Player Features and Ideas Discussion

Well, I tested out the new warp mechanics using the DST.. and the results are certainly not favorable to it. Considering that it has a generic cargo hold that must be improved with cargo expanders, it took a VERY long time to align and warp. It's warp speed was around Tech 2 cruiser standard, which means that interceptors and interdictors could easily catch up to it.

The DST is plenty viable for nullsec, its just not viable to run around unscouted or where there's poor intel. IMO this is fine, and doesn't merit any major changes. Other than that, improvements to agility, capacitor, or whatever, are all fine.

Like the idea on the grounds that the bubble immunity comes at the cost of the warp core strength.

If you want immunity to points as well then you sacrifice cargo space.

+1 to nullified DST. Gives it a unique niche compared to BRs and a reason to actually possibly use one once in a while.

I think we're quite a few years away from seeing a T3 Hauler, though I think that it isn't a bad idea. Personally, I'd like to see something like these configurations with the following Subsystems:

Defensive Subsystems: Passive Tank:Shield/Armor Resists, Active Tank: Shield/Armor Repair, Passive Tank: Shield?Armor EHP (reduces high slots, adds necessary Lows/mediums depending on Race)

Offensive Subsystems: Drone Control (Reduction of Turrets/Missile bays, increase in Bandwidth and Drone bay), Turret/Missile Offensive (Increase in turret/missile bays, reduction in lows), Cloaking (Reduction of High and low-slots and tank)

Cargo Subsystem: Cargo Generality (Increase in lows, decrease in resists/EHP), Cargo Mineral Specific (Decrease in lows) Cargo Ore Specific (Decrease in lows), etc.

Propulsion Subsystem: Warp Speed (Decrease in mid/low slots), Nullifier (Decrease in agility, warp speed, and EHP), Standard Speed (increase in agility, base speed but decrease in warp speed and midslots). Micro Jump Drive Enhancement (increase of agility, reduction of MJD timer).

Electronics Subsystems: Increase in CPU subsystem, Increase in PG subsystem, Racial E-War subsystem, Reduction in Sig Radius subsystem

But, I doubt they'll look at making a T3 Indy for a long time, if ever. So, in the meantime gotta try and give the DST some love so that it actually gets used.

Doesn't matter how big your tank is simply because gate camps, the DST's primary foe, will often have points on multiple ships. And with how slow the ship accelerates into warp (which gets even worse in Rubicon, btw) a DST simply has no chance against a gate camp with more than one ship (and even one ship would be enough to take it down if it is fitted with a scram).

The above reason is also why I don't think having the DST get a nullifier bonus is viable as the ship is already too slow and ungainly to avoid any local ships that would typically be around a bubble.

Here are the options I still think are somewhat viable:

1. Jump Capable - Initially I had a huge amount of cargo space, but now I think around 30,000m3 to 50,000m3 would be best. I think this is the most ideal solution for the DST because it would allow for smaller and more pilot independent operations to take place in deep null-sec without the huge and dangerous expense of the Jump Freighter. I still think that a jump freighter should be more efficient at making the jumps however.

2. Nullifier + MJD - The more I play around with the MJD the more I think it just might work.. but CCP would have to give the MJD a spool up timer bonus like they have given the Marauders. This is also presuming that Scrams won't turn off the MJD.

3. Tank/Combat - While I "like" this one, I also believe it is the least likely to work. Personally, I think it should have a T2 battlecruiser class tank along with bonuses to tracking, ROF, and range for small guns. Essentially making it deadly for interceptors and the like.

I think two things need to be addressed here:

The first is that the Cloak/MWD trick, will at best, save it from a single small gate gang. However, the DST's agility is so poor that it will likely be uncloaked long before it could be aligned to escape. Even if you did decide to add additional warp stabs, you are stuck in a situation where it will never escape a bubble camp, and warp stabs would decrease its overall carrying capacity. An additional wrinkle comes with the Rubicon expansion as interceptors easily out warp the DST and can repeatedly try and tackle it again and again.

The second thing is that we are trying to make the DST a viable option. It doesn't have to be good at everything, but it does need to be the ideal choice for some tasks at least. Right now, Tech 1 Industrials carry more, can have a better tank, can be much better armed, and have better warp strength to boot. Plus, Tech 1 industrials cost between 1/100th and 1/90th the price of a DST and can be built easily and quickly by just about anyone, anywhere. Blockade Runners, with their Covert Ops cloak, small size and signature, and soon to be added greater warp speed make it the logical choice for transporting small amounts of cargo through low- and null-sec. Larger cargos are better moved by Jump Freighters that, while are very expensive and require additional support, can safely get their cargo to their destination with little interference.

Simply put, no one in their right might would choose to use a DST for ANY hauling activities, and that simply should not be the case. Whenever the DST gets looked at, the result should make the DST have some jobs or tasks that makes it the defacto choice for its use.

Hmm.. I was really hoping to get some sort of answer from a Dev about this by now. Even if it was little more than "soon(tm)". That being said, I may try to test a few DST fits out and log my results. Anyone have some Mastodons they wanna sell for cheap?

Ok. It's been awhile. Maybe some plans can be made up for the next big-ish update since Rubicon is passed now.

Lose the warp core stabilizers and they become useless in low sec or during war decs in high sec. So you basically trade off increased usefulness in null for decreased usefulness everywhere else. Seems rather pointless to me, like taking one step forward and one step back.