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PI max profit from wormhole

Author
Wilks Rotineque
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1 - 2013-12-23 11:09:19 UTC
I don't mind about isk/effort, I am looking for max profit gain on a single character, I don't mind importing/hauling lots of materials which may take hours of my day. I don't know whether I should be having max factory planets or be using extraction. All these spreadsheets don't seem to make sense or are out of date.

Help appreciated
Take care
Psade
Blind Avarice
#2 - 2013-12-23 13:02:02 UTC


Well, in absolute terms, industry planets have much higher total potential. Keeping them running in a way that leverages that potential will require some kind of tool you can use daily to evaluate prices. I don't know of any publicly available ones that do the job correctly, but they might exist. If you want liquidity, you're going to want easy access to a trade hub. As you might imagine, this means that wormhole space is probably not the right choice. You can buy materials in extreme bulk at a low point in pricing, I guess, but this could mean holding on to the end product for awhile. Most do extraction in wormhole space because it's less fidgety and profitable without research.
Proddy Scun
Doomheim
#3 - 2013-12-23 15:14:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Proddy Scun
Wilks Rotineque wrote:
I don't mind about isk/effort, I am looking for max profit gain on a single character, I don't mind importing/hauling lots of materials which may take hours of my day. I don't know whether I should be having max factory planets or be using extraction. All these spreadsheets don't seem to make sense or are out of date.

Help appreciated
Take care


If your wh system has a hi sec static exit then access to trade hubs is not an issue. Most people don't update and sell PI on a daily basis as that is just too much work. Once you get enough to make a trip to market worthwhile just start checking which hi sec system your wh exits to every day to see if you are within a reasonable distance of where you want to sell. But especially check that you don't need to cross any trade route bottlenecks where lots of pirate lurk (e.g. Uedema) if you travel that day. In general wh life with a high sec static exit might mean 1-4 days delay in when you go to market -- but can also mean as little as 2-6 jumps to markets like Amarr.

IF you are going to import lots of raw materials keep in mind that you are taxed when you import as well as when yo export. So the ideal situation is when your corp owns the POCOs and can set your taxes to zero. Of course there is risk of POCOs being destroyed -- more so in normal lo sec space or NPC null than WHs or sovereign null space.

My observation is that the higher level PI manufacturing as a whole sees quite a drop off in percentage profit over raw materials. That is you invest more and more in starting mats for less and less return. Not universally true and there are alwasy times like the start of Rubicon when you see particular items skyrocket for a short period of time (thank you mobile tractors). That paired with import taxes are why most try to extract, refine and then combine 2 refined items on each planet.

The best steady profits seem to be in modest levels of combining refined materials. That often works best at level 5 of Command Center Upgrades (or level 4 with 1 factory planet importing refined mats from your other extract planets). I am sure you can do better but then your workload and time spent in spreadsheets in marketplace monitoring tends to explode (KISS fan). If you find spreadsheet and research relaxing or and enjoyable then feel free to reap max profits via more complex product mixes. But most of us would rather spend more time in game than preparing to play.
Daenika
Chambers of Shaolin
#4 - 2013-12-25 18:03:20 UTC
Quote:
My observation is that the higher level PI manufacturing as a whole sees quite a drop off in percentage profit over raw materials. That is you invest more and more in starting mats for less and less return.


This is generally the case. However, the metric I generally use to evaluate PI in WH is the Isk value of the final product per P0 needed to make it (and thus ECU planets needed) per M3 of the final product.

In this regard, if you've got a system that can support it, Nanite Repair Paste is arguably the king of the hill. A well-researched BPO can kick out 6000 units per day, which is worth around 110m depending on the market, and that 6000 units only takes up 60 m3. That's a total of 1800 m3 per month, which easily fits inside a cloaky hauler with tons of room to spare (though that haul is also worth around 3-3.5b). Downside is that it takes a minimum of 6 characters to make, and generally 7-8 depending on skills and system PI availability.

Compare that to Gel-Matrix Biopaste, though. It takes at least 2 characters to make Biopaste, and 3 (at 5 planets each) to make efficiently. It is also almost exactly the same amount of Isk/P0 as Repair Paste. Downside? It's 150 times more massive per isk brought out. Repair Paste is around 1.8-1.85 million isk per m3. Biopaste is around 13 thousand.

If you were in k-space, that wouldn't matter much, but since HS opportunities are significantly rarer in most WH systems (well, unless you're in a static HS system), isk/m3 becomes a consideration in addition to isk/hour. All the income in the world doesn't help if you can't haul it to market, and every single run you make through that HS connection is a risk of losing your ship and your PI (and possibly your clone). This is particularly true if you're producing enough of it that you need to use a standard industrial or DST to move it, instead of a blockade runner or cloaky T3 hauler. Biopaste can generate 116,640 m3 per month across 3 characters. Repair Paste generates 1800 m3 per month across 6-8, and that's for very close to the same amount of isk per planet per hour.
Altalicious
Burning Space
#5 - 2013-12-25 18:20:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Altalicious
For a player just getting into PI you may want to look at POS fuel components: Coolant, Enriched uranium, oxygen or robotics. Coolant can be manufactured on gas or storm planets. Optimally enriched uraniumcan be manufactured on plasma planets. Oxygen, while profitable, takes up too much space to really be worth while. Robotics needs mechanical parts and consumer electronics. So you would need 3 planets to efficiently produce this item. There is always a demand for these items and they usually sell very fast. If you are not sure, my recommendation is for coolant. It's very easy to manufacture and gas planets are in almost every system.
Steve Ronuken
Fuzzwork Enterprises
Vote Steve Ronuken for CSM
#6 - 2013-12-25 21:36:32 UTC
https://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/pi/ might be of interest, for factory planet PI

Woo! CSM XI!

Fuzzwork Enterprises

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