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THE END TO AFK MINING?

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BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#121 - 2013-12-11 18:16:25 UTC
Pheota Sansu wrote:
I am in no way defending afk miners, I dont do it myself, on the rare occasions I do mine I am at the screen. But what all these people dont realise is that if all the miners stopped mining, like so many people seem to want, where would the minerals for your ships come from? Reprocessing scrap only gives so much.


Actually I think we all realize this. If a significant population stopped mining, mineral prices (and ship prices) would go up, making industry a much stronger investment, and corporate production far more important. Other than the loss of account revenue for CCP, this could be a very positive thing for players as a whole.

I would prefer other methods for encouraging more active participation in mining though. Examples include forcing players to scan down belts to find decent ore, lowering the amount of ore per asteroid, and slightly increasing mining yields across the board. The net effect is that miners would spend more time moving between rocks instead of sitting an mining them. I'm not actually advocating nerfing the isk made when mining, but the inactivity when mining is unacceptable.

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Beekeeper Bob
Beekeepers Anonymous
#122 - 2013-12-11 18:20:02 UTC
Xuixien wrote:
I just had a lightbulb go off.

What if every barge got an extra high slot, which was a "hardpoint" for a certain module.

Call it the "Harvester Yield Actuation Device" or something.

It has a 1 minute cycle and does not repeat. When it's on, your mining yield is normal (what it currently is). When it's offline, your mining yield drops in half.

Miners who wanted to AFK would get **** income and thus not AFK as much.

Genius.

INB4 this has already been suggested.


It's so cute when people post this drivel. Why are you so concerned about afk miners? Odds are they will die anyway, and you're worried about them not being active?

Perhaps you should play the game more, and worry about what other people are doing less.

Signature removed - CCP Eterne
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#123 - 2013-12-11 18:22:11 UTC
Beekeeper Bob wrote:
Xuixien wrote:
I just had a lightbulb go off.

What if every barge got an extra high slot, which was a "hardpoint" for a certain module.

Call it the "Harvester Yield Actuation Device" or something.

It has a 1 minute cycle and does not repeat. When it's on, your mining yield is normal (what it currently is). When it's offline, your mining yield drops in half.

Miners who wanted to AFK would get **** income and thus not AFK as much.

Genius.

INB4 this has already been suggested.


It's so cute when people post this drivel. Why are you so concerned about afk miners? Odds are they will die anyway, and you're worried about them not being active?

Perhaps you should play the game more, and worry about what other people are doing less.


Confirming that the activities of other players are completely irrelevant in a player-driven multiplayer game.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Casanunda
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#124 - 2013-12-11 18:42:18 UTC
The great thing about threads like this? People putting themselves on the list of future victims of suicide ganking.

The fact that I am not a gazillionaire Gallente aristocrat with the sexual capacity of a rutting rhino is a constant niggle.
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#125 - 2013-12-11 18:42:41 UTC
Casanunda wrote:
The great thing about threads like this? People putting themselves on the list of future victims of suicide ganking.


SHHHHHHHHHHHH

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
Ghost Phius
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#126 - 2013-12-11 19:23:47 UTC
Casanunda wrote:
The great thing about threads like this? People putting themselves on the list of future victims of suicide ganking.


Amen!
Josef Djugashvilis
#127 - 2013-12-11 19:25:34 UTC
Dont UseYourAlt OnTheForums wrote:
Id say,

DESTROY ALL HIGHSEC MINERS!!!



Put the following in the correct order: post, think.

If you do this correctly, you will not be heard from again.

This is not a signature.
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#128 - 2013-12-11 19:31:58 UTC
I'm still just trying to understand why people hate AFK mining so much.

an afk miner already makes less than an active miner, since they dont cycle to the next rock immediately. also, they AFK mine for a REASON, a vast majority of them do it because they play EVE whil;e working on colege papers, or preoccupied by other things, they want to be logged in and talk with friends, but they dont have the ability to devote enough attention to "play".

AFK mining has its place, and nerfing it will only HURT the playerbase, as a close to majority of miners would just stop mining entirely when logged in, and ones who enjoyed the ability to "advance" while getting a sandwhich would likely move on to another game.

Also, by this mindset, lets remove PI as a passive income, if you want to make money off PI, you have to go to each of your planets and manually send resources between nodes, no more automation, lets also get rid of moongoo, and player owned POCOs, all of them get you passive income.

as for making mining "engaging". no, any activity that requires repetition can only be made MORE TEDIOUS or more boring, lets look at exploration, the new minigame was engaging for like, the first week, afterwards the sites and loot spew became more of a nuisance than actual "engaging" activity (also, lol at CCP wanting EVA exploration, and putting in minigames instead).
Casanunda
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#129 - 2013-12-11 19:47:44 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
I'm still just trying to understand why people hate AFK mining so much.

an afk miner already makes less than an active miner, since they dont cycle to the next rock immediately. also, they AFK mine for a REASON, a vast majority of them do it because they play EVE whil;e working on colege papers, or preoccupied by other things, they want to be logged in and talk with friends, but they dont have the ability to devote enough attention to "play".

