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Mobile Tractor Units won't cut it for capital escalations [findings and suggestions]
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Admiral Douros
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#1 - 2013-11-20 22:07:15 UTC
I had high hopes for Mobile Tractor Units, but unless they're buffed a bit they're not going to cut it for capital escalations, at least the way we're running them with 3 dreads.

Single Mobile Tractor Unit:
Warped Loki, Archon, Moros to a site. Dropped a tractor unit with the Loki, then ran the site like normal. It fell behind a little bit while there was 1 dread on the field. Warped 2 more Moroses and it was obvious that it wasn't going to be able to keep up. Warped the second Archon, and by the time everything was dead there were around 15 wrecks that hadn't been tractored.

Two Mobile Tractor Units:
Useless. I dropped 2 tractor units 5k from each other and they just tractored the same wreck back and forth. They target the nearest wreck when they should be targeting the furthest wreck.

Access restricted to owner:
Since tractor units can only be looted by the person who dropped them, the Noctis character was unable to grab the loot. I had to slowboat back to the tractor unit in the Loki to grab the loot and then drop a can for the Noctis.

Added confusion:
While it was convenient having most of the wrecks in one spot, it required more attention than normal because of having to differentiate between wrecks that needed to be looted or just salvaged.

Steals cargo containers:
I normally jet a can and orbit it with the Loki once I'm at a good range. When I did this, the tractor unit stole it after a few seconds.

Suggestions:
- Increase tractor velocity so that a single unit can keep up in a site without being a hindrance.
- Change target preference to furthest wrecks instead of closest.
- Allow tractor units to be looted by corpmates.
- Maybe make tractor units ignored cargo containers. Not sure if this makes sense for all scenarios though.
Vera Faulk
Perkone
Caldari State
#2 - 2013-11-20 22:21:03 UTC
I agree with everything you have said about them.

Your proposed solution to target the farthest wreck would definitely help out and solve the issue of not being able to deploy two of them. I also believe that they need a "launch for corp " option to make them useful. Increased tractor velocity would certainly be nice, but not really an issue if two are able to be deployed without conflict.

As far as the cargo container issue goes I see changing this making them useless for other things such as mining.
Siobhan MacLeary
Doomheim
#3 - 2013-11-21 00:14:39 UTC
Admiral Douros wrote:


Suggestions:
- Increase tractor velocity so that a single unit can keep up in a site without being a hindrance.
- Change target preference to furthest wrecks instead of closest.
- Allow tractor units to be looted by corpmates.
- Maybe make tractor units ignored cargo containers. Not sure if this makes sense for all scenarios though.


Not had the chance to try out these new modules yet myself, but these are good suggestions.

“Point out to me a person who has been harmed by an AFK cloaker and I will point out a person who has no business playing this game.” - CCP Soundwave
Anize Oramara
WarpTooZero
#4 - 2013-11-21 00:35:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Anize Oramara
Thanks for the post as I was seriously considering using them, Most of these issues sound very easy to work around as is and considering the tractor beam unit continues working after leaving the site I'd say just run the next one and have the loki pick up the loot/tractor unit after finishing the next site.

In fact we usually have two lokis on at once so just have the one who launched it stay behind till its done. Alternatively have the carrier pilot drop it and run the next site with the 2nd carrier (they both have triage right?)

Most of the suggested fixes though would be good but rather than the furthest wreck just have them not target the same one. shouldn't be too hard right CCP? They already don't tractor anything that the player is already tractoring btw.

So far I am in love with these units.

A guide (Google Doc) to Hi-Sec blitzing and breaking the 200mill ISK/H barrier v1.2.3
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#5 - 2013-11-21 02:14:27 UTC
Is it faster than just using a noctis later? yes.
stop complaining about non issues.

There is no Bob.

