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The new rapid light missiles and Caracal
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Niena Nuamzzar
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#41 - 2013-11-17 21:26:58 UTC
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
HAMs aren't really UP, they might be slightly, but with great missile skills HAMs are pretty good really.

My other toon has perfect skills for missile cruisers and no, they aren't pretty good for cruiser size targets or smaller. They are pretty good only for battlecruisers and larger.
Thaddeus Eggeras
Urkrathos Corp
#42 - 2013-11-17 21:41:53 UTC  |  Edited by: Thaddeus Eggeras
I have never had issues killing cruisers with my HAMs Cerb, HAMs Drake or even HAMs Caracel. HAMs aren't really too bad, they might need their explosion radius and/or velocity adjusted slightly but that's about it. I will be honest I don't use Drakes anymore haha.
Niena Nuamzzar
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#43 - 2013-11-17 22:53:01 UTC
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
I have never had issues killing cruisers with my HAMs Cerb, HAMs Drake or even HAMs Caracel. HAMs aren't really too bad, they might need their explosion radius and/or velocity adjusted slightly but that's about it. I will be honest I don't use Drakes anymore haha.

I never had issues as well but that doesn't mean there is nothing wrong with HAM damage application. They aren't really too bad, they are just bad or, put mildly, not good enough. To make them good without spending too much time exp. velocity and radius needs to be adjusted by at least 20% (30% would be just about right).
Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#44 - 2013-11-17 23:04:00 UTC
Niena Nuamzzar wrote:
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
I have never had issues killing cruisers with my HAMs Cerb, HAMs Drake or even HAMs Caracel. HAMs aren't really too bad, they might need their explosion radius and/or velocity adjusted slightly but that's about it. I will be honest I don't use Drakes anymore haha.

I never had issues as well but that doesn't mean there is nothing wrong with HAM damage application. They aren't really too bad, they are just bad or, put mildly, not good enough. To make them good without spending too much time exp. velocity and radius needs to be adjusted by at least 20% (30% would be just about right).


HAMs actually apply better than HML. It's pretty ridiculous Smile
Thaddeus Eggeras
Urkrathos Corp
#45 - 2013-11-17 23:04:25 UTC
Niena Nuamzzar,

I agree fully with you, but HMLs need buffd too. CCP seems to always have issues with getting missiles right, they either nerf them too much or buff them too much. I wish they could sit down and really work them out and fix them. Medium missiles all around need rebalanced.
Niena Nuamzzar
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#46 - 2013-11-18 06:21:22 UTC
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
Niena Nuamzzar,

I agree fully with you, but HMLs need buffd too. CCP seems to always have issues with getting missiles right, they either nerf them too much or buff them too much. I wish they could sit down and really work them out and fix them. Medium missiles all around need rebalanced.

Thaddeus Eggeras,

I agree with you fully, CCP is to blame!
Chris Winter
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#47 - 2013-11-18 06:35:21 UTC
Danny John-Peter wrote:
I like the bit where nobody on this forum has worked out that if you split your Launchers in two, you get only slightly less DPS over time but also have the option of a big burst of DPS if needed.

Because apparently that makes a weapon system ****.

I like the bit where nobody spouting this nonsense suggestion has actually tried this on the test server to see just how much of a PITA it is to deal with.
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#48 - 2013-11-18 06:44:31 UTC
Chris Winter wrote:
Danny John-Peter wrote:
I like the bit where nobody on this forum has worked out that if you split your Launchers in two, you get only slightly less DPS over time but also have the option of a big burst of DPS if needed.

Because apparently that makes a weapon system ****.

I like the bit where nobody spouting this nonsense suggestion has actually tried this on the test server to see just how much of a PITA it is to deal with.

It's not. Having split weapons is pretty normal for most players.

Oh god.
Chris Winter
Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#49 - 2013-11-18 07:02:10 UTC
Riot Girl wrote:
Chris Winter wrote:
Danny John-Peter wrote:
I like the bit where nobody on this forum has worked out that if you split your Launchers in two, you get only slightly less DPS over time but also have the option of a big burst of DPS if needed.

Because apparently that makes a weapon system ****.

I like the bit where nobody spouting this nonsense suggestion has actually tried this on the test server to see just how much of a PITA it is to deal with.

It's not. Having split weapons is pretty normal for most players.

Except that "normal" split weapons don't have huge reload times with no indication on the module when the reload will be done.

