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Interceptor Balance

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Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#21 - 2014-01-06 03:49:31 UTC
Diamond Zerg wrote:
Wow, dude, really? Can you please try to post constructively?



Do you really want me to post constructively in a thread where you are crying because you cant kill an inty in your frig-death SFI anymore. or simply want to silence someone calling you out on what you really want? Because no matter how well you camouflage the thread with fits and words, it pretty much boils down to my last post.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Malakai Asamov
Van Diemen's Demise
Northern Coalition.
#22 - 2014-01-06 03:52:40 UTC
Hasikan Miallok wrote:
I run my interceptors with dual hyper rigs and nano lows so mine aren't a threat to anyone just d@mn hard to catch.

But lets be honest ... whatever ship is currently the best for small gangs will suddenly appear everywhere. If you nerfed inties something else will take their place. If you made assault frigate gangs the optimal way to fight, there would be AF everywhere.

The assumption that "everyone flies ship X therefore ship X is ridiculously overpowered" is nonsense in a game as even being a few percent better in stats will make a ship dominant in a particular role. The alternative is to "balance" things to make all ships identical but that way lies boredom and will kill the game.

The main thing though is 4 or 5 T2 frigates really should be able to kill a T1 cruiser with relative ease. Especially when the T1 cruiser cost 10 or 15 mill fitted and the intercepts cost more like 40 mill each fitted.

What the original poster seems to be saying is he wants to be able to kill 200 mill worth of T2 frigates in a 15 mill T1 cruiser just because its a cruiser.


I know reasonable discussion is tough to get on this forum but what the OP (me) actually said was "I think a crusier specifically fitted to combat inties with bonuses that support that should have a slim chance of killing 1 inty within 5 minutes".

The issue is compounded by several factors which all lead to interceptors being to perfect for their job which I think is a flaw.

To highlight what i don't think is right is that in my skirmish linked stiletto running a faction point i can point out to 40km comfortably, heat to 60 something km for intial point and orbit at 5.5kms with a 70ish sig. Now at that range with that speed small guns cant reach me, med lr weapons cant track me and med sr weapons cant reach or track, bubbles cant stop me and if you warp somewhere i'm there before you are and lol neuts. Missiles yes they can be scary but so long as i avoid a few ships im fine. (yes there are a couple of scenarios where this is not true, nothing is absolute in eve).
Malakai Asamov
Van Diemen's Demise
Northern Coalition.
#23 - 2014-01-06 03:58:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Malakai Asamov
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Diamond Zerg wrote:
Wow, dude, really? Can you please try to post constructively?



Do you really want me to post constructively in a thread where you are crying because you cant kill an inty in your frig-death SFI anymore. or simply want to silence someone calling you out on what you really want? Because no matter how well you camouflage the thread with fits and words, it pretty much boils down to my last post.


What I really want is constructive conversation not witty comments like "what it really boils down to is you crying because you think i'm crying".
Liang Nuren
No Salvation
Divine Damnation
#24 - 2014-01-06 04:20:33 UTC
Malakai Asamov wrote:
[
To highlight what i don't think is right is that in my skirmish linked stiletto running a faction point i can point out to 40km comfortably, heat to 60 something km for intial point and orbit at 5.5kms with a 70ish sig. Now at that range with that speed small guns cant reach me, med lr weapons cant track me and med sr weapons cant reach or track, bubbles cant stop me and if you warp somewhere i'm there before you are and lol neuts. Missiles yes they can be scary but so long as i avoid a few ships im fine. (yes there are a couple of scenarios where this is not true, nothing is absolute in eve).


So now we're talking about two specialized ships performing their specialized roles. In this particular case, an inty is not trying to kill you, but merely holding you down for someone else to kill. If the Inty were actually killing you from that range I'd be much more likely to be concerned.

For this specific situation I'm pretty comfortable suggesting you get a Curse.

