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[Rubicon 1.1] Sisters of EVE Battleship

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BeanBagKing
The Order of Atlas
#901 - 2013-12-05 19:15:43 UTC  |  Edited by: BeanBagKing
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
no the choose is when you can't sell your ship for 2bil or the BP for 1.5bil you can either lower your asking price or enjoy holding onto them. Pick. Again these BPs and ships can be bought for the same as the other pirate ships are, so those people can still low ball you lazy ass high seccers and still make good money haha

Your assumption is that I already have them and I can sell them at a loss or hold onto them. Your missing the point though, I wouldn't buy them to begin with. I would never own it or build it in the first place. There is nothing for me to sell under that value. It doesn't exist because I made a different choice.

And yes Salvatore. I'm sure there will be a few people that accident my or stupidly make a bad choice, and possibly a few will appear under market value. Economics models are simplified to account for the market as a whole, not every lose end or possible senerio, and the market as a whole will dictate a price above the value of the next best alternative. Same disclaimer goes if CCP changes the mechanics or drops or introduces something new. Which is why I would like to hear their thoughts on the price point.

Edit: also, read the second half of his post and his follow up post before you pop the champaign to celebrate your victory.
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#902 - 2013-12-05 19:18:04 UTC
Salvatore...
Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#903 - 2013-12-05 19:23:04 UTC
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
Since it's so popular to write up complete proposed stat lists, I thought I'd try it too. Underlined are changes from Rise's original post.

Quote:
NESTOR

Amarr Battleship Bonuses:
4% Armor resistances per level

Gallente Battleship Bonuses:
10% drone damage and hitpoints per level

Role bonuses:
50% bonus to Armor Maintenance Bot Repair Amount
-100% Scan Resolution Penalty for Cloaking Devices
50% bonus to large energy turret optimal range
50% increased strength for scan probes
+10 virus strength for relic and data analyzers

Slot layout: 7H, 6M, 6L; 5 turrets, 0 launchers
Fittings: 11250 PWG, 690 CPU
Defense (shields / armor / hull): 8900 / 9950 / 9900
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap/s) : 6200 / 1044 / 5.9
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 92 / .18 / 56000000 / 13.97
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 125 / 500
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 75km / 85 / 7
Sensor strength: 24 Magnetometric
Signature radius: 465
Cargo Capacity: 700


Thoughts?

By the way, you can fit a full rack of lasers into that amount of powergrid if you use Dual Heavy Beam IIs or Dual Heavy Pulse IIs.

Wow, I really like this idea! The only thing I'd add would be to up the virus strength bonus to +15.

And being able to target while cloaked? That'd be pretty amazingBig smile

"A City made of Dreams is built in heaven"
Herpp Derpp
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#904 - 2013-12-05 19:24:38 UTC
Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci wrote:
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
Since it's so popular to write up complete proposed stat lists, I thought I'd try it too. Underlined are changes from Rise's original post.

Quote:
NESTOR

Amarr Battleship Bonuses:
4% Armor resistances per level

Gallente Battleship Bonuses:
10% drone damage and hitpoints per level

Role bonuses:
50% bonus to Armor Maintenance Bot Repair Amount
-100% Scan Resolution Penalty for Cloaking Devices
50% bonus to large energy turret optimal range
50% increased strength for scan probes
+10 virus strength for relic and data analyzers

Slot layout: 7H, 6M, 6L; 5 turrets, 0 launchers
Fittings: 11250 PWG, 690 CPU
Defense (shields / armor / hull): 8900 / 9950 / 9900
Capacitor (amount / recharge rate / cap/s) : 6200 / 1044 / 5.9
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 92 / .18 / 56000000 / 13.97
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 125 / 500
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 75km / 85 / 7
Sensor strength: 24 Magnetometric
Signature radius: 465
Cargo Capacity: 700


Thoughts?

By the way, you can fit a full rack of lasers into that amount of powergrid if you use Dual Heavy Beam IIs or Dual Heavy Pulse IIs.

Wow, I really like this idea! The only thing I'd add would be to up the virus strength bonus to +15.

And being able to target while cloaked? That'd be pretty amazingBig smile


Can it shoot while cloaked too?
Thaddeus Eggeras
Urkrathos Corp
#905 - 2013-12-05 19:24:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Thaddeus Eggeras
The thing you are ALL missing is that you can get the BPs and Ship for the same price and LP as the rest of the pirate faction ships. Just do missions for Sanc. So the people that do those missions can set their prices much lower then those doing missions in high sec. Those people will make a ton by doing this also, IF they do it right.
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#906 - 2013-12-05 19:26:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Alvatore DiMarco
Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci wrote:
And being able to target while cloaked? That'd be pretty amazingBig smile


Err, no. I think you misunderstand. Cloaking devices impose a penalty on your scan resolution just by having them fitted. The idea is to remove that penalty so that you can fit a cloak and still target normally (scan recalibration delay notwithstanding).

