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Crime & Punishment

 
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RvB - Goons / Poco's
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Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#61 - 2013-11-22 13:30:36 UTC
Gary Bell wrote:
Im Confused..

Why do people think that there is no money in owning the most used highsec pocos?

You do understand that 2Mil isk a use times 4000 people using it is isk right.. And tbh I think you guys have forgotten about Miniluv who lives in highsec and would love to gank you while you try to kill a poco..

The isk is there in droves.. I dont understand why everyone fails to see that?

Esp sense goons did the right thing and set a low tax rate so the average bear is not bothered by them owning the poco and goes about there business flushing the wallets of goons with isk for the masses...

Is baffled by the highsec pvp mindset..

Do some PI for five minutes, each one of you then tell me there not making isk

Oh and

GRRR GGOONNNSSS
Not really sure where you get your math from, but it's broken. Most POCOs will be worth almost nothing. I've seen some of the stats coming off of them already, and they are very low income.
To be honest, it's no surprise. For starters, there's so many people that simply don't do PI in high sec. Then once you have just your high sec PI guys, you have to consider how many high sec planets there are. when you divide it down, you realise that the population per planet is less than great, so in order to capture the tax of everyone, you'd need to own trillions in pocos.
Then consider that 5% tax will net you less than half of what high sec players used to pay in tax.

Honestly, I really doubt that more than a handful of systems are worth owning.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Gary Bell
Therapy.
Brave Collective
#62 - 2013-11-22 15:14:34 UTC
Idk where you get your math but spending say a billion isk to put down 1000 pocos that make 2 mil isk a day..

1- A billion isk is nothing to goons..
2- 2 mil isk a day times what 1k pocos..

Not to mention it is a nearly perfect investment as nobody is gonna shoot them or at least say 98 percent of them. Why not do it? Its an isk waterfall for goons..

It may not be pushing heavy numbers now but when it is all said and done and things settle down.. with there tax rates they will loose worst case 2 or 3 a month.. And why fight em? let em kill it then take it right back.. Its much easier for goons to come pop it then any little highsec merc corp.. And for what its gonna cost to dec goons no one else is gonna do it more then once.

So yeah they may take a while to build isk back but in the end the isk will always be flowing regardless of any wars in null.. Not to mention as there empire grows they will have the ability to change PI prices as they see fit?

How can you say the isk isnt there..

Not to mention a Niagra Falls of tears with the click of a mouse lol
0mez
Doomheim
#63 - 2013-11-22 15:18:26 UTC
I had fun reading some of the thread, some good points raised. I think the only real viable corp to keep High Sec poco's is going to be RvB just because they are massive. Plus people don't think that older people join RvB when they clearly do (their not just a frigate corp in other operations). It's a great thing actually for people to learn about other aspects of PvP in RvB.

If Goons can get enough people with relevant standings for the areas they could hold them too I guess, but a lot of Goons don't have good standings or security ratings for High Sec defending. Will be interesting to see what kind of profits are made and who is holding the poco's at say Xmas time tho. :)
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#64 - 2013-11-22 16:35:49 UTC
Gary Bell wrote:
Idk where you get your math but spending say a billion isk to put down 1000 pocos that make 2 mil isk a day..

1- A billion isk is nothing to goons..
2- 2 mil isk a day times what 1k pocos..
Wait, sorry, where did I get my math?
So a billion isk gets you 1000 pocos does it? Where are you getting a poco + the upgrade materials (24 P4 materials) for 1m isk?

1 billion isk would get you 10 pocos at the best of prices. So to get 1000 pocos you'd need at least 100b isk. Even then , that would be less that 4% coverage of the high sec pocos.

Gary Bell wrote:
Not to mention it is a nearly perfect investment as nobody is gonna shoot them or at least say 98 percent of them. Why not do it? Its an isk waterfall for goons..
So you are saying nobody ever shoots at goons? I'm pretty sure goons are under constant wardecs.

Gary Bell wrote:
It may not be pushing heavy numbers now but when it is all said and done and things settle down.. with there tax rates they will loose worst case 2 or 3 a month.. And why fight em? let em kill it then take it right back.. Its much easier for goons to come pop it then any little highsec merc corp.. And for what its gonna cost to dec goons no one else is gonna do it more then once.

