These forums have been archived and are now read-only.

The new forums are live and can be found at https://forums.eveonline.com/

Crime & Punishment

 
  • Topic is locked indefinitely.
12Next page
 

High Sec Ganking
Author
Previous Topic Next Topic
Al Skor
Doomheim
#1 - 2013-10-02 13:24:06 UTC
Hello C&P!

I recently started doing some high-sec ganking. I've gotta be honest, I'm not doing very well! "How could someone suck at high sec ganking?", you're probably wondering. I don't know, I was hoping you could tell me! I'm currently using a Thrasher. I'm finding my targets in 0.5 to give myself the best chance of killing my targets before CONCORD arrive. My fit is below:

THRASHER
7x 200mm AC I

1x AB I
1x Passive Scanner I

2x Gyrostab I

I have no problems with Ventures in 0.5 (although, it was slower than I thought it would be). I have also engaged a Procurer, Mackinaw and a Retriever. The Proc/Mack I expected trouble with since I'm not T2 fitted. However, I expected to take the Retriever down but I only got him to 50% shields before CONCORD jumped on me.

I've tried to keep my fit as cheap as possible since it's a suicide boat. But I think this could possibly be the cause? Should I swap the 200mm ACs out for maybe some Scout ACs? Or perhaps I may need to train for T2 guns/gyros? I'm hoping to keep it as cost-effective as possible but I want to be able to at least take down Retrievers. Taking down Mackinaws would be a great bonus.

TLDR; Thrasher gank fit, plz?
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
Goonswarm Federation
#2 - 2013-10-02 13:50:54 UTC
I never ganked in trashers...as far as I remember at least.
I would recommend you to use a blaster-fitted catalyst. For haulers that warp in to a gate in Autopilot (they land at range and slowboat) you can try sentry vexors.
The problem with suicide ganking is that once you are negative sec status you will have problems getting close to your targets if you do not have a good warp in (aka an Alt or someone that is close to your prey). Since the buff of exhumers and mining barges it is hard to kill them with just one destroyer when you just started playing.

TunDraGon is recruiting! "Also, your boobs [:o] "   CCP Eterne, 2012 "When in doubt...make a diȼk joke." Robin Williams - RIP
Ra Jackson
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-10-02 14:06:53 UTC
A well skilled, T2 fit Catalyst shells out over 700dps. That's what you want to use for miners. Cheap Thrasher can kill pods and shuttles, but that's about it.
Plastic Psycho
Necro-Economics
#4 - 2013-10-02 15:01:41 UTC  |  Edited by: Plastic Psycho
Al Skor wrote:
Hello C&P!

I recently started doing some high-sec ganking. I've gotta be honest, I'm not doing very well! "How could someone suck at high sec ganking?", you're probably wondering. I don't know, I was hoping you could tell me! I'm currently using a Thrasher. I'm finding my targets in 0.5 to give myself the best chance of killing my targets before CONCORD arrive. My fit is below:

THRASHER
7x 200mm AC I

1x AB I
1x Passive Scanner I

2x Gyrostab I

I have no problems with Ventures in 0.5 (although, it was slower than I thought it would be). I have also engaged a Procurer, Mackinaw and a Retriever. The Proc/Mack I expected trouble with since I'm not T2 fitted. However, I expected to take the Retriever down but I only got him to 50% shields before CONCORD jumped on me.

I've tried to keep my fit as cheap as possible since it's a suicide boat. But I think this could possibly be the cause? Should I swap the 200mm ACs out for maybe some Scout ACs? Or perhaps I may need to train for T2 guns/gyros? I'm hoping to keep it as cost-effective as possible but I want to be able to at least take down Retrievers. Taking down Mackinaws would be a great bonus.

TLDR; Thrasher gank fit, plz?

Thrashers are pretty much pure Alpha. If you don't nail your target in the first volley, you may not get them at all.
As noted above, investigate Gank-Cats. They're DPS, but also have a fairly high Alpha.

I confess that I've had poor success ganking in Thrashers. OTOH, with even a high-meta T1 fit Cat, I can reliably pop targets with ease - And I *suck* at ganking, so you should have no problem at all.

Edit:
A Meta-3 Blaster-Cat should cost you about 8M ISK, depending on where you buy. You'll be popping targets worth four times that, easily. Save the T2 blasters for high-value targets.
Leto Thule
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#5 - 2013-10-02 15:25:05 UTC
Ra Jackson wrote:
A well skilled, T2 fit Catalyst shells out over 700dps. That's what you want to use for miners. Cheap Thrasher can kill pods and shuttles, but that's about it.


Out of pure curiosity...

What fit is this? 700 DPS is nuts coming out of a gank cat.

Thunderdome ringmaster, Community Leader and Lord Inquisitor to the Court of Crime and Punishment
Plastic Psycho
Necro-Economics
#6