I felt it needed something to benefit cloak usage, even if most of the other options weren't viable or balanced.

Herpp Derpp wrote:
Can it shoot while cloaked too?

No, that would be completely stupid. Not understanding module properties is bad and you should feel bad.
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#907 - 2013-12-05 19:28:26 UTC
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
The thing you are ALL missing is that you can get the BPs and Ship for the same prive and LP as the rest of the pirate faction ships. Just do missions for Sanc. So the people that do thosem issions can set their prices much lower then those of do missions in high sec. Those people will make a ton by doing this also, IF they do it right.


The thing you are missing is that Sanctuary exists deep inside CFC space. Do you really think you're going to be running Sanctuary missions without paying fees to CFC for the privilege? That is, of course, assuming they even let you (odds are they won't) and don't also gank you when you try to leave their space with the BPC.
Elfi Wolfe
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#908 - 2013-12-05 19:28:48 UTC
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
The thing you are ALL missing is that you can get the BPs and Ship for the same prive and LP as the rest of the pirate faction ships. Just do missions for Sanc. So the people that do thosem issions can set their prices much lower then those of do missions in high sec. Those people will make a ton by doing this also, IF they do it right.



I think they are saying that other pirate BPC can be farmed from a combat site, where as the SoE does not have that additional source. The extra pirate BPC puts a downward pressure on the other pirate BPC.

"Please point to the place on the doll where the carebear touched you."
Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci
Itsukame-Zainou Hyperspatial Inquiries Ltd.
Arataka Research Consortium
#909 - 2013-12-05 19:30:02 UTC
Alvatore DiMarco wrote:
Uriel Paradisi Anteovnuecci wrote:
And being able to target while cloaked? That'd be pretty amazingBig smile


Err, no. I think you misunderstand. Cloaking devices impose a penalty on your scan resolution just by having them fitted. The idea is to remove that penalty so that you can fit a cloak and still target normally (scan recalibration delay notwithstanding).

I felt it needed something to benefit cloak usage, even if most of the other options weren't viable or balanced.

Oh, I see- I made a mistake. Whoops, I guess.

I cannot wait to fly this ship, regardless of what it does- I love how it looks Big smile

"A City made of Dreams is built in heaven"
Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
Republic Military Tax Avoiders
#910 - 2013-12-05 19:30:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Kirimeena D'Zbrkesbris
CCP Rise wrote:
NESTOR

Amarr Battleship Bonuses:
4% Armor resistances per level

Gallente Battleship Bonuses:
10% drone damage and hitpoints per level

Role bonuses:
50% bonus to remote armor repairer amount
100% bonus to remote armor repairer range
50% bonus to large energy turret optimal range
50% increased strength for scan probes
+10 virus strength for relic and data analyzers

Bolded part is becoming ridiculous. Why cant you just remove optimal bonus for lasers (useless anyway) and double base range for all remote shield/capacitor transferers and armor/hull repairers and halve related bonuses on all logi ships (including caps and supers)? This will also liven up T3 logi subs a bit.

Opinions are like assholes. Everybody got one and everyone thinks everyone else's stinks.
Thaddeus Eggeras
Urkrathos Corp
#911 - 2013-12-05 19:32:45 UTC
Do you really think CFC won't do them and sell the BP and ship, and won't allow their alts and etc to do them and under price you?

And i already said they should have Sanc missions drop BPs and/or maybe other sites sometimes too
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#912 - 2013-12-05 19:34:39 UTC
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
Do you really think CFC won't do them and sell the BP and ship, and won't allow their alts and etc to do them and under price you?

And i already said they should have Sanc missions drop BPs and/or maybe other sites sometimes too


Why would they underprice anyone when they can just sell them at whatever price is fashionable in Empire? If prices drop too low they can just buy up the low-priced ones and mark them up. Or keep them inside the coalition and create some strange "look how disgustingly rich we are" doctrine out of them.
BeanBagKing
The Order of Atlas
#913 - 2013-12-05 19:35:58 UTC
Elfi Wolfe wrote:
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
The thing you are ALL missing is that you can get the BPs and Ship for the same prive and LP as the rest of the pirate faction ships. Just do missions for Sanc. So the people that do thosem issions can set their prices much lower then those of do missions in high sec. Those people will make a ton by doing this also, IF they do it right.