I tried out the RLMLs in a C1 WH on SiSi. They used to be awesome due to all the frigs. Now they're just meh, and splitting the launchers just gives you more to keep track of without actually making it go faster.
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#50 - 2013-11-18 07:25:29 UTC
LMs still exist if you can't figure out how to fire a different launcher when the first one runs out of ammo.

Oh god.
Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#51 - 2013-11-18 08:03:37 UTC
Riot Girl wrote:
LMs still exist if you can't figure out how to fire a different launcher when the first one runs out of ammo.


Aren't they suffering from like a 20% DPS drop though? Hoping someone can remember because I'm not trawling that threadnaught again.

The weapons have been swept up with the RHML bandwagon and mucked about with for, as near as I can tell, no discernible reason whatsoever.

There has been no math showing the need for change to the system as far as I know.


As I posted in the other thread, the new system has merit/legs but as a NEW system, not a replacement to the existing ones.
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#52 - 2013-11-18 08:18:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Riot Girl
Morrigan LeSante wrote:
Aren't they suffering from like a 20% DPS drop though?

I haven't read about any changes to the current LM weapon system. Unless you mean the LMs have less DPS than RLMs, in which case, that has always been the case, yes.

Oh god.
Marcus Walkuris
Aww yeahhh
#53 - 2013-11-18 08:18:59 UTC
Riot Girl wrote:
LMs still exist if you can't figure out how to fire a different launcher when the first one runs out of ammo.


And again this is a good alternative how?
With say a caracal with 5 launchers.
Danny John-Peter
The Congregation
RAPID HEAVY ROPERS
#54 - 2013-11-18 08:19:06 UTC
Morrigan LeSante wrote:
Riot Girl wrote:
LMs still exist if you can't figure out how to fire a different launcher when the first one runs out of ammo.


Aren't they suffering from like a 20% DPS drop though? Hoping someone can remember because I'm not trawling that threadnaught again.

The weapons have been swept up with the RHML bandwagon and mucked about with for, as near as I can tell, no discernible reason whatsoever.

There has been no math showing the need for change to the system as far as I know.


As I posted in the other thread, the new system has merit/legs but as a NEW system, not a replacement to the existing ones.


They suffer from a 20% DPS loss yes, but gain the ability to double there DPS when required.

Its called balance.
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#55 - 2013-11-18 08:20:37 UTC
Marcus Walkuris wrote:
And again this is a good alternative how?
With say a caracal with 5 launchers.

Because it allows you to continue the playstyle you're crying about losing.

Oh god.
Marcus Walkuris
Aww yeahhh
#56 - 2013-11-18 08:24:46 UTC
Riot Girl wrote:
Marcus Walkuris wrote:
And again this is a good alternative how?
With say a caracal with 5 launchers.

Because it allows you to continue the playstyle you're crying about losing.


It does dawn on you how 5 launchers split in 2 right?
Apparently it does not, what am I asking basic math n all.
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#57 - 2013-11-18 08:30:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Riot Girl
Maybe you should have quoted the right post then, or clarified that you were talking about something I wasn't talking about in the post you quoted.

Oh god.
Caitlyn Tufy
Perkone
Caldari State
#58 - 2013-11-18 09:12:18 UTC
Thaddeus Eggeras wrote:
I have never had issues killing cruisers with my HAMs Cerb, HAMs Drake or even HAMs Caracel. HAMs aren't really too bad, they might need their explosion radius and/or velocity adjusted slightly but that's about it. I will be honest I don't use Drakes anymore haha.


You should have decent application skills before you use HAMs against small targets and it really, really, REALLY helps to have T2 launchers for javelins, because level 2 targets sometimes start +50km . When it comes to level 2 missions, I'd use one of the following for a caldari missile boat of choice:

1. Corax with light missiles (it melts targets at around 57km, two targets at a time with ease)
2. Caracal with RLMs (depending on the mission, it should perform better than Corax).
Niena Nuamzzar
Royal Amarr Institute
Amarr Empire
#59 - 2013-11-18 09:26:59 UTC
Danny John-Peter wrote:

They suffer from a 20% DPS loss yes, but gain the ability to double there DPS when required.

Its called balance.

50% dps increase in not double, that would be 100%.
Riot Girl
You'll Cowards Don't Even Smoke Crack
#60 - 2013-11-18 09:32:05 UTC
Niena Nuamzzar wrote:
Danny John-Peter wrote:

They suffer from a 20% DPS loss yes, but gain the ability to double there DPS when required.

Its called balance.

50% dps increase in not double, that would be 100%.

I think he means by splitting them into 2 groups, you are able to have consistent damage or double burst damage.

Oh god.