Player Features and Ideas Discussion

That would be step one yes.

I'm not sure, but haven't it hitted you that the dreads might be the problem here as dreads is not made to hit small ships?

Rather nerf the dreads tracking as they are made to hit big stationary objects like POS'es, stations, other capital ships and so on. So a tracking nerf wont hurt the dreads for what they are made to do.

It would be epicly bad if CCP removed 90% web bonuses from Serpentis ships just because some few dumb dreads with Tracking Computers and Tracking Enhancers can hit some smaller stuffs after they are webbed.

So again, a dread are not made to hit smaller stuffs, so nerf the tracking on those dreads while a webbing Vindicator is made to web any types of ships.

If you don't see this, it's just proves that you have a hate against the Vindicator and just want it to die rather than balancing the stuffs that are not made to hit specific stuffs.

When it comes to the Vindicators hitting some ab frigs. Well, it's made to be able to do that. You expect 2x Vindicators worth around 4-5 bill isk (with their setups included) to not hit a frig?

The tears are strong in your rage against the Vindicators. You expect frigs to be unkillable by going under someones tracking. Witch makes the whole discussion dumb.

I hope this will be my last post as everything is pointed out why the Vindicator wont lose it's web bonus.

Because if you nerf Dreadnaughts to be balanced with 90% webs the following things happen;
Dreadnaughts are horrible/unusable without 90% webs (which is stupid) requiring Serpentis Support and this has knock-on-effects, especially as ewar-immune Motherships would probably be able to speed-tank all capital weapon systems. Dreadnaughts would also have trouble vs Carriers/Other non-sieged dreads, and their ability in PVE (Wormholes) would be greatly diminished. Dreadnaughts and Capital weapon systems (Aside from the Phoenix/Citadel Torpedos) are relatively well balanced at the moment, why change all dreads/capital weapons when the problem isn't with their balance as a whole, only with the balance of 90% webs.

You seem to be making this about the Vindicator in particular, rather than 90% webs which is what the topic is about. Many people in favor of the removal of the 90% webs are more than happy for the Serpentis ship line to get power back in the form of other/additional bonuses.

I have absolutely nothing against the Vindicator, Serpentis ships and if you check my 1300+ Losses (https://zkillboard.com/character/1192491827) I'm pretty sure I've died to a Vindicator maybe 3 times total. So unfortunately your strawman arguments are invalid.

I keep hearing this and this is just not true..

Vindies are used in armor bs fleets all the freaking time =/

Lol, I just wrote an educated and informative post wich went to waste because EvE's own browser does not save their forums drafts. Now I'm depressed.
Short story:
1 - Dread blapping can be fixed by changing their weapons resolutions, other capitals sigs and tracking speed. Nerfing a different ship bonus for that is like closing a pipe leak with your finger.
2 - Vindicators niche and risky uses are justified by the difficulty to aquire one (as are the other pirate ships. The only reason the Rattlesnake is cheaper is because a lot of ships much easier to get can fulfill it's role. So fix other pirate ships, don't break the Vindicator.)
3 - Interceptors are vulnerable as **** to regular webs already, Vindicators webs do not make them unrecoverably more vulnerable.
4 - People must be allowed to do stupid things under exceptional circumstances. Things like DD'ing a pod. That does not break the game, it's part of it.
Ta da.

This. If you're getting in range of the Vindi, you lose transveral. That is the WHOLE F*CKING POINT of the Vindicator.

Even without dreads the 90% web is overpowered.

Dreads just make it massively overpowered.

It increases damage application from all sources more than any other ewar in game.



And didn't you already say that you didn't know how to manage transversal on something moving slower than you do? Why do you feel you're in a position to talk about tracking?

http://i.imgur.com/zlu5JEo.png


That is an AB-ing dramiel with max transversal being shot by both a navy mega with 4 60% webs (the red line) and a vindicator with two 90% web (the green line). Both ships are using neutron cannons with CN antimatter and no weapon mods (either damage or tracking). Both ships have exactly the same tracking. DPS is roughly equal (slightly higher on the nmega).

You see how the two 90% web are vastly more effective than near stacking limited 60% webs?

So what you said is completely wrong. Would you like to try again?

And what speed does the Dramiel have and how many webs does the Megathron have?

But it's quite stunning that you don't get the point that Vindicator's role is to slow down fast ships so everyone can hit them quite good. Serpentis ships are the ONLY ships in EVE who can do that.

Can i ask what's so wrong with that?

I would agree with you if half of the ships in EVE could do that, but as only 4 ships can do that in EVE, it's pretty funny that you think that's overpowered.


Question is, will a 82.5% web effect be any different than 90% web effect in actual PVP?