EVE General Discussion

You read my post, you even clicked like on it, and then you say this? The point of my own post was expressly that the wording doesn't matter, because they could be doing the exact same thing with different wording. Marmite have never been good with words, Tora in particular likes to mince them and add the alliance's killboard at the end of mails for some reason as if it's meant to scare people.... and sometimes I guess it does, but I digress. The point is, even with the wording they chose, they're not doing anything wrong and they're not forcing you to do anything you don't want to do yourself.

All players have been warned about exactly this in the Dev blog.



So you see, if they are doing this, and they are keeping it for themselves, then they are doing something wrong, and CCP will step in. If they are actually doing what they claim they are, then it is not a scam, and CCP have no reason to step in.

It's amazing that it took six pages to get here. So long as they keep accurate records detailing the exact number of PLEX received, and that all of those PLEX go to PFG then there is no issue. Any other actions, such as attempting to flip the PLEX in order to make a profit(even if the flipped PLEX are still donated), keeping any PLEX for "operating costs" or any other excuse to profit is unacceptable. Since at least one member of the Marmite Collective has commented confirming that they are taking PLEX which they then plan to donate, I'm sure they'll be willing to provide proof that any such transactions are above board. After all, it's for a good cause and nobody wants harm to come to said cause.

I hope they do for their own sake as they will be permabanned otherwise. That is not in question. What amazes me is seeing you advocating stealing from a real charity because 'Its a game, lolz, htfu'. It takes a special type of person to think that's ok.

Personally I just dislike seeing the word "bullied" being thrown about so casually in this context. This is a PVP game at heart, and Marmite using game mechanics to try to accomplish something good out of the deal is neither bullying nor is it a bad thing. Sure, you may not like it if you're on the receiving end of the stick, but were it "bullying" then it would be personal. Application of force to achieve goals, personal, corporate, industrial, financial, or political is a day to day commodity in this game. Don't muddy the waters by trying to tie a controversial social ill into the actions of pvp'ers doing pvp things. You don't like it? Don't pay. Otherwise, pay up and know that through your inglorious defeat in internet starship land you may have just actually helped to do a good thing in the real world... remind me again how that is a bad thing?

I broadly agree with what you are saying but think things are a little more complex in this particular limited circumstance. The problem is that this kind of action is not one that takes place entirely within the magic circle of the game because it turns on forcing someone to act in a way that is a) motivated by out of game considerations, and b) deliberately has an out of game effect. Because these ingame actions interface with the real world outside the game in this special case there is, I think, quite a strong case to be made that the special rules that apply within the magic circle have to be moderated to take account of the interaction with the real world outside the game.

It is a difficult question for the rather underdeveloped field of virtual ethics but there does seem to me to be a genuinely tricky issue here caused by the blurring of boundaries. In such a case I would be inclined to play it safe and to avoid any direct link between ingame coercion and donations to the RC both because there are difficult ethical questions around the issue and because even the perception of ethical difficulties could harm the image of the Plex drive in the minds of some players. Since there really seems to be no upside for the charity that comes from taking this approach (as ransoms can just be taken as normal and then donated to PFG without bringing it up in the exchange with the victim) and there might be a number of negative impacts, it seems best to err on the side of caution.

OP there is a solution to your problem, leave highsec. I hear there is a damn good rental program going on in the north.

All those that have been war dec'd should coordinate together and teach the aggressor what happens when you over extend yourself?

I applaud Marmite's generosity.

The OP needs to remember that Marmite would be wardeccing people for profit anyway. It is kind of their thing. They have just chosen to forego some of their isk profit to help the good people of the Phillipines in their time of need. Nobody is forcing you to pay. In the case that you have some sort of ideological objection to helping Filipinos, you can feel free not to donate and enjoy the war for what it is (you racist ****).

I can understand the argument that some charities have a reputation for misusing some part of their funds. This is undeniably true. Still, when people are in need, if some part of your donation gets to the people who need it, that is better than nothing. If you prefer a different organization, feel free to donate out-of-game (just don't expect marmite to drop the war).

Actually, OP is just upset that marmite is making him feel bad for not paying the ransom. Using out-of-game events to make people feel guilty or uncomfortable in game is just going too far, damnit! (saracsm)