make them sort of like districts on a planet. This would most likely be the easiest way of opening different ways to enter the "null void" instead of just a single entrance.



I like the idea of different entrances.

CCP should add more NPC 0.0 space to open it up and liven things up: the Stepping Stones project.

SKINE DMZ
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#31 - 2014-01-08 05:08:37 UTC
+1 Awesome idea. Smile Truly get lost in space.

I disagree

Lyra Gerie
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#32 - 2014-01-08 06:08:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Lyra Gerie
+1
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#33 - 2014-01-08 06:20:39 UTC
OK, using Malcanis' template, I have sent him am email with my rough concept.

It was too long to fit in one post, and was terrified of losing it with a dodgy draft system, or by splitting it in 2.
He can do with it as he sees fit.

Bottom line, the idea is , for a real world analogy, you are a warrior/hunter/explorer heading into a great forest at the beginning of the 20th century. You have some decent weapons, but no GPS, no satellite phones, and no infrared gear. You will have explore/hunt with good navigational skills and smarts.

Who knows what you may find in the forest. Perhaps great riches. Perhaps someone who has already found great riches, and are looking for an way out, without an armed escort. Perhaps a group that does not take kindly to be being found.

By limiting some of the basic game mechanics we use today, you can create a new meta around these zones, be it PvE or PvP.
A far larger and complex mini-game than the exploration sites CCP introduced in the last 2 releases, but a still a "game within the game of Eve".

Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#34 - 2014-01-08 09:05:54 UTC
fleets get lost in in? You mean they would have to selfdestruct then?
sounds like a fun feature.
Sato Page
Auctor Illuminatas Infinitum
#35 - 2014-01-08 09:32:54 UTC
+1 I fully endorse this product.

Dinsdale Pirannha for [u]CEO [/u]of [u]CCP[/u]

Samillian
Angry Mustellid
#36 - 2014-01-08 09:38:45 UTC
This is a very interesting idea, I anticipate your expanded post with interest.

Supported.

NBSI shall be the whole of the Law

Mangala Solaris
Blue Republic
RvB - BLUE Republic
#37 - 2014-01-08 09:59:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Mangala Solaris
Supporting this, seriously DInsdale, put more work into fleshing it out and lets see what happens.

The idea of effects in space like this, and potentially so many others, especially in any potential new space excites the explorer in me.
D'ni Pyremere
I HAVE THE POWER OF GOD AND ANIME ON MY SIDE
Blue Eyes and Exodia Toon Duelist Kingdom Duelers
#38 - 2014-01-08 10:13:14 UTC
This makes me think of nebula in Freelancer. I think a great way to combat the issue of this just providing safe areas to get good loot would be to make these nebula risky.

What if some of these nebula had pockets of explosive elements? These could be randomly dispersed throughout the nebula. If a ship ran into one it would deal massive damage. Enough to instantly pop a frigate while dealing large damage to other ships. Perhaps on the level of the damage found in ghost sites currently. They would not show up on the overview or anything, however they would be slightly different in color to the surrounding nebula so they could be spotted and avoided as long as you were paying attention.

Another option would be pirate bases. Naturally pirates would find nebula to be a great place to hide a base of operations. Players could accidentally stumble into these heavily defended bases and with no way to warp out be forced to run, or if they are to slow to do so, fight. This could be a source of good loot however would be a very difficult fight.

Or how about ancient minefields from wars long past? Imagine massive mines larger than frigates rising out of the dense gloom of the nebula like old lurking ghosts. With spiny barbs reaching out to detect nearby vessels. These mines would do MASSIVE damage. Even more then the gas pockets mentioned above. More on the level of instantly popping most ships smaller than battlecruisers while killing battlecruisers and battleships in 2-4 blasts. The minefield could be riddled with the wrecks of ancient ships full of valuable technology, but be careful reaching them, lest you join them.

Better yet? Just make all of the above possibilities. In these nebula you may be safe from being scanned. But you are far from "safe".
Old Phill
Doomheim
#39 - 2014-01-08 10:53:03 UTC
+1 exploration needs a bit of a new spin
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#40 - 2014-01-08 10:54:44 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
OK, using Malcanis' template, I have sent him am email with my rough concept.

It was too long to fit in one post, and was terrified of losing it with a dodgy draft system, or by splitting it in 2.


It's fine. Post it. Split it into 2 if need be.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016