Player Features and Ideas Discussion

You actually suggested it for cruisers or don't you recall?

Seriously man, it's a bad fit and a bad idea, and I honestly think you know it. It will be outmaneuvered and/or avoided by its intended prey (frigates), and will be an easy kill for everything else. Come on now.

I find that hard to believe. Especially when i've gotten kills with them. With a RoF fit ship just like the caracal you tried 100 pages or so back, that failed to kill a single frigate. So if i can kill a frigate with ****** missile skills, with a RoF bonused ship, then why can't you? Especially since, by the way you're talking you should have far better missile skills than I. So my Belli had a TP?, you can put a TP on your caracal and still get max dps on most targets (still 200dps to an a/b fit dram).

Or are you just pouting because you don't have a 60 charge clip that spews missile death upon frigates?

You can't just nerf LM application, because then you're also nerfing the frigate weapon, where frigates have much less ability to fit a TP or rigor/flare rigs. Maybe a web, but then that kind of defeats the range advantage of LM. So if you say, why didn't they nerf LM? Its because it would have caused issue with frigates/destroyers fitting LM. It would have been like the HM nerf was, but for LM. ****** application, unless painted out the ass.

Or reducing damage would really make standard LML fit suck even more. You have a 7-8s duration, and then you want to add even less volley damage? Why would anyone fit the standard launchers then.

So instead of nerfing LM's, they nerfed the only launcher that is OP with LM, the RLML. Even with the original RLML, how were groups of frigates supposed to survive an encounter with an RLML ship? There was no pause/break, just a constant stream of missiles. This has changed the format of the weapon, now there is a pause so frigates have a chance to kill (remember that risk/reward saying?) you, but you have increased initial dps to still provide a good anti-frigate role. Its anti-frigate, not, anti-frigate and can also anti-cruisers too. No, it kills frigates, thats its role. Cruiser killing is the role of the HML and HAM. Granted, HM's need some tweaking, but HAMs are still in a decent place right now. And for Caldari, hams are where its at since you have the velocity bonus.

So, here's how you do this. You feel like going out and harassing FW guys, and typically you deal with frigs. Fit RLML. You think you're going to deal with cruisers, fit HAMs. Not that hard a concept. And before you say it, yes even HAMs can kill frigs, maybe not swarms of them quick enough, but the random 1-2 frig tackle, it should handle easily (as long as you fit at least a web, which is kind of mandatory with HAMs anyway).

If HM are a problem, tweak them, but don't use this argument to keep an OP weapon system.

Basicaly CCP couldn't know about HML balance because RLML took their place in the strategic view of things. Additionaly, it would be very hard to balance HML vs RLML, because most of the time one would obsolete the other, hence why they modified the gameplay of RLML, so they have a dinstinct niche to separate them from HML. Now they will be able to study HML correctly.

Actually everyone with a functioning central nervous system knew HMLs were garbage even with RLML.

HMLs were never "OP", but they nerfed them anyway. Then they buffed rails, lasers and artillery. Then they released this abomination. So basically missile players got screwed over 3 times.

6.3 is still on the low side, and even then, killing a lone frigate doesn't disprove that RLMLs are only good for killing lone frigates.

I take your point re skills but to be fair that applies to all participants.

As for cap time, you won't need more than 2 cycles of the neut.

If you're worried about being tackled by a cruiser, try it with dual Asb rather than extenders. Then you change rigs for better damage application.

As I said, it's only one example of many missile platforms that kill frigates effectively. It might even be more effective with navy ammo.

Link that kill, the only rlml to frig I found of yours was an Scythe FI against an odd dramiel fit.

HML weren't nerfed too much, they were absurdly OP at the time.

Since then though cruiser speed has increased and MLRT got a huge buff.

RLML (and light missiles in themselves in fact) were OP too but not only because of HML. They were too good against frigates.

Now RLML are still very good against frigates but won't overlap on HML or obsolete destroyers anymore.

As for HML, I'm not sold yet on their uselessness. Missile users tend to miss their glory days when they were OP and allowed them to have one weapon to rule all the others. HML should not be better than HAML in HAM range, and seeing some comments here ("any range beyond point range is useless"), some here are definitely not looking for an LR weapon system. HML should be judged only for their performances beyond HAM range exactly like MLRT are judged only for their use outside of MSRT range.

You are a naysayer, focusing on what you can't do instead of what you can.

Your comparison with autocanon is bad on top of that in so many ways.