So yeah they may take a while to build isk back but in the end the isk will always be flowing regardless of any wars in null.. Not to mention as there empire grows they will have the ability to change PI prices as they see fit?
Some places are pushing no numbers at all. From what I've seen, 2m in a day is doable, right next to a trade hub, on a factory planet. From outside of that handful of planets there's really not much use. The weekend will really tell the story though.
And sure, they'll break even eventually. But will it be worth the time and effort invested?

Really though, PI is a pain in the ass to deal with. The interface is clunky, it takes billions of clicks to do anything, and you end up having to haul back and forth to do anything serious. For the amount of time and effort it takes for the payout in high sec, a lot of people really don't bother. You'd be better of doing an extra mission or two in that time. So there really isn;t all that big a payout. I would be interested to see how much RVB or goons have made.

Gary Bell wrote:
How can you say the isk isnt there..
Easily. I'm awake, unlike some it seems.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Mysticus Maliotide
Suddenly Asteroids
#65 - 2013-11-22 17:05:20 UTC
Money is made in the markets, not PI.

If there is an actual monetary incentive (which I doubt, knowing goons), it's the stockpiles they inevitably have of low-end PI materials which will spike when they start taking out POCOs around trade hubs.
Victor Dathar
Lowlife.
Snuffed Out
#66 - 2013-11-22 18:31:17 UTC
We are clearly not doing this for the isk. The same guys who brought you OTEC, blowing up random crap for FW LP and Ice Interdiction were not involved.

In the case of Ice Interdiction no money was made anyway it was a complete failure and a waste of time.

^^^ lol that post is so bad you should get back 2 GBS m8 o7

@grr_goons : Wisdom, Insight, GBS Posts
VegasMirage
Blank-Space
Northern Coalition.
#67 - 2013-11-22 19:18:19 UTC
Victor Dathar wrote:
We are clearly not doing this for the isk. The same guys who brought you OTEC, blowing up random crap for FW LP and Ice Interdiction were not involved.

In the case of Ice Interdiction no money was made anyway it was a complete failure and a waste of time.


other people's pain

no more games... it's real this time!!!
Soldarius
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#68 - 2013-11-22 19:26:16 UTC
Tora Bushido wrote:
I think the last long war with Goons we killed 150B of your ships..... short memory it seems. Blink


I can't even begin to state how ridiculous your argument is.

hisec wardecing to shoot freighters on undocks and gates is not pvp. You guys can't even catch blockade runners. What makes you think you'll be able to fight a hundred experienced pilots on a POCO?

tbh, I doubt Marmite Collective could assemble even 1 wing, let alone the couple thousand that goons could throw at you. Your bravado is laughable.

http://youtu.be/YVkUvmDQ3HY
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#69 - 2013-11-22 23:17:26 UTC
Soldarius wrote:
Tora Bushido wrote:
I think the last long war with Goons we killed 150B of your ships..... short memory it seems. Blink


I can't even begin to state how ridiculous your argument is.

hisec wardecing to shoot freighters on undocks and gates is not pvp. You guys can't even catch blockade runners. What makes you think you'll be able to fight a hundred experienced pilots on a POCO?

tbh, I doubt Marmite Collective could assemble even 1 wing, let alone the couple thousand that goons could throw at you. Your bravado is laughable.



I Wil try again to explain. Just because YOU think your pvp way is the true way that doe snot make you better. Because there are others liek us that think that what goons do is NOT pvp ( blobs) And our opinion is as valid as yours.

THere is no right way.. but as someone said.. the y are all ok as long as yuo collect someone tears.

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Stahlregen
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#70 - 2013-11-23 01:23:53 UTC
Kagura Nikon wrote:
Soldarius wrote:
Tora Bushido wrote:
I think the last long war with Goons we killed 150B of your ships..... short memory it seems. Blink


I can't even begin to state how ridiculous your argument is.

hisec wardecing to shoot freighters on undocks and gates is not pvp. You guys can't even catch blockade runners. What makes you think you'll be able to fight a hundred experienced pilots on a POCO?

tbh, I doubt Marmite Collective could assemble even 1 wing, let alone the couple thousand that goons could throw at you. Your bravado is laughable.



I Wil try again to explain. Just because YOU think your pvp way is the true way that doe snot make you better. Because there are others liek us that think that what goons do is NOT pvp ( blobs) And our opinion is as valid as yours.