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Dmitry Wizard
Hard Knocks Inc.
Hard Knocks Citizens
#6 - 2013-11-21 03:00:28 UTC
I ran a couple level 4's today for the first time in a year and a half and I deployed my tractor unit sieges my paladin and went at it. I noticed that it couldn't even keep up with the level IV and decided that bringing it into the hole for escalations probably wouldn't be worth it. I think like others have said it could start with the furthest wreck an maybe pull a bit faster. But on the other hand it's a module I don't have to babysit and lock and tractor wrecks in myself. For the amount of automation it provides I understand it's level of "functionality" with that said. A deploy for corp is all I can suggest to have it balanced enough for wormhole life (c5-c6)

"Wormhole corps are like a bunch of homeschooled kids"
Admiral Douros
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#7 - 2013-11-21 04:46:43 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Is it faster than just using a noctis later? yes.
stop complaining about non issues.


We always salvage after every site while we're starting the next one, but I guess leaving a tractor unit behind in each site and then coming in with the Noctis when we're done for the night would work.
Senn Denroth
Lazerhawks
L A Z E R H A W K S
#8 - 2013-11-21 05:47:43 UTC
There are still people out there that don't warp all the dreads in at the same time? I find this most disturbing.

This topic is useless considering you can do salvaging based on one thing, whether you have a dedicated noctis pilot doing it or not.

If not > drop tractor units in site and go back afterwards to pick up wrecks
If do > same as normal, noctis pilot follows along behind the main group salvaging them straight away
> profit?

Jack Miton wrote:
Is it faster than just using a noctis later? yes.
stop complaining about non issues.


Oh... and this
Ilaister
Binary Aesthetics
#9 - 2013-11-21 06:25:45 UTC
W-Space. The only region whose players demand only reasonable changes from CCP and then ask to be left the hell alone.

Props.
Quinn Corvez
Perkone
Caldari State
#10 - 2013-11-21 06:48:31 UTC
lol to two tractor units have a little tug of war? That's funny.

These new units aren't great but at least it makes your noctis pilots life a bit easier.
Anize Oramara
WarpTooZero
#11 - 2013-11-21 09:21:32 UTC
my alt is the noctis pilot and the absolute biggest pain in the ass is having to loot every wreck. I can see going in with a 6 salvager 2 tractor noctis working amazingly even if not every wreck has been tractored as the unit loots any wrecks coming close to it automatically.

A guide (Google Doc) to Hi-Sec blitzing and breaking the 200mill ISK/H barrier v1.2.3
Frillo Teslar
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2013-11-21 10:51:06 UTC
Anize Oramara wrote:
my alt is the noctis pilot and the absolute biggest pain in the ass is having to loot every wreck. I can see going in with a 6 salvager 2 tractor noctis working amazingly even if not every wreck has been tractored as the unit loots any wrecks coming close to it automatically.

Step one: tractor and salvage all wrecks. Step two: open all cans. Step three: spam loot all. Fastest and easiest way to noctis imo.
Magni Aesir
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#13 - 2013-11-21 11:13:48 UTC
I think a good solution to the problem would be to allow the Mobile Tractor Units to be allowed to be deployed right next to each other and have it so they never tractor wrecks that are within 5km of the Mobile Tractor Units.
Borsek
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#14 - 2013-11-21 15:36:05 UTC
Dmitry Wizard wrote:
I ran a couple level 4's today for the first time in a year and a half and I deployed my tractor unit sieges my paladin and went at it. I noticed that it couldn't even keep up with the level IV and decided that bringing it into the hole for escalations probably wouldn't be worth it. I think like others have said it could start with the furthest wreck an maybe pull a bit faster. But on the other hand it's a module I don't have to babysit and lock and tractor wrecks in myself. For the amount of automation it provides I understand it's level of "functionality" with that said. A deploy for corp is all I can suggest to have it balanced enough for wormhole life (c5-c6)


Dammit, dmitry... LvL 4's... shame on you. Well, I hope it was for SoE, at least.

As for using these, our escalation fleet popped one, and by the time we were done with the standard slow esc fleet, about half of the wrecks were tractored and looted by the unit. It allows for the noctis to bring only two or three tractors to scoop the rest of the wrecks and salvage the looted ones. It helps, but it doesn't really revolutionize salvaging.

Having a t2 variant with two beams, and having it drag the furthest wrecks in first, would help a lot, but then again, if you blitz escalate it doesn't really matter since everything dies fast and multiple people have noctis alts.

Having this module for pew might be worth it, grab the other guys' wrecks before they can scoop them themselves.