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PayPal for EVE
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Kronus Heilgar
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#1 - 2011-10-15 09:09:14 UTC
Not sure if this has already been tried or proposed and shot down, but has anyone considered this idea?

Basically, instead of every 3rd party dev and his mother having a site with API payment validation, and people having to send payments all over the place with weird ass reasons, people can load money onto a central 'account', PayPal style, and then use those funds to pay for services on 3rd party websites.

Each time they make a payment, that amount is deducted from their balance. The system, which we'll call "EvePal", keeps a running tally of how much has been payed to each "partner" site. We have banker employees who then transfer these summed amounts from EvePal's accounts to the partners' accounts.

It would require a lot of trust on the partners' behalf, but would offer some serious advantages.
1) partners don't have to build API payment verification systems
2) partners can have full access to all payment logs, easy documentation
3) users only ever have to send money to one account in-game, and then when they're online they can just do it there
4) payments to partners would be 'instantaneous' (as long as the partner trusts that EvePal would pay them, then the validation would be instant).

Thoughts? And I know it's not very realistic because of trust issues, but it's still an interesting concept.

This is not the signature you're looking for.
Nova Orion
State War Academy
Caldari State
#2 - 2011-10-15 10:45:22 UTC
A few people have talked about this before, I still think it's a great idea, but unless some trusted 3rd party put his name on it, I can't see i happen rly.

/Nova
Lutz Major
Austriae Est Imperare Orbi Universo
#3 - 2011-10-15 12:14:46 UTC
As I've already written an interface for the real PayPal, I can say that checking your WalletJournal is much easier.
I won't say the former is complicated, but there are more issues to consider than requesting some API calls.

The idea is good. I really like the instantaneous exchange of money, but you already said it: without trust nobody would use it, as long as you have no potential receiver base (like blink for instance).

Also you would've to consider upkeep of the application server, trust in your own employees and so on.
Callean Drevus
Perkone
Caldari State
#4 - 2011-10-15 15:30:37 UTC
Lutz Major wrote:
Also you would've to consider upkeep of the application server, trust in your own employees and so on.


An application server that runs this service would not require any substantial upkeep. Neither would you need employees as everything can be automated.

The issue remains trust. I'd happily build this service, but I'm confident most users would not trust me with their money, nor the partners that I would pay them.

Considering the amount of partners, payment would not really be an issue I think.

Developer/Creator of EVE Marketeer
Lutz Major
Austriae Est Imperare Orbi Universo
#5 - 2011-10-15 16:02:22 UTC
Callean Drevus wrote:
Lutz Major wrote:
Also you would've to consider upkeep of the application server, trust in your own employees and so on.


An application server that runs this service would not require any substantial upkeep. Neither would you need employees as everything can be automated.

The issue remains trust. I'd happily build this service, but I'm confident most users would not trust me with their money, nor the partners that I would pay them.

Considering the amount of partners, payment would not really be an issue I think.

You cannot automate pay outs!
And once in a while you might not be online or on business trips.
User might accept a 24 hour period for payouts, but not a whole week when you are on vacation
Callean Drevus
Perkone
Caldari State
#6 - 2011-10-15 17:36:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Callean Drevus
Lutz Major wrote:
You cannot automate pay outs!
And once in a while you might not be online or on business trips.
User might accept a 24 hour period for payouts, but not a whole week when you are on vacation


Ah, that is true, but... The payout period for Paypal is a month by default I believe. I also believe you can only request payout if you actually have x or higher balance.

They might have dropped those limits, but that's just as I remember it.

Even if this is EVE, I see no reason why I should be making 500K payouts every day. Better to do 20M each month.

In any case, I think the partners would be much more concerned with security than with speed. Every additional person increases the chances of someone running away with the money (though I have to concur, if you paid out every day, they could never run away with much).

But as you already wrote, anyone whom would be able to use this system would also be able to easily implement wallet journal walking themselves (and be much better off by it). I suddenly have trouble seeing why this would be a good idea, except that it would be funny.

Developer/Creator of EVE Marketeer
Lutz Major
Austriae Est Imperare Orbi Universo
#7 - 2011-10-15 18:18:10 UTC
Callean Drevus wrote:
I suddenly have trouble seeing why this would be a good idea, except that it would be funny.

The first thing I was thinking of was: (instantaneous) money transfers from out of game Big smile - although I too see not many fields of activity.

But once the Unified Service Layer comes - you still owe us more info on that Stillman!!!!!! - this would nativly be possible.
Karbowiak
State War Academy
Caldari State
#8 - 2011-10-15 19:02:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Karbowiak
im bored..

http://pal.evsco.net/

More info soon(tm) Shocked

edit://
http://pal.evsco.net/?type=login
user: test
pass: test

only login and wallet info done, still have to make the isk input check (throw 1 isk to corp with password in reason, and then throw all the isk you want afterwards with no reason)
And figure out a way to let other websites interface with the payment system in some sort of sane (and secure) way.

Anyway, its getting there Pirate
Callean Drevus
Perkone
Caldari State
#9 - 2011-10-16 08:57:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Callean Drevus
Whoa! That's one fancy login screen ;)

Good luck getting it done [:D)]


Lutz Major wrote:
But once the Unified Service Layer comes - you still owe us more info on that Stillman!!!!!! - this would nativly be possible.


For now, I'd be happy with a javascript call to show a money transfer dialog :)

Developer/Creator of EVE Marketeer
Karbowiak
State War Academy
Caldari State
#10 - 2011-10-16 09:06:26 UTC
Callean Drevus wrote:
Whoa! That's one fancy login screen ;)

Good luck getting it done [:D)]


Lutz Major wrote:
But once the Unified Service Layer comes - you still owe us more info on that Stillman!!!!!! - this would nativly be possible.


For now, I'd be happy with a javascript call to show a money transfer dialog :)


Noone ever said it was gonna be pretty, haha..
Im trying to keep it as no-gui as possible.
Only login, logout, wallet and "do you accept this transfer" will have a gui, a basic as hell one at that..
MasterChief351
Atlas Research Group
Atlas Commerce
#11 - 2011-11-19 11:34:29 UTC
i had the thought about such a thing a while ago as well,

Trust Is the main issue,there have been so many scams with related things to like Banks,Investments etc etc

You Would Want A Known Third Party[Darkness for example] Actually Running it all,someone who has been repeatedly trusted in the past..

Cheers

This Is A Signiture,It Does stuff
Talaan Stardrifter
State War Academy
Caldari State
#12 - 2011-11-20 00:36:05 UTC
It's an interesting idea, but what issue are you actually solving with this?

PayPal solves a trust issue with Credit Cards. EVE doesn't have that problem as all transactions are user-authoritative.