Hahaaahaa... oh, you're serious? Bwahahha!
Oh god, your signature is even better GAHAaha. vvvv

Quote:
"If brute force does not solve your problem..... then you are surely not using enough!"

EVERY MORNING I WAKE UP AND OPEN PALM SLAM A VHS INTO THE SLOT. IT'S CHRONICLES OF RIDDICK AND RIGHT THEN AND THERE I START DOING THE MOVES ALONGSIDE THE MAIN CHARACTER, RIDDICK. I DO EVERY MOVE AND I DO EVERY MOVE HARD. MAKIN' WHOOSHING SOUNDS WHEN I SLAM DOWN SOME NECRO BASTARDS. NOT MANY CAN SAY THEY ESCAPED THE GALAXY'S MOST DANGEROUS PRISON. I CAN.
Danalee
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#71 - 2013-11-23 01:59:16 UTC
I'll just say it like it is;
Goons are incapable of mounting any form of defense or offense in hisec. ever.
They are like little overweight primadonna's waiting for the doctrine, waiting for the bridge, waiting for the FC to follow, waiting for the command to press F1.

Hisec gameplay is just too complex for their little drone minds to understand, so they mock it.
If not for their illplaced bravado on the forums, they'd have nothing.

No nullsec dweller in his right mind will invest in forming up for a hisec op. It's a recipe for fail.
Goons are a none issue in this poco deal.

RVB have the numbers.
They have the cohonas.
They lack direction.

That might change along the way, I'd applaud that.
It might be their downfall aswel, since they made their bed with a... weird partner;

We'll just have to wait and see. Meanwhile, have fun, damnit!

D.

Bear

Proud member of the Somalian Coast Guard Authority

Member and Juror of the Court of Crime and Punishment
Powers Sa
#72 - 2013-11-23 03:32:17 UTC
Danalee wrote:
I'll just say it like it is;
Goons are incapable of mounting any form of defense or offense in hisec. ever.
They are like little overweight primadonna's waiting for the doctrine, waiting for the bridge, waiting for the FC to follow, waiting for the command to press F1.

Hisec gameplay is just too complex for their little drone minds to understand, so they mock it.
If not for their illplaced bravado on the forums, they'd have nothing.

No nullsec dweller in his right mind will invest in forming up for a hisec op. It's a recipe for fail.
Goons are a none issue in this poco deal.

RVB have the numbers.
They have the cohonas.
They lack direction.

That might change along the way, I'd applaud that.
It might be their downfall aswel, since they made their bed with a... weird partner;

We'll just have to wait and see. Meanwhile, have fun, damnit!

D.

Bear


Chiggity check yourself. Just saved multiple highsec pocos with a nice sized defense fleet during a massive nullsec supercap battle that killed a node.

We formed a highsec op.

Do you like winning t2 frigs and dictors for Dirt Cheap?https://eveninggames.net/register/ref/dQddmNgyLhFBqNJk

Remeber: Gambling addiction is no laughing matter unless you've lost a vast space fortune on the internet.
Mourning Souls
Minmatar Republic
#73 - 2013-11-23 03:39:02 UTC
Danalee wrote:
I'll just say it like it is;
RVB have the numbers.
They have the cohonas.
They lack direction.


Have you seen our list of wars? We don't need one direction. We can just shoot in every direction.
Professor Clio
Apocalypse Lancers
#74 - 2013-11-23 04:13:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Professor Clio
Mourning Souls wrote:
Danalee wrote:
I'll just say it like it is;
RVB have the numbers.
They have the cohonas.
They lack direction.


Have you seen our list of wars? We don't need one direction. We can just shoot in every direction.



Sir, we're surrounded!

Good! It means we can attack in any direction!

We have 15 active wars plus a number of people allied against us. It's great! Sadly so far no one has dared take the purple steamroller head on.
Decian Cor
Stronghelm Corporation
Solyaris Chtonium
#75 - 2013-11-23 06:06:01 UTC
who the hell is The Marmite Collective anyways? Never heard of em.

[u]Unfiltered for the masses.[/u]

http://imgur.com/mzSl1Ie
Stahlregen
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#76 - 2013-11-23 06:37:21 UTC
Powers Sa wrote:
Danalee wrote:
I'll just say it like it is;
Goons are incapable of mounting any form of defense or offense in hisec. ever.
They are like little overweight primadonna's waiting for the doctrine, waiting for the bridge, waiting for the FC to follow, waiting for the command to press F1.

