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Plex for 2 skills!

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Smohq Anmirorz
State War Academy
Caldari State
#101 - 2013-11-08 18:37:05 UTC
Merida DunBrogh wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
Tippia wrote:


Quote:
As long as one player can gain advantage faster than another player, I don't care where it came from, I only care that it was able to be acquired.
But that's just it: trading character does not let anyone gain advantage any faster. All the advantages have to be produced at the same speed as always. If none have been produced, none exist to be traded.



"does not let anyone gain"...anyone? really? what about Player A and Player B who just started today, from my earlier example? Trading characters does not let one gain advantage over the other? Is that really what you think? Or are you just being willfully ignorant? Or perhaps just myopic. Certainly you don't think that yours is the one and only way to think, no?

The advantages that are produced at the same speed are not "always" produced at the same speed for everyone. If you have money, you can "produce" them right after you pay your money. They are only produced at the same rate for the persons who originally trained them.


But those persons did have to train them for you to get the ability to buy them. Meaning that if player A started in 2006, he could have exactly the same char as the char player b bought from 2006.
No one gets an advantage, since you would still have to wait for someone from 2006 to actually sell his char.

Tippia is correct you know, character bazaar is nothing wrong with. Nor is dual training/triple training.

Buying SP directly IS wrong.



Player A and Player B are my example from earlier. They both started today. Player A paid just the subscription, he would be doing the starter system quests right now hoping to make it into a destroyer soon. Player B paid a lot of money for a high-SP character and lots of ISK. Player B has managed to produce a lot of SP and ISK and didn't even need to log in.

The characters on the bazaar shouldn't be sold or transferred, that would be allowing someone to buy SP with money.
Merida DunBrogh
Black Screen Of Raging Defeat
#102 - 2013-11-08 18:53:00 UTC
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
Merida DunBrogh wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
Tippia wrote:


Quote:
As long as one player can gain advantage faster than another player, I don't care where it came from, I only care that it was able to be acquired.
But that's just it: trading character does not let anyone gain advantage any faster. All the advantages have to be produced at the same speed as always. If none have been produced, none exist to be traded.



"does not let anyone gain"...anyone? really? what about Player A and Player B who just started today, from my earlier example? Trading characters does not let one gain advantage over the other? Is that really what you think? Or are you just being willfully ignorant? Or perhaps just myopic. Certainly you don't think that yours is the one and only way to think, no?

The advantages that are produced at the same speed are not "always" produced at the same speed for everyone. If you have money, you can "produce" them right after you pay your money. They are only produced at the same rate for the persons who originally trained them.


But those persons did have to train them for you to get the ability to buy them. Meaning that if player A started in 2006, he could have exactly the same char as the char player b bought from 2006.
No one gets an advantage, since you would still have to wait for someone from 2006 to actually sell his char.

Tippia is correct you know, character bazaar is nothing wrong with. Nor is dual training/triple training.

Buying SP directly IS wrong.



Player A and Player B are my example from earlier. They both started today. Player A paid just the subscription, he would be doing the starter system quests right now hoping to make it into a destroyer soon. Player B paid a lot of money for a high-SP character and lots of ISK. Player B has managed to produce a lot of SP and ISK and didn't even need to log in.

The characters on the bazaar shouldn't be sold or transferred, that would be allowing someone to buy SP with money.


But it is not appearing out of thin air, and that is the difference. Buying SP is making it appear out of thin air and instantly, buying a character means someone has spend time training it. Whether that someone was you or not, doesn't matter.

Player B would still have to log in, in order to redeem and sell the plex.
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#103 - 2013-11-08 18:56:34 UTC
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:


The characters on the bazaar shouldn't be sold or transferred, that would be allowing someone to buy SP with money.


I'm conflicted here.

On the one hand I think that characters should be acct bound and untradable, but at the same time character sales are my primary source of income.

I think that at the end of the day though, it would be better to lose that income and see CCP do the right thing. Or get rid of PLEX and make players have to actually earn the ISK to buy characters instead of buying it.

