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CCP and killmails.. Specialized Bays marked as (Other)
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Karbowiak
State War Academy
Caldari State
#1 - 2013-12-03 16:53:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Karbowiak
Hi all!

Starting about two weeks ago, CCP decided to add (Other) to items located in Specialized Bays, and on old killmails they've decided that any module NOT in Drone Bay or Cargo, be marked as (Other) aswell.
It even goes so far as to do it on the new DUST mails. Which in the API is marked as being in the Corporate Hangar, believe it or not.

For years now, we've had to make assumptions in the parser about module placements, and these new changes makes it even harder. Who is to say that module X doesn't go into hangar Y instead of hangar Z?

Simply, we can't say where any modules are going. We can only guess.

But to make this not just a whine post, here's a suggestion for a new format, which is more verbose, and is an output that zKB (and PL) is using.
CCP even used it for a day or so, because of an error in the killmail output, when they updated the way to view mails.

Example:
Quote:

2013-12-03 12:54:00

Victim: Xazier
Corp: e X i l e
Alliance: The Initiative.
Faction: None
Destroyed: Redeemer
System: GA9P-0
Security: -0.0
Damage Taken: 28842

Involved parties:

Name: Ayako Takagaki (laid the final blow)
Security: 0.0209429634605411
Corp: Pulsar Raiders
Alliance: None
Faction: Amarr Empire
Ship: Gnosis
Weapon: Gnosis
Damage Done: 3614

Name: Acranoo
Security: 4.7
Corp: Pulsar Raiders
Alliance: None
Faction: Amarr Empire
Ship: Hyperion
Weapon: Hyperion
Damage Done: 10897

Name: arthurpp shen
Security: 4.9
Corp: Pulsar Raiders
Alliance: None
Faction: Amarr Empire
Ship: Harbinger
Weapon: Harbinger
Damage Done: 5582

Name: Marrek Sazas
Security: 4.9
Corp: Pulsar Raiders
Alliance: None
Faction: Amarr Empire
Ship: Harbinger
Weapon: Harbinger
Damage Done: 4292

Name: Eris Slavis
Security: 0.3
Corp: Pulsar Raiders
Alliance: None
Faction: Amarr Empire
Ship: Vexor Navy Issue
Weapon: Vexor Navy Issue
Damage Done: 2317

Name: Lln Agnon
Security: 4.8
Corp: Pulsar Raiders
Alliance: None
Faction: Amarr Empire
Ship: Vexor
Weapon: Vexor
Damage Done: 1256

Name: DeadlyStormZ
Security: 5
Corp: Pulsar Raiders
Alliance: None
Faction: Amarr Empire
Ship: Armageddon
Weapon: Armageddon
Damage Done: 680

Name: LightningStormZ
Security: 4
Corp: Pulsar Raiders
Alliance: None
Faction: Amarr Empire
Ship: Arazu
Weapon: Arazu
Damage Done: 204


Destroyed items:

Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II, Qty: 1 (Low power slot 5)
Cap Booster 800, Qty: 12 (Cargo)
Faint Warp Disruptor I, Qty: 1 (Medium power slot 2)
Imperial Navy Multifrequency L, Qty: 1 (High power slot 1)
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I, Qty: 1 (Low power slot 7)
Damage Control II, Qty: 1 (Low power slot 1)
Dual Heavy Pulse Laser II, Qty: 1 (High power slot 4)
Dual Heavy Pulse Laser II, Qty: 1 (High power slot 3)
Dual Heavy Pulse Laser II, Qty: 1 (High power slot 6)
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I, Qty: 1 (Rig power slot 1)
X5 Prototype Engine Enervator, Qty: 1 (Medium power slot 3)
Large Capacitor Control Circuit I, Qty: 1 (Rig power slot 2)
Imperial Navy Multifrequency L, Qty: 1 (High power slot 3)

Dropped items:

Cap Booster 800, Qty: 3 (Cargo)
Heat Sink II, Qty: 1 (Low power slot 4)
Large Micro Jump Drive, Qty: 1 (Medium power slot 1)
Imperial Navy Multifrequency L, Qty: 1 (High power slot 2)
Imperial Navy Multifrequency L, Qty: 1 (High power slot 5)
Improved Cloaking Device II, Qty: 1 (High power slot 7)
Cap Booster 800, Qty: 1 (Medium power slot 4)
Mega Pulse Laser II, Qty: 1 (High power slot 1)
Dual Heavy Pulse Laser II, Qty: 1 (High power slot 2)
Imperial Navy Multifrequency L, Qty: 1 (High power slot 4)
Heat Sink II, Qty: 1 (Low power slot 3)
Medium Electrochemical Capacitor Booster I, Qty: 1 (Medium power slot 4)
Imperial Navy Multifrequency L, Qty: 1 (High power slot 6)
Energized Adaptive Nano Membrane II, Qty: 1 (Low power slot 6)
Dual Heavy Pulse Laser II, Qty: 1 (High power slot 5)
1600mm Reinforced Rolled Tungsten Plates I, Qty: 1 (Low power slot 2)
Helium Isotopes, Qty: 1452 (Specialized Fuel Bay)


As you can see, all the modules are given their appropriate place on this Redeemer, even the fuel..

So please, CCP, adopt this format, instead of using (Other)
Squizz Caphinator
The Wormhole Police
#2 - 2013-12-03 17:29:23 UTC
Do you want killmails that accurately portray what was destroyed? Support this post!

