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Glass cannon t4 bs XL turrents

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Velicitia
XS Tech
#41 - 2013-11-08 10:40:52 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
ALI Virgo wrote:
Danika Princip wrote:
ALI Virgo wrote:


3k after t2 deployed 2 turrets lesser bonus higher fuel cost



Okay, so for your 3k DPS, you're paying what fir the hull, a billion? That's roughly T2 BS prices, with basic T2 fits, isn't it?

Whereas two, maybe three t2 fit Talos would do the same job (IE grinding highsec structures), better, at ~a third of the cost. I'm not seeing the advantage here.

not a billion . price of mega perhaps. it plain a simple it be nice for people with bs to get some of dreads fire power in . plain and simple ccp can figure out proper balance. we have bc that can fit bs weapons. I would like to see frigs that can fit cruiser weapons and bs that can fit like 2 xl weapons. and I don't see why your going in to cost. of-course it wont be a billion. a bc oricale does not cost as much as ap bs. but can out dps it. what im saying is have a bs that can siege and use fuel like a dread does. but instead it being expensive mouraderr it just having dps increase. more then vindicator. more then 2.3 k dps. a vidi can out dps a non deployed dread. so how about a bs that can fit 2 or may be one xl turret and when its deployed it uses fuel and can pound at a high dps. it can hit pos and pi officers. xl turrets do much reduced damage to sub caps so their I snot much of op. think of it as a mini dread fro high sec and noobs in null .



If you make the thing that cheap, it'll be used for all sorts of things. Suicide ganking, ratting when paired up with a rapier, gatecamps, jita station camps, all sorts of things. I'm not really sure we want ships with that kind of DPS sitting on every gate in the game, do we?

XL turrets work well enough against battleships/battlecruisers if they're appropriately webbed, imagine what they'd do to a freighter.


and the dreads have tracking computers fit. a single tracking computer (or even triple + scripted) shouldn't have enough bonus to get the 0.004 tracking up high enough to matter. And if that's really of concern ... throw in a "no firing ze gun(s) til you're sieged".

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#42 - 2013-11-08 10:52:17 UTC
Velicitia wrote:
[

and the dreads have tracking computers fit. a single tracking computer (or even triple + scripted) shouldn't have enough bonus to get the 0.004 tracking up high enough to matter. And if that's really of concern ... throw in a "no firing ze gun(s) til you're sieged".



Are you familiar with the concept of blap dreads?

Jump in off a BS blob, seige, turn on some tracking computers and go wild...
Komodo Askold
Strategic Exploration and Development Corp
Silent Company
#43 - 2013-11-08 13:22:00 UTC
Might be an interesting idea. Although I wouldn't give them bastion mode (as posted before, their capital target would eat them in no time), but could be not very fast.
Yeah, I know those XL turrets are awesome looking :) but if we want to put them on BS hulls, as tier 3 BC's, we need to find a good, non-game breaking use. I see them as more affordable, but less tanky, capital ships/structures smasher, and could be useful both in sieges, cap ships battles and even BS battles, if you manage to hit them. If they're correctly designed, they should fit well without breaking anything, just as tier 3 BC's.
ALI Virgo
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#44 - 2013-11-08 21:56:51 UTC
Jacque Custeau wrote:
People talk about this ship being used for structure grind or cap fights, but they really just want to make suicide ganking even cheaper.

All these ideas and 'glass cannon' talk was thrown around for tier 3 battle cruisers, and the result is that suicide ganking became much more popular and much cheaper to perform. They can fit 8 turrets (something most battleships cant do) and put out more damage.

Suicide ganking should not be made cheaper or easier to do.

people that want to gank will always gank. I fyou want that gone just have concord respond even faster.
ALI Virgo
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#45 - 2013-11-08 22:01:23 UTC
seth Hendar wrote:
ALI Virgo wrote:
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:
So an entire ship class for grinding stations, towers, and sov structures? That sound like an exciting class to fly. Dreads can at least shoot other capitals. As for grinding supers, how is a stationary BS going to tank them long enough to be any kind of a threat to them?

I can maybe see hisec tower bashing but even then we have drone BS's that can shoot the lowest resist, ignore ECM, use no ammo, and can defend themselves if needed.

it takes 10 bs a few hours to kill an offline tower. how long will an online one will take for a corp of 20. or worse pi office. if they have xl turret based bs that is useless against sub caps or missions. the grind time can be reduced.