I think they are saying that other pirate BPC can be farmed from a combat site, where as the SoE does not have that additional source. The extra pirate BPC puts a downward pressure on the other pirate BPC.

This, and the deep in null thing. You are making the assumption that the source is the same as other pirate battleships. It is not, there is no downward pressure.

Also, sorry alvatore, on the cell. Autocorrect. Please accept my sincerest apologies.
Thaddeus Eggeras
Urkrathos Corp
#914 - 2013-12-05 19:37:08 UTC
CCP please give Sanc more places to do their missions, also through in BP here and there in their missions and maybe in systems they are loc in so people can stop whining and I can be bored again. Thank you CCP
Arrendis
TK Corp
#915 - 2013-12-05 19:41:25 UTC
Koban Agalder wrote:
@CCP Rise

If you want to make it "logistic" ship and trying to be unique why not give big bonuses for use of LOGISTIC DRONES (bigger than traditional logi gets)? This way it's unique, it doesn't interefere directly with existing logistics and keep repping power. If it want to gank someone it launches garde/ogres. If it want to save someone it launches logistic drones (shield or armor). Imho it would go well with humanitarian aspect os SOE so ships can save and defend itself.

This way it might, MIGHT, MIGHT be possible to allow it to launch up to 10 medium drones (but this idea is very risky and need deep consideration). ( BIG NO to 10 big drones)

Regards!


The problem with putting the bonuses on logi drones is delivery time. Not only do the reps have to cycle, but the drones have to reposition. That's not a big deal if everyone's huddled up, but if people are moving around, it can be significant. Going that route would likely render the Nestor significantly less useful than most logistics cruisers in a large number of situations.
Alvatore DiMarco
Capricious Endeavours Ltd
#916 - 2013-12-05 19:53:06 UTC
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
CCP please give Sanc more places to do their missions, also through in BP here and there in their missions and maybe in systems they are loc in so people can stop whining and I can be bored again. Thank you CCP


Are there Sansha agents in Cobalt Edge? Angel Cartel agents in Delve? Blood Raider agents in Fountain? Guristas agents in Etherium Reach?
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#917 - 2013-12-05 19:54:18 UTC
I would like to explore more around mobility and its low mass.
Thaddeus Eggeras
Urkrathos Corp
#918 - 2013-12-05 20:10:39 UTC
Hmm SoE and Sanc that work for them aren't REAL pirates I'm pretty sure they can set up shop anywhere they please. I do in highsec, so doubt it be an issue anywhere else. Hmmmmm
Hatsumi Kobayashi
Perkone
Caldari State
#919 - 2013-12-05 20:14:35 UTC
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
Do you really think CFC won't do them and sell the BP and ship, and won't allow their alts and etc to do them and under price you?

And i already said they should have Sanc missions drop BPs and/or maybe other sites sometimes too


grr goon

No sig.
GeeShizzle MacCloud
#920 - 2013-12-05 20:15:41 UTC
Arrendis wrote:
Koban Agalder wrote:
@CCP Rise

If you want to make it "logistic" ship and trying to be unique why not give big bonuses for use of LOGISTIC DRONES (bigger than traditional logi gets)? This way it's unique, it doesn't interefere directly with existing logistics and keep repping power. If it want to gank someone it launches garde/ogres. If it want to save someone it launches logistic drones (shield or armor). Imho it would go well with humanitarian aspect os SOE so ships can save and defend itself.

This way it might, MIGHT, MIGHT be possible to allow it to launch up to 10 medium drones (but this idea is very risky and need deep consideration). ( BIG NO to 10 big drones)

Regards!


The problem with putting the bonuses on logi drones is delivery time. Not only do the reps have to cycle, but the drones have to reposition. That's not a big deal if everyone's huddled up, but if people are moving around, it can be significant. Going that route would likely render the Nestor significantly less useful than most logistics cruisers in a large number of situations.


where this logic breaks down is when a logi fc or pair (or possibly boosting wing commanders) flies brick tanked t3s with many sebos and all the Nestors assign logi drones to them meaning logi repping is much faster, plus having a bonus to optimal range and mwd speed aids in reps landing quick. Alongside being able to use a mix of logi drone sizes and therefore applying quick small repping to keep the primaried ship alive before the larger reps land.

it obviously will not replace dedicated logi cruisers, but it provides a different form and puts the mechanic in a ship that has considerably high ehp alongside some offensive capabilities.