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Jesus wept, please fix POS mechanics!
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Lachra
Lachra Corporation
#1 - 2013-12-30 19:59:01 UTC
Hello. I need to vent. CCP, you need to fix POS mechanics as a priority. I've spent the last 3 days (maybe a bit longer but I'm not sure) bouncing emails back and forth to an alliance member who runs a high-sec POS with open alliance access to laboratory jobs for ME/PE. The core of our problems (or his, more specifically) are permissions. I cannot run a lab job despite having an office in the system, proper corp roles, and Scientific Networking. All of our issues seem to be coming down to the fact that there are a myriad of permissions and access hurdles to jump over. The whole mechanic and interface is like it is in Beta. Same for setting up a blueprint job through the Science & Industry screen. It's even difficult to specifically pin down where the issues lie as the interface is so clunky.

How about in one of the next updates shiny ships and blowing stuff up is put to one side for a moment and some attention is actually brought to one of the key mechanics of the universe which, after 10 years, ought to be even a bit polished. Industry is your unique selling point in this game - industry and the player-driven market. Without the industry aspects, this game would unfortunately be an outdated arcade-shooter. The industry and territorial aspects of this game keep it unique on the gaming market as an MMO, so why by Jesus' holy scrotum are POS mechanics such a backwater feature?

/vent

Also, for the sake of avoiding this thread from being locked by a fluffy ISD chimp, if anyone has any advice on my issue (through experience, not speculation smartasses!) please post and let me know.

/vent +1
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#2 - 2013-12-30 20:03:35 UTC
I heard that poses only affect a small portion of players.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Unsuccessful At Everything
The Troll Bridge
#3 - 2013-12-30 20:04:48 UTC
Never before has this been brought up.


Now that it has, im sure CCP will be on it Soon.

Since the cessation of their usefulness is imminent, may I appropriate your belongings?
Jill Chastot
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#4 - 2013-12-30 20:06:22 UTC
PoSes aren't the best :l

Two things i hate most, Giving someone access to one(or trying to), and moving one(or setting one up)

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=298596&find=unread OATHS wants you. Come to the WH "Safety in eve is the greatest fallacy you will ever encounter. Once you accept this you will truely enjoy this game."
Azami Nevinyrall
172.0.0.1
#5 - 2013-12-30 20:09:49 UTC
Soon™

And when I say "Soon™" I mean after the current 5 year "Roadmap" is complete...

Don't hold your breath...

...
Caviar Liberta
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#6 - 2013-12-30 20:16:20 UTC
You might want to edit that second part of your post out if you don't want this locked.

Yes setting up a POS is a pain. However you do know that a revamp in the POS system is in the works.

PoS reworking

CCP Fozie might have some other info else where on newer dev blogs.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#7 - 2013-12-30 20:20:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Batelle
Alavaria Fera wrote:
I heard that poses only affect a small portion of players.


And I wonder why that is Roll.

Yes, I raged when I saw that infamous comment.
Lachra wrote:

Also, for the sake of avoiding this thread from being locked by [comment redacted] if anyone has any advice on my issue (through experience, not speculation smartasses!) please post and let me know.


Get a nullified t3 or covops frig and go to a certain NPC nullsec region that is littered with stations and conveniently adjacent to empire. If you're halfway competent in flying either ship then the relatively high prevalence of pvpers and campers won't really bother you. You'll get your research done.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Lachra
Lachra Corporation
#8 - 2013-12-30 20:25:33 UTC
Caviar Liberta wrote:
However you do know that a revamp in the POS system is in the works.


Ofc. Everything is always "in the works" isn't it? CCP is rapidly becoming South Park's parody of George R R Martin in the MMO world: "The dragons and zombies are coming! And when they get here, they're gonna be great, I promise!"
TheMercenaryKing
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-12-30 20:38:40 UTC
The code is too old and CCP is likely not going to try to repair it. they may be able to salvage a few things, but all the new deploy-able structure they are putting in are all using new code.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#10 - 2013-12-30 23:51:44 UTC
Alavaria Fera wrote:
I heard that poses only affect a small portion of players.


Yup, #smallportion indeed.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Beekeeper Bob
Beekeepers Anonymous
#11 - 2013-12-30 23:57:54 UTC
Caviar Liberta wrote:
You might want to edit that second part of your post out if you don't want this locked.

Yes setting up a POS is a pain. However you do know that a revamp in the POS system is in the works.

PoS reworking

CCP Fozie might have some other info else where on newer dev blogs.


Three years ago WIS "was in the works".....

Signature removed - CCP Eterne
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#12 - 2013-12-31 00:24:38 UTC
Beekeeper Bob wrote:
Caviar Liberta wrote:
You might want to edit that second part of your post out if you don't want this locked.

Yes setting up a POS is a pain. However you do know that a revamp in the POS system is in the works.

PoS reworking

CCP Fozie might have some other info else where on newer dev blogs.

Three years ago WIS "was in the works".....

So when they revamp the pos, our graphics cards will melt and tons of people will rage about it?

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Lors Dornick
Kallisti Industries
#13 - 2013-12-31 00:30:20 UTC
Lachra wrote:
Hello. I need to vent. CCP, you need to fix POS mechanics as a priority. I've spent the last 3 days (maybe a bit longer but I'm not sure) bouncing emails back and forth to an alliance member who runs a high-sec POS with open alliance access to laboratory jobs for ME/PE. The core of our problems (or his, more specifically) are permissions.


From the view of a POS operator, this looks to be the truth.