PI office? did you ever atacked one? cause it takes 10-15 minutes to RF then 5 to kill for....wait for it.....6 nagas with neutron blasters. not really that hard to kill don't you think?

the only issue currently are the meds and large towers in highsec where you need shittones of ships to even think about attacking it

6 naga take 45 min 30 with t2 ammo . a lot can happen in 30 min .I live in null sec I have killed much every thing that can be killed. have said that 30 min to reinforce then you have to come back. things should take 5 min to reinforce. think of a small gang doing hit an run against greater number . Im looking at this as military level . perhaps you should tyr killing a pi office. an dyou saying it only takes 30 min is mistaken . it goes in to reinforce . 6 nags will take 45 m to just re- enforce it check out its armor hit points and structure. that can put a pos to shame.
Antillie Sa'Kan
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#46 - 2013-11-08 22:07:21 UTC
ALI Virgo wrote:
6 naga take 45 min 30 with t2 ammo . a lot can happen in 30 min .I live in null sec I have killed much every thing that can be killed. have said that 30 min to reinforce then you have to come back. things should take 5 min to reinforce. think of a small gang doing hit an run against greater number . Im looking at this as military level . perhaps you should tyr killing a pi office. an dyou saying it only takes 30 min is mistaken . it goes in to reinforce . 6 nags will take 45 m to just re- enforce it check out its armor hit points and structure. that can put a pos to shame.

So bring more than 6 Naga's?
ALI Virgo
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#47 - 2013-11-08 22:10:25 UTC
Danika Princip wrote:
Velicitia wrote:
[

and the dreads have tracking computers fit. a single tracking computer (or even triple + scripted) shouldn't have enough bonus to get the 0.004 tracking up high enough to matter. And if that's really of concern ... throw in a "no firing ze gun(s) til you're sieged".



Are you familiar with the concept of blap dreads?

Jump in off a BS blob, seige, turn on some tracking computers and go wild...
two nyx remote repping each other cab wipe a fleet of dreads. more then 20 . but please tell me how dreads can and help high sec grinds. no matter what idea I present you have a way to post something against it no matter what. although I welcome your feed back it not making any progress on your side. Im new to razor and new to pew pew from drone sec now living in tenal and I deeply to curse for war. my idea is military based that wil help high sec. and not get slaughter by us again like during eve live event :) perhaps you should check out my killboard before saying dreads. stealth bombers were far more effective against killing supers then dreads were . supers and titans have massive tank buffer. compared to their opposite counter parts dreads.but that is nullsec thing. giving people abilive to rage war from high sec in cap weapons on sib caps ill give high sec ability and influence on their own home and war efforts. please consider high sec wars merc that can be hired to join in fights in high sec and null. or even low sec. tracking does not matter if your hitting a structure and your not moving.....
Antillie Sa'Kan
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#48 - 2013-11-08 22:18:19 UTC
Any sub cap that could be wielded against supers by people from hi sec will either die horribly to supers or make said supers totally pointless and thus take their place at the top of the food chain. And since the null sec power blocks will be able to field far more of these ships than anyone else nothing will really change. You cannot fix a force projection and economic problem with ship balance changes.
Sarah Stallman
Pen2 Logistics
#49 - 2013-11-08 22:25:13 UTC
I want to see a destroyer sized ship with a single capital weapon and tracking penalties. About the only thing it can hit is titans or sieged dreads, but they're relatively cheap and hit hard.
ALI Virgo
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#50 - 2013-11-08 22:31:37 UTC
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:
Any sub cap that could be wielded against supers by people from hi sec will either die horribly to supers or make said supers totally pointless and thus take their place at the top of the food chain. And since the null sec power blocks will be able to field far more of these ships than anyone else nothing will really change. You cannot fix a force projection and economic problem with ship balance changes.

people can bring 500 supers and no sub cap fleet to tank out 1000 till down time and or server crash. a high sec bs fleet can come in on three way:) its not gay if its three way okay.. joking. can high sec people fight or just die like they did on the event. in 3 bil fitted faction ships. their kitchen sink lead by ccp sank as it enter my staging system, I f they get toys that can make a difference and respond faster even against us perhaps they be more that what null sec people think of them. people living in high sec should be bale to use weapons of power. and deploy and make difference in super cap fights :)
ALI Virgo
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#51 - 2013-11-08 22:33:26 UTC
Sarah Stallman wrote:
I want to see a destroyer sized ship with a single capital weapon and tracking penalties. About the only thing it can hit is titans or sieged dreads, but they're relatively cheap and hit hard.

I f you and other have fun why not. ccp has small ships like that . that they only use :) it would make a a nice killmailed ship atleast :) sucha ship can not out dps a single bomb going off in middle of a fleet :) so why not
Antillie Sa'Kan
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#52 - 2013-11-08 22:43:02 UTC
ALI Virgo wrote:
people can bring 500 supers and no sub cap fleet to tank out 1000 till down time and or server crash. a high sec bs fleet can come in on three way:) its not gay if its three way okay.. joking. can high sec people fight or just die like they did on the event. in 3 bil fitted faction ships. their kitchen sink lead by ccp sank as it enter my staging system, I f they get toys that can make a difference and respond faster even against us perhaps they be more that what null sec people think of them. people living in high sec should be bale to use weapons of power. and deploy and make difference in super cap fights :)

You wrote a lot of words but you didn't actually say anything.
BigSako
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2013-11-09 08:52:34 UTC
ALI Virgo wrote:
Battle ships that can fit two xl turrets and go into siege mode.

a nice tool against supers caps that dont bring sub caps to fight

and against high sec wars pos grinds. Even those pi offices.


call them fangs class since it will only have 2 turret of launcher spots


This is literally worse then your TIDI thread.