AFK mining has its place, and nerfing it will only HURT the playerbase, as a close to majority of miners would just stop mining entirely when logged in, and ones who enjoyed the ability to "advance" while getting a sandwhich would likely move on to another game.
Name another game where you can harvest resources while not actually playing the game. People are more than welcome to work on their college papers, shoot the breeze with their friends, make a sandwich etc; they can do all of those things without undocking. The biggest problem with afk miners is that they fail to understand that Eve is a PvP environment, going afk while undocked in an industrial ship is pretty much akin to parking your shiny new car in the centre of a war zone and expecting it to be still there, and in pristine condition when they get back. AFKing anything in Eve comes with the risk of explosion, the constant childlike whining, verbal abuse and the refrain "I just want to be left alone" or similar when they do explode is what pisses people off about them.

Quote:
Also, by this mindset, lets remove PI as a passive income, if you want to make money off PI, you have to go to each of your planets and manually send resources between nodes, no more automation, lets also get rid of moongoo, and player owned POCOs, all of them get you passive income.
The major difference between the three things you list and mining is that mining explicitly requires you to be undocked, the others do not.

Quote:
as for making mining "engaging". no, any activity that requires repetition can only be made MORE TEDIOUS or more boring, lets look at exploration, the new minigame was engaging for like, the first week, afterwards the sites and loot spew became more of a nuisance than actual "engaging" activity (also, lol at CCP wanting EVA exploration, and putting in minigames instead).
If you find an activity boring, the simple solution is not to do it. Simples.

The fact that I am not a gazillionaire Gallente aristocrat with the sexual capacity of a rutting rhino is a constant niggle.
Josef Djugashvilis
#130 - 2013-12-11 19:51:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Josef Djugashvilis
If a miner for example, chooses to go afk, and their ship is ganked, then that is the price they pay.

So long as said miner accepts this, there is no problem.

This is not a signature.
Casanunda
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#131 - 2013-12-11 20:02:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Casanunda
Josef Djugashvilis wrote:
If a miner for example, chooses to go afk, and their ship is ganked, then that is the price they pay.

So long as said miner accepts this, there is no problem.

Much as I hate giving you a like that statement is true enough, unfortunately many afk miners don't accept that destruction is a possibility. As far as they're concerned their ships should be sacrosanct because they're "not affecting anyone else", which is a blatant falsehood.

The fact that I am not a gazillionaire Gallente aristocrat with the sexual capacity of a rutting rhino is a constant niggle.
Kate stark
#132 - 2013-12-11 21:15:11 UTC
buy procurer, fit 2nd strip miner, carry on as normal and completely ignore the new module.

job done.

Yay, this account hasn't had its signature banned. or its account, if you're reading this.
E-2C Hawkeye
HOW to PEG SAFETY
#133 - 2013-12-11 21:30:19 UTC
Jenn aSide wrote:
E-2C Hawkeye wrote:
Yonis Kador wrote:
loco coco wrote:
There is literally no point you could make that proves that AFK mining is bad. It's their play style. Go play the game how you want to, but stop whining about others doing what they want.



Comments like this one make me sad. Sad

CCP does not provide content in EVE. All content in New Eden is generated by the players - p.g.c.

An afk miner who is not actively engaged in providing that content "is" less-valuable to pgc than one who isn't. The quality of the game is adversely affected by encouraging afk behavior. It isn't theoretical. It is demonstrable. If EVE were a living system and you wanted to improve her health (pgc,) you would work to limit afk activities and increase player fluidity and interaction. Nothing contributes more to pgc than player interaction.

I don't agree with the OP because I think the limited size of ore holds has made this issue largely moot. Anyone who doesn't think so probably hasn't tried to dual box even two hulks with their new 8500m3 ore bays. With an orca boost they cannot store 2 cycles of ore so anyone piloting a hulk literally - cannot - afk mine. And if they're using procurers 12000m3, that's barely more than 2 cycles, so those guys stop earning isk in about 4 minutes of afk behavior.

The worst afk culprits (potentially) right now would be ice miners or any sort of solo retriever/mackinaw setup.

It is at least noteworthy that the easiest mining barges to gank (covetors/hulks) are also the least-likely to be afk mining. I'm not sure if that is working as intended.

But it's ridiculous to suggest that afk behavior "isn't bad." It's certainly not something we should encourage if we care about the quality of pgc in EVE.

YK

So you could also apply this same logic to afk cloaker.


The "Afk Cloaker" is generating content. No one knows if he's really afk or not, No one knows if he has a cyno or not. his presence is invoking a reaction (dock up,safe up, or refit to fight/survive) And the AFK cloaker is literally altering market and monetary system behaviors.

Last week a group of cloakers in stealth bombers blanketed my alliances "home" constellation, forcing us to either fit to fight/run (which tanks your isk per hour) or do something else (to which many of us luled, because npc 0.0 missions in curse or delve are very tasty and impossible to "afk cloak"). No one "likes" it when it happens to them, but it's not in any way the same as afk mining.

Same logic...no one knows if the ice miner is at key board or afk getting a drink or bio etc.. The only real difference is the afk cloaker can cloak up and go to work while the miner has to jettison or unload etc.