Mr Epeen Cool
Merida DunBrogh
Black Screen Of Raging Defeat
#104 - 2013-11-08 20:38:48 UTC
Mr Epeen wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:


The characters on the bazaar shouldn't be sold or transferred, that would be allowing someone to buy SP with money.


I'm conflicted here.

On the one hand I think that characters should be acct bound and untradable, but at the same time character sales are my primary source of income.

I think that at the end of the day though, it would be better to lose that income and see CCP do the right thing. Or get rid of PLEX and make players have to actually earn the ISK to buy characters instead of buying it.

Mr Epeen Cool


If they removed plex or character sales, they would lose revenue made by selling plex. And if they stop selling plex some people will stop playing completely because they don't want to pay to play with RL money.

Yeah...Great idea that will totally be accepted! Lol
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#105 - 2013-11-08 20:45:46 UTC
Merida DunBrogh wrote:
Mr Epeen wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:


The characters on the bazaar shouldn't be sold or transferred, that would be allowing someone to buy SP with money.


I'm conflicted here.

On the one hand I think that characters should be acct bound and untradable, but at the same time character sales are my primary source of income.

I think that at the end of the day though, it would be better to lose that income and see CCP do the right thing. Or get rid of PLEX and make players have to actually earn the ISK to buy characters instead of buying it.

Mr Epeen Cool


If they removed plex or character sales, they would lose revenue made by selling plex. And if they stop selling plex some people will stop playing completely because they don't want to pay to play with RL money.

Yeah...Great idea that will totally be accepted! Lol


People did just fine playing for ISK before PLEX via the Game Time Code market.

PLEX has nothing to do with game time. It has everything to do with CCP wanting a piece of the RMT pie. But replacing illegal RMT with sanctioned RMT is still RMT and not good for the game.

Mr Epeen Cool
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#106 - 2013-11-08 21:14:33 UTC
"CCP are fine with me owning 3 ships that can do 5km/s so why can't I buy 1 ship that does 15km/s ITS JUST THE SAME"

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#107 - 2013-11-08 21:42:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
"does not let anyone gain"...anyone? really? what about Player A and Player B who just started today, from my earlier example? Trading characters does not let one gain advantage over the other?
Player B does not have any advantage over any other character that has been around for 2 years, no. No time is beings skipped — the (supposed) advantage player B has took 2 years to create, same as for everyone else with the same advantage.

Quote:
The advantages that are produced at the same speed are not "always" produced at the same speed for everyone.
The only difference is how you pick your skills and attributes. Money is not a factor (especially since you can't actually buy characters for cash… well, not legally any way). And no, you can never produce them by right after you pay because there are no P2W-like mechanics like that in EVE that let you skip over the mechanics that govern production of… well… anything, really.

Quote:
Right. Because I haven't acknowledged the validity of your argument at all. Not one bit. And no part of my argument holds any water at all.
…which has nothing to do with what I said.
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#108 - 2013-11-08 21:44:44 UTC
Mr Epeen wrote:
Merida DunBrogh wrote:
Mr Epeen wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:


The characters on the bazaar shouldn't be sold or transferred, that would be allowing someone to buy SP with money.


I'm conflicted here.

On the one hand I think that characters should be acct bound and untradable, but at the same time character sales are my primary source of income.

I think that at the end of the day though, it would be better to lose that income and see CCP do the right thing. Or get rid of PLEX and make players have to actually earn the ISK to buy characters instead of buying it.

Mr Epeen Cool


If they removed plex or character sales, they would lose revenue made by selling plex. And if they stop selling plex some people will stop playing completely because they don't want to pay to play with RL money.

Yeah...Great idea that will totally be accepted! Lol


People did just fine playing for ISK before PLEX via the Game Time Code market.

PLEX has nothing to do with game time. It has everything to do with CCP wanting a piece of the RMT pie. But replacing illegal RMT with sanctioned RMT is still RMT and not good for the game.