We already have those Tier 4 Battleships with XL guns, they are called Dreadnaughts, have a Jump Drive and any proper alliance has them.

Also I like how you propose brining 500 of them
ALI Virgo wrote:
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:
So a stationary battleship fighting against sieged dreads and/or super caps? I think it will take about 10 seconds for it to be blown to bits. Unless you are proposing that it also be able to tank at least a hundred thousand DPS for some significant amount of time. In which case what is the point of normal dreads?

no tank buff. just xl turrets. 100 supers vs 500 supcaps. well supers can just tank it till server shuts down and don't need to bring sub caps. this way supers would need support fleet


So to counter 100 people, you want to bring 500 people (which you know causes TIDI).
Oh wait, in your other thread you said that TIDI is bad and the game is broken.


I'm looking for common sense, but I can't find it, sorry mate.
Jason Itiner
Harmless People
#54 - 2013-11-09 10:06:42 UTC
I like your thought, especially the name Fang for the two turrets.

As an aside, how about giving the Naga a single capital railgun slot, with 0 tracking, i.e. the ship has to actually turn in order to aim its capital gun. It would fit well with the current model, since the two forward tines already lend themselves well to firing, say, Rifters... Big smile
Jeffrey Donovan
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#55 - 2013-11-09 10:10:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Jeffrey Donovan
they way we are going we will have a thousand ships soon :)

we already have 2 op ships the destroyer and tier3 bc's ganking everything now this?
Sarah Stallman
Pen2 Logistics
#56 - 2013-11-09 17:24:08 UTC
What I'd like to see is a destroyer that can only hit stationary targets, something where an Orca could get enough transversal to speed tank it. However, make it appropriately small and cheap so they can be an expendable counter to capital blobs.
Bischopt
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#57 - 2013-11-09 19:58:36 UTC
Fangs class... You're thinking about your damned tarantula from an earlier thread aren't you.

Anyway, this sounds too cheap and too powerful. What's the point fo having dreads if you can have something that's way cheaper and does the same job?
And yeah, these things would take suicide ganking to a whole new level.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#58 - 2013-11-09 23:11:55 UTC
Sarah Stallman wrote:
What I'd like to see is a destroyer that can only hit stationary targets, something where an Orca could get enough transversal to speed tank it. However, make it appropriately small and cheap so they can be an expendable counter to capital blobs.



Smartbombs, drones, subcap support.

Carriers moving.

Siege-skating.

All ways to bork your supposed counter. That took a long time to think up, didn't it. Roll
ALI Virgo
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#59 - 2013-11-10 01:22:54 UTC
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:
ALI Virgo wrote:
people can bring 500 supers and no sub cap fleet to tank out 1000 till down time and or server crash. a high sec bs fleet can come in on three way:) its not gay if its three way okay.. joking. can high sec people fight or just die like they did on the event. in 3 bil fitted faction ships. their kitchen sink lead by ccp sank as it enter my staging system, I f they get toys that can make a difference and respond faster even against us perhaps they be more that what null sec people think of them. people living in high sec should be bale to use weapons of power. and deploy and make difference in super cap fights :)

You wrote a lot of words but you didn't actually say anything.

you right I did not say any thing I was typing with mouth closed :)
ALI Virgo
Dreddit
Test Alliance Please Ignore
#60 - 2013-11-10 01:24:58 UTC
BigSako wrote:
ALI Virgo wrote:
Battle ships that can fit two xl turrets and go into siege mode.

a nice tool against supers caps that dont bring sub caps to fight

and against high sec wars pos grinds. Even those pi offices.


call them fangs class since it will only have 2 turret of launcher spots


This is literally worse then your TIDI thread.

We already have those Tier 4 Battleships with XL guns, they are called Dreadnaughts, have a Jump Drive and any proper alliance has them.

Also I like how you propose brining 500 of them
ALI Virgo wrote:
Antillie Sa'Kan wrote:
So a stationary battleship fighting against sieged dreads and/or super caps? I think it will take about 10 seconds for it to be blown to bits. Unless you are proposing that it also be able to tank at least a hundred thousand DPS for some significant amount of time. In which case what is the point of normal dreads?

no tank buff. just xl turrets. 100 supers vs 500 supcaps. well supers can just tank it till server shuts down and don't need to bring sub caps. this way supers would need support fleet


So to counter 100 people, you want to bring 500 people (which you know causes TIDI).
Oh wait, in your other thread you said that TIDI is bad and the game is broken.


I'm looking for common sense, but I can't find it, sorry mate.

to counter 100 supers we would need a lot more then 500 but your missing the point :) I apologize I fyou don't get it then you just don't get it. an di can not dum it down any further sorry :)