In reality it's not actually about permissions and more down to Baby Jesus and his flowing tears.

The problem is that the current POS and to large extent Corporation management code is not in a state where anyone can fix much without putting in a serious amount of work recoding a lot of stuff that was written in a hurry to provide functionality that wasn't fully planned.

As with many other 'backend' changes it's not possible to deliver all of in one, or even two, expansions.

There are several hints that such recoding has been going on for some time, but it'll take a bit more before the new foundation is complete enough for any serious changes to actually be seen by us having to use the current frontends.

So while I spend a lot of my time in Eve struggling with current reincarnation of POS and Corporation code, and a lot of time swearing over it, I've haven't given up yet.

I think that it will be better, soon, as in a year or two ;)

CCP Greyscale: As to starbases, we agree it's pretty terrible, but we don't want to delay the entire release just for this one factor.
Felicity Love
Doomheim
#14 - 2013-12-31 01:18:51 UTC
Bah, who needs POS anyway ? Not like they do anything useful, and when they are hungry they squak and cry like newborns looking for their mama at 3am.

Shocked

"EVE is dying." -- The Four Forum Trolls of the Apocalypse.   ( Pick four, any four. They all smell.  )
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#15 - 2013-12-31 03:59:19 UTC
TheMercenaryKing wrote:
The code is too old and CCP is likely not going to try to repair it. they may be able to salvage a few things, but all the new deploy-able structure they are putting in are all using new code.


And then they'll run into the same problems the current POS code has: roles only apply within corporations, and you can't easily extend roles to alliances or third parties based on standings. For a POS revamp to be useful to me, I need to be able to rent out all my activity lines to third parties based on standings or corp/alliance membership.

Day 0 Advice for New Players
Thead Enco
HR..
#16 - 2013-12-31 05:33:01 UTC
Lachra wrote:
Hello. I need to vent. CCP, you need to fix POS mechanics as a priority. I've spent the last 3 days (maybe a bit longer but I'm not sure) bouncing emails back and forth to an alliance member who runs a high-sec POS with open alliance access to laboratory jobs for ME/PE. The core of our problems (or his, more specifically) are permissions. I cannot run a lab job despite having an office in the system, proper corp roles, and Scientific Networking. All of our issues seem to be coming down to the fact that there are a myriad of permissions and access hurdles to jump over. The whole mechanic and interface is like it is in Beta. Same for setting up a blueprint job through the Science & Industry screen. It's even difficult to specifically pin down where the issues lie as the interface is so clunky.

How about in one of the next updates shiny ships and blowing stuff up is put to one side for a moment and some attention is actually brought to one of the key mechanics of the universe which, after 10 years, ought to be even a bit polished. Industry is your unique selling point in this game - industry and the player-driven market. Without the industry aspects, this game would unfortunately be an outdated arcade-shooter. The industry and territorial aspects of this game keep it unique on the gaming market as an MMO, so why by Jesus' holy ******* are POS mechanics such a backwater feature?

/vent

Also, for the sake of avoiding this thread from being locked by a fluffy ISD chimp, if anyone has any advice on my issue (through experience, not speculation smartasses!) please post and let me know.

/vent +1


Scientists will find the cure for all forms of cancer inflicted on humanity long before CCP will ever look at fixing POS's.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#17 - 2013-12-31 07:35:24 UTC
Thead Enco wrote:
Lachra wrote:
Hello. I need to vent. CCP, you need to fix POS mechanics as a priority. I've spent the last 3 days (maybe a bit longer but I'm not sure) bouncing emails back and forth to an alliance member who runs a high-sec POS with open alliance access to laboratory jobs for ME/PE. The core of our problems (or his, more specifically) are permissions. I cannot run a lab job despite having an office in the system, proper corp roles, and Scientific Networking. All of our issues seem to be coming down to the fact that there are a myriad of permissions and access hurdles to jump over. The whole mechanic and interface is like it is in Beta. Same for setting up a blueprint job through the Science & Industry screen. It's even difficult to specifically pin down where the issues lie as the interface is so clunky.

How about in one of the next updates shiny ships and blowing stuff up is put to one side for a moment and some attention is actually brought to one of the key mechanics of the universe which, after 10 years, ought to be even a bit polished. Industry is your unique selling point in this game - industry and the player-driven market. Without the industry aspects, this game would unfortunately be an outdated arcade-shooter. The industry and territorial aspects of this game keep it unique on the gaming market as an MMO, so why by Jesus' holy ******* are POS mechanics such a backwater feature?

/vent

Also, for the sake of avoiding this thread from being locked by a fluffy ISD chimp, if anyone has any advice on my issue (through experience, not speculation smartasses!) please post and let me know.

/vent +1


Scientists will find the cure for all forms of cancer inflicted on humanity long before CCP will ever look at fixing POS's.

look at.... has happened, I'm sure.

Actual fixing, yeah nope

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
thowlimer
Roprocor Ltd
#18 - 2013-12-31 11:11:01 UTC
Did you set the permissions on the actual labs themselves in space(have to be at the pos and open the permission tab) ?
thats usually the first place to look , second is timing issues, ie sometimes waiting until a downtime has passed
can fix some permission cludges.
brinelan
#19 - 2013-12-31 15:43:16 UTC
You know those new mobile deployable structures that were released in Rubicon? Those are using the new pos code.
flakeys
Doomheim
#20 - 2013-12-31 15:56:30 UTC
But the pos revamp took place in 2008 ... not ?

We are all born ignorant, but one must work hard to remain stupid.
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