Hisec gameplay is just too complex for their little drone minds to understand, so they mock it.
If not for their illplaced bravado on the forums, they'd have nothing.

No nullsec dweller in his right mind will invest in forming up for a hisec op. It's a recipe for fail.
Goons are a none issue in this poco deal.

RVB have the numbers.
They have the cohonas.
They lack direction.

That might change along the way, I'd applaud that.
It might be their downfall aswel, since they made their bed with a... weird partner;

We'll just have to wait and see. Meanwhile, have fun, damnit!

D.

Bear


Chiggity check yourself. Just saved multiple highsec pocos with a nice sized defense fleet during a massive nullsec supercap battle that killed a node.

We formed a highsec op.


Get 0wned highsec.

EVERY MORNING I WAKE UP AND OPEN PALM SLAM A VHS INTO THE SLOT. IT'S CHRONICLES OF RIDDICK AND RIGHT THEN AND THERE I START DOING THE MOVES ALONGSIDE THE MAIN CHARACTER, RIDDICK. I DO EVERY MOVE AND I DO EVERY MOVE HARD. MAKIN' WHOOSHING SOUNDS WHEN I SLAM DOWN SOME NECRO BASTARDS. NOT MANY CAN SAY THEY ESCAPED THE GALAXY'S MOST DANGEROUS PRISON. I CAN.
Louis Robichaud
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#77 - 2013-11-23 07:45:48 UTC  |  Edited by: Louis Robichaud
Danalee wrote:
I'll just say it like it is;
Goons are incapable of mounting any form of defense or offense in hisec. ever.
They are like little overweight primadonna's waiting for the doctrine, waiting for the bridge, waiting for the FC to follow, waiting for the command to press F1.

Hisec gameplay is just too complex for their little drone minds to understand, so they mock it.
If not for their illplaced bravado on the forums, they'd have nothing.

No nullsec dweller in his right mind will invest in forming up for a hisec op. It's a recipe for fail.
Goons are a none issue in this poco deal.

RVB have the numbers.
They have the cohonas.
They lack direction.

That might change along the way, I'd applaud that.
It might be their downfall aswel, since they made their bed with a... weird partner;

We'll just have to wait and see. Meanwhile, have fun, damnit!

D.

Bear


It's true, we have no direction at all. Every time we log in we just mash buttons and hope for the best. We now own well over a hundred POCOs, but I have no clue how this occurred. Mang is on the CSM but I heard all he was trying to do was purchase car insurance. I sure hope that the button mashing I'm doing right now will result in something intelligible!

I blog a bit http://hspew.blogspot.ca
Danalee
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#78 - 2013-11-23 09:27:27 UTC
I should never post while intoxicated again.

But it's good to be right even in those circumstances.

D.

Bear

Proud member of the Somalian Coast Guard Authority

Member and Juror of the Court of Crime and Punishment
Erotica 1
Krypteia Operations
#79 - 2013-11-23 09:57:30 UTC
I doubt Marmite will form large fleets for pocos, and yes they do get lots of laughs from camping the hubs. But it's worth saying that a lot of guys in Marmite are basically retired there after playing for awhile in null including FC'ing large fleets. So, while it's unlikely they will, they are capable if they choose.

See Bio for isk doubling rules. If you didn't read bio, chances are you funded those who did.
Yendaj
THE FINAL STAND
The Final Stand.
#80 - 2013-11-23 11:18:53 UTC
Incase everyone hasn't bothered to check, the most lucrative "Plasma" + "Lava" planets in The Citadel region have not been taken by goons at all. They have been taken by some random alliance I have never heard of and their tax rate is at 27/30 %.

Just pulling a small amount of PI off the Antirri Plasma cost me 2 mil, so I junked it and pulled down all my PI (Indy alt).

Either this will happen to most of their planets and people will just refuse to do the PI, or, they will make alot of bank out of high sec'rs that are afraid to low sec.

Either way, while RVB and GOONs fight over the scrub shyte...

Cry Havoc has also taken out quite a few of the more lucrative Citadel planets.

Not such a dumb idea afterall??? Blink