You cant expect to take away afk for just part of the player base and not the entire player base. If afk is bad for the game for miners then it is just as bad for the game afk cloaking.
Winchester Steele
#134 - 2013-12-11 21:34:45 UTC
Why do we want afk miners to go away again? They make the most delightful squealing noise when you pop them. Probably my favorite passtime in all of EvE tbh.Twisted

...

Chopper Rollins
Brave Newbies Inc.
Brave Collective
#135 - 2013-12-11 21:34:57 UTC
I'm afk mining right now. In null. 8 minutes from my base in X-70MU. Come get me.

Goggles. Making me look good. Making you look good.
loco coco
#136 - 2013-12-11 22:01:10 UTC  |  Edited by: loco coco
Casanunda wrote:
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
I'm still just trying to understand why people hate AFK mining so much.

an afk miner already makes less than an active miner, since they dont cycle to the next rock immediately. also, they AFK mine for a REASON, a vast majority of them do it because they play EVE whil;e working on colege papers, or preoccupied by other things, they want to be logged in and talk with friends, but they dont have the ability to devote enough attention to "play".

AFK mining has its place, and nerfing it will only HURT the playerbase, as a close to majority of miners would just stop mining entirely when logged in, and ones who enjoyed the ability to "advance" while getting a sandwhich would likely move on to another game.
Name another game where you can harvest resources while not actually playing the game. People are more than welcome to work on their college papers, shoot the breeze with their friends, make a sandwich etc; they can do all of those things without undocking. The biggest problem with afk miners is that they fail to understand that Eve is a PvP environment, going afk while undocked in an industrial ship is pretty much akin to parking your shiny new car in the centre of a war zone and expecting it to be still there, and in pristine condition when they get back. AFKing anything in Eve comes with the risk of explosion, the constant childlike whining, verbal abuse and the refrain "I just want to be left alone" or similar when they do explode is what pisses people off about them.

Quote:
Also, by this mindset, lets remove PI as a passive income, if you want to make money off PI, you have to go to each of your planets and manually send resources between nodes, no more automation, lets also get rid of moongoo, and player owned POCOs, all of them get you passive income.
The major difference between the three things you list and mining is that mining explicitly requires you to be undocked, the others do not.

Quote:
as for making mining "engaging". no, any activity that requires repetition can only be made MORE TEDIOUS or more boring, lets look at exploration, the new minigame was engaging for like, the first week, afterwards the sites and loot spew became more of a nuisance than actual "engaging" activity (also, lol at CCP wanting EVA exploration, and putting in minigames instead).
If you find an activity boring, the simple solution is not to do it. Simples.


This made me chuckle. EvE is not a PvP game. Planetside 2? That is a PvP game, because it is literally the only thing to do. EvE if what you make it. There's mining, missioning, ratting, pvp, production, PI, moon harvesting, SOV/POS bashing, and many other things. EvE is an MMO. It is what you make it. YOUR game may be all about PvP, but someone elses game may be all about mining. If that makes them happy, fine. If PvP'ing makes you happy, fine. If suicide ganking people to try to laugh at someone elses misfortune gets you off, you're a douche, but fine.

No one has the right to tell someone that their play style is wrong. We all pay for the game. We all choose to put effort into what makes the game for us. Stop complaining about how you don't like someone elses play style. Don't like AFK mining? Stay out of highsec.

I DARE someone to explain to me why they have the right to say someone elses play style is wrong. You honestly can't.
Xuixien
Solar Winds Security Solutions
#137 - 2013-12-11 22:26:22 UTC
loco coco wrote:
I DARE someone to explain to me why they have the right to say someone elses play style is wrong


Antimatter.

Epic Space Cat, Horsegirl, Philanthropist
BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#138 - 2013-12-11 22:47:08 UTC  |  Edited by: BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie
loco coco wrote:
I DARE someone to explain to me why they have the right to say someone elses play style is wrong. You honestly can't.

Where did anyone say that a play style was wrong? He just said that it was asking to be blown up. If you consider that fun then go right ahead, no one will stop you, but that doesn't change the fact that you can't complain when someone decides they want your modules. The biggest issue with afk mining is that it isn't a "play style" because there's no playing involved. In fact the entire point of it is to AVOID playing the game. AFK mining involves as much interaction as botting, but without the risk of being banned.

Founder of Violet Squadron, a small gang NPSI community! Mail me for more information.

BeBopAReBop RhubarbPie's Space Mediation Service!
Reaver Glitterstim
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#139 - 2013-12-12 01:27:03 UTC
Ganking is a good solution to AFK mining, but I think decreasing highsec yields and increasing lower sec yields is also a good solution.

FT Diomedes: "Reaver, sometimes I wonder what you are thinking when you sit down to post."

Frostys Virpio: "We have to give it to him that he does put more effort than the vast majority in his idea but damn does it sometime come out of nowhere."
Joia Crenca
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#140 - 2013-12-12 01:36:01 UTC
Casanunda wrote:
The great thing about threads like this? People putting themselves on the list of future victims of suicide ganking.



I'm guessing Voltaire isn't a member of your corp.