Mr Epeen Cool



grr an MMO company is selling game time this is just like pushing smack to schoolchildren

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
#109 - 2013-11-08 21:51:52 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Mr Epeen wrote:
Merida DunBrogh wrote:
Mr Epeen wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:


The characters on the bazaar shouldn't be sold or transferred, that would be allowing someone to buy SP with money.


I'm conflicted here.

On the one hand I think that characters should be acct bound and untradable, but at the same time character sales are my primary source of income.

I think that at the end of the day though, it would be better to lose that income and see CCP do the right thing. Or get rid of PLEX and make players have to actually earn the ISK to buy characters instead of buying it.

Mr Epeen Cool


If they removed plex or character sales, they would lose revenue made by selling plex. And if they stop selling plex some people will stop playing completely because they don't want to pay to play with RL money.

Yeah...Great idea that will totally be accepted! Lol


People did just fine playing for ISK before PLEX via the Game Time Code market.

PLEX has nothing to do with game time. It has everything to do with CCP wanting a piece of the RMT pie. But replacing illegal RMT with sanctioned RMT is still RMT and not good for the game.

Mr Epeen Cool



grr an MMO company is selling game time this is just like pushing smack to schoolchildren


Here you go again. Quoting one thing and answering another.

Booze for breakfast is not good, m'kay.

Mr Epeen Cool
Smohq Anmirorz
State War Academy
Caldari State
#110 - 2013-11-09 00:42:14 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Smohq Anmirorz wrote:
"does not let anyone gain"...anyone? really? what about Player A and Player B who just started today, from my earlier example? Trading characters does not let one gain advantage over the other?
Player B does not have any advantage over any other character that has been around for 2 years, no. No time is beings skipped — the (supposed) advantage player B has took 2 years to create, same as for everyone else with the same advantage.


But it did not take Player B any time at all to create it. Neither Player A or Player B has been around for 2 years. But Player B, by spending money, has an advantage over Player A. If they both want to do pvp, Player B has an advantage of ships with more hp, higher resistances, a far better ability to fit ships, the ability to use more types of ships, etc. If they both want to be industrialists, he has and advantage of the capital to get it going, the skills to make more type of ships/modules/components, higher invention chances, more slots, etc. This type of scenario where one brand new player has an advantage over another brand new player is similar for just about anything they want to do and makes it very clear that by spending money you can gain advantage.

Real money can get you an advantage. If you spend enough of it, it can get you a huge advantage. It doesn't matter where it came from, you still get that advantage as a day one character over other day one characters by spending money. By spending money you get to skip the mechanic of time. Just because someone else put in the time does not mean you have not been able to skip it.

The fact is undeniable that you can pay money to skip the time mechanic and secure an advantage over others.
Sevendeadly Sins
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#111 - 2013-11-09 04:49:06 UTC
Harry Forever wrote:
NFain wrote:
Lol

Since we have dual character training and such, mind if we add plex for 2 skills to be trained at the same time? Bear


this is long overdue

Hey, aren't you supposed to be soloing all the null-sec alliances?

http://www.zombo.com
NFain
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#112 - 2013-11-09 06:43:08 UTC
Sevendeadly Sins wrote:
Harry Forever wrote:
NFain wrote:
Lol

Since we have dual character training and such, mind if we add plex for 2 skills to be trained at the same time? Bear


this is long overdue

Hey, aren't you supposed to be soloing all the null-sec alliances?


I'm working on it! ;D

but seriously i see a need here, its not like were purchasing sp out of thin air.. Were purchasing the ability to make twice the amount of sp with current game mechanics.
Alduin666 Shikkoken
Doomheim
#113 - 2013-11-09 14:17:54 UTC
I don't even understand whats going on here?!?
- Sees Harry Forever in this thread
Oh wait now I understand -_-

Honor is a fools prize. [I]Glory is of no use to the dead.[/I]

Be a man! Post with your main! ~Vas'Avi Community Manager