Various projects I enjoy putting my free time into:

https://zkillboard.com | https://evewho.com
Vitra Andeldur
State Protectorate
Caldari State
#3 - 2013-12-03 17:44:57 UTC
+1
Abdiel Kavash
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2013-12-03 19:04:40 UTC
I'm not an expert, but does it really matter on a killmail whether the PLEX that got blown up was in the cargo hold, corp hangar, or in the fuel bay of a ship in a SMA? It's still a PLEX lost. Unless there's something I'm not seeing here...
Karbowiak
State War Academy
Caldari State
#5 - 2013-12-03 19:28:05 UTC
Abdiel Kavash wrote:
I'm not an expert, but does it really matter on a killmail whether the PLEX that got blown up was in the cargo hold, corp hangar, or in the fuel bay of a ship in a SMA? It's still a PLEX lost. Unless there's something I'm not seeing here...


a PLEX can't bein the fuel bay, but it could be in cargo or corp hangar.. It could also be fitted as the primary weapon, or as a pretend shield booster.. We have no way of knowing it, we have to guess Sad
Sable Blitzmann
24th Imperial Crusade
Amarr Empire
#6 - 2013-12-03 19:32:20 UTC
Karbowiak wrote:
Abdiel Kavash wrote:
I'm not an expert, but does it really matter on a killmail whether the PLEX that got blown up was in the cargo hold, corp hangar, or in the fuel bay of a ship in a SMA? It's still a PLEX lost. Unless there's something I'm not seeing here...


a PLEX can't bein the fuel bay, but it could be in cargo or corp hangar.. It could also be fitted as the primary weapon, or as a pretend shield booster.. We have no way of knowing it, we have to guess Sad


I think what he's saying is just stick it in the cargo if you don't know what to do with it. Doesnt' really matter - the only thing people care about in killmails is how much ISK was blown up, as long as all items are accounted for it doesn't matter where it goes.

However, it would be nice for CCP to provide this kind of data just out of sheer accuracy and common sense.
Salvoxia
Free Carpenters Union
#7 - 2013-12-05 07:56:36 UTC
I very much +1 this!
Karbowiak
State War Academy
Caldari State
#8 - 2013-12-12 11:00:33 UTC
Edited the post to be less ragefilled, and edited the topic, since zKB shouldn't be mentioned in relation to this.
suid0
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#9 - 2013-12-12 11:25:03 UTC
+1

logical change

the entire enemy support fleet is dead except for one interdictor a titan could easily finish off with drones  - Commander Ted
imbaRabbit
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#10 - 2013-12-12 17:19:59 UTC
I've liked the idea because it seems to be OK one ... But may I ask why do you even parse logs in this format? I've just done a query to the KillLog.xml.aspx and I've gotten XML format which contains all the information you need?

If you go in-game and copy the kill information, you'll get the undesired format (something like this):
Quote:

Destroyed items:

Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II (Cargo)
Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L, Qty: 4680 (Cargo)
Hobgoblin II, Qty: 10 (Drone Bay)
Cap Recharger II
Armor EM Hardener II, Qty: 2 (Cargo)
Cap Recharger II
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
Large Semiconductor Memory Cell I
Optical Tracking Computer I
...

Dropped items:

Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L, Qty: 40
Tracking Speed Script (Cargo)
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L, Qty: 40
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L, Qty: 40
...


But if you fetch the kills over the API, you'll get the format which tells you everything what you need to know:

Quote:

rowset name="items" columns="typeID,flag,qtyDropped,qtyDestroyed,singleton"
row typeID="23009" flag="31" qtyDropped="9" qtyDestroyed="0" singleton="0"/
row typeID="23009" flag="32" qtyDropped="9" qtyDestroyed="0" singleton="0"/
row typeID="564" flag="30" qtyDropped="0" qtyDestroyed="1" singleton="0"/
row typeID="9944" flag="13" qtyDropped="0" qtyDestroyed="1" singleton="0"/
...


Once when you fetch the data from the API, you can parse it and then output it in any format you want in case it's easier/lighter process than the XML parsing. The flag attribute tells you where the item was situated. So, I'm curious to know why do you need the format from the game?
Karbowiak
State War Academy
Caldari State
#11 - 2013-12-12 22:49:03 UTC
imbaRabbit wrote:
I've liked the idea because it seems to be OK one ... But may I ask why do you even parse logs in this format? I've just done a query to the KillLog.xml.aspx and I've gotten XML format which contains all the information you need?

If you go in-game and copy the kill information, you'll get the undesired format (something like this):
Quote:

Destroyed items:

Large Auxiliary Nano Pump I
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Thermic Hardener II (Cargo)
Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L, Qty: 4680 (Cargo)
Hobgoblin II, Qty: 10 (Drone Bay)
Cap Recharger II
Armor EM Hardener II, Qty: 2 (Cargo)
Cap Recharger II
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
Large Semiconductor Memory Cell I
Optical Tracking Computer I
...

Dropped items:

Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L, Qty: 40
Tracking Speed Script (Cargo)
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L, Qty: 40
425mm Prototype Gauss Gun
Caldari Navy Thorium Charge L, Qty: 40
...


But if you fetch the kills over the API, you'll get the format which tells you everything what you need to know:

Quote:

rowset name="items" columns="typeID,flag,qtyDropped,qtyDestroyed,singleton"
row typeID="23009" flag="31" qtyDropped="9" qtyDestroyed="0" singleton="0"/
row typeID="23009" flag="32" qtyDropped="9" qtyDestroyed="0" singleton="0"/
row typeID="564" flag="30" qtyDropped="0" qtyDestroyed="1" singleton="0"/
row typeID="9944" flag="13" qtyDropped="0" qtyDestroyed="1" singleton="0"/
...


Once when you fetch the data from the API, you can parse it and then output it in any format you want in case it's easier/lighter process than the XML parsing. The flag attribute tells you where the item was situated. So, I'm curious to know why do you need the format from the game?



We dont NEED the format from ingame, but getting everyone to give us their API keys is also hard.
Plus people want instant gratification, hence the manual mails :)