-Liang

I'm an idiot, don't mind me.
Malakai Asamov
Van Diemen's Demise
Northern Coalition.
#25 - 2014-01-06 04:28:33 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
Malakai Asamov wrote:
[
To highlight what i don't think is right is that in my skirmish linked stiletto running a faction point i can point out to 40km comfortably, heat to 60 something km for intial point and orbit at 5.5kms with a 70ish sig. Now at that range with that speed small guns cant reach me, med lr weapons cant track me and med sr weapons cant reach or track, bubbles cant stop me and if you warp somewhere i'm there before you are and lol neuts. Missiles yes they can be scary but so long as i avoid a few ships im fine. (yes there are a couple of scenarios where this is not true, nothing is absolute in eve).


So now we're talking about two specialized ships performing their specialized roles. In this particular case, an inty is not trying to kill you, but merely holding you down for someone else to kill. If the Inty were actually killing you from that range I'd be much more likely to be concerned.

For this specific situation I'm pretty comfortable suggesting you get a Curse.

-Liang


That paragraph is talking about one speacilised ship, as far as i'm aware any point range bonused inty can do this to any ship.

I shouldn't of muddied the water with diverging from the original proposition that statement was more to show that I'm aware and play both sides/styles.
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#26 - 2014-01-06 05:17:03 UTC
Malakai Asamov wrote:
... and orbit at 5.5kms with a 70ish sig. Now at that range with that speed small guns cant reach me, med lr weapons cant track me and med sr weapons cant reach or track, bubbles cant stop me and if you warp somewhere i'm there before you are and lol neuts. Missiles yes they can be scary but so long as i avoid a few ships im fine. (yes there are a couple of scenarios where this is not true, nothing is absolute in eve).




fair enuf ...

so ... drones ???
Malakai Asamov
Van Diemen's Demise
Northern Coalition.
#27 - 2014-01-06 05:39:27 UTC
Hasikan Miallok wrote:
Malakai Asamov wrote:
... and orbit at 5.5kms with a 70ish sig. Now at that range with that speed small guns cant reach me, med lr weapons cant track me and med sr weapons cant reach or track, bubbles cant stop me and if you warp somewhere i'm there before you are and lol neuts. Missiles yes they can be scary but so long as i avoid a few ships im fine. (yes there are a couple of scenarios where this is not true, nothing is absolute in eve).




fair enuf ...

so ... drones ???


I think the issues with drones is that they can potentially travel fast enough but they orbit to slow to keep up with a inty generally.
Kharamete
Royal Assent
#28 - 2014-01-06 05:41:05 UTC
Liang Nuren wrote:
[quote=Malakai Asamov][
For this specific situation I'm pretty comfortable suggesting you get a Curse.
-Liang


Or a couple of sentinels. From the other batch of frigs that were buffed in Rubicon.

CCP FoxFour: "... the what button... oh god I didn't even know that existed. BRB."

My little youtube videos can be found here
QproQ
Monolithic Juggernaut
#29 - 2014-01-06 05:59:18 UTC  |  Edited by: QproQ
It doesn't fit your criteria, but you could try a Geddon...

Liang Nuren wrote:


For this specific situation I'm pretty comfortable suggesting you get a Curse.

-Liang


Or this!
Jayne Fillon
#30 - 2014-01-06 07:11:08 UTC
Ever since the patch I've been flying a nano Stabber to great success, overheated it goes 4.2km/s and with dual metastasis rigs has quite the projection ability. Simply burn directly away from the interceptor, they'll normally misjudge your speed and will give you a target with almost zero transversal (who needs tracking mods when you can manually pilot?).

I've been having fun purposefully looking for gangs of interceptors, and seeing how many I can take down before I'm finally destroyed. My nemesis so far has been the dual prop dramiel and the hyena, those two ships are the instrument of my destruction much more often than any interceptor.

Anyway, T1 cruisers are cheaper than interceptors now. The increase in performance for the interceptors was matched with an increase in cost. Seems fair to me.

Can't shoot blues if you don't have any. Long Live NPSI.
I Love Boobies
All Hail Boobies
#31 - 2014-01-06 08:35:38 UTC
POINT. WEB. ECM. NOS/NEUT. KILL.
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
#32 - 2014-01-06 10:52:28 UTC
I'm just glad to see a thread where people are praising interceptors instead of whining that their nullsec 23/7 Falcon botcamp isn't an automatic "I win" button anymore.

Big smile

http://youtu.be/t0q2F8NsYQ0
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#33 - 2014-01-06 10:56:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Robert Caldera
interceptor bubble immunity is OP. Look at the goons, all they fly is interceptors, because you basically cant catch them anymore (apart of silly methods like smartbombs), unless they want to fight and mess up.
Interceptors are a safe travel ship and this shouldnt be available for this price tag of 20m ISK, IMO there shouldnt be any bubble immunity for anything at all.
Norm Tempesta
Garoun Investment Bank
Gallente Federation
#34 - 2014-01-06 11:20:20 UTC
Robert Caldera wrote:
interceptor bubble immunity is OP. Look at the goons, all they fly is interceptors, because you basically cant catch them anymore (apart of silly methods like smartbombs), unless they want to fight and mess up.
Interceptors are a safe travel ship and this shouldnt be available for this price tag of 20m ISK, IMO there shouldnt be any bubble immunity for anything at all.


We have had some luck using sebo'ed-r'sebo'ed inties and destroyers on gates. Usually just catch two or three out of 10 though.
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#35 - 2014-01-06 11:22:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Ramona McCandless
Robert Caldera wrote:
interceptor bubble immunity is OP. Look at the goons, all they fly is interceptors, because you basically cant catch them anymore (apart of silly methods like smartbombs), unless they want to fight and mess up.
Interceptors are a safe travel ship and this shouldnt be available for this price tag of 20m ISK, IMO there shouldnt be any bubble immunity for anything at all.



Oh shut your face you big baby

Robert Caldera wrote:
lol, player x engages in a game activity, finds it boring and complains at CCP about it.
How is about doing something else?

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Hasikan Miallok
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#36 - 2014-01-06 11:28:04 UTC
TBH anything that has noobs training Racial Frigate V rather than heading straight for Battleship should be encouraged.
Robert Caldera
Caldera Trading and Investment
#37 - 2014-01-06 11:28:31 UTC
Norm Tempesta wrote:
We have had some luck using sebo'ed-r'sebo'ed inties and destroyers on gates. Usually just catch two or three out of 10 though.


yeah properly fit interceptors warp almost instantly, you dont even have a chance to lock them.
Interceptors are broken.
Effect One
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#38 - 2014-01-06 11:28:38 UTC
You say you want cruisers set up specifically to take out interceptors to be able to do so, but then your example fits are based on a crusier with the largest tier of medium artillery and the middle tier of autocannons...

*Confused

What does the graph look like with the smallest tier of medium artillery and autocannons (i.e. ones with the best tracking - you said in a further post you were looking at ships specifically designed to take out frigates, why fit them with weapons designed to smash cruisers and up?).

'This might be internet spaceships, but it's not rocket science to protect yourself and fly with a little common sense' - CCP Falcon
Morwennon
The Tuskers
The Tuskers Co.
#39 - 2014-01-06 12:41:51 UTC
A Huginn should do the business pretty easily.
Speedkermit Damo
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#40 - 2014-01-06 12:50:46 UTC
Unsuccessful At Everything wrote:
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
So you want a T1 Cruiser to be able to beat a T2 frigate assuming the frigate is well flown? And possibly several....?



If you cant beat it, cry until they nerf it.


Goonswarm's new motto Lol

Protect me from knowing what I don't need to know. Protect me from even knowing that there are things to know that I don't know. Protect me from knowing that I decided not to know about the things that I decided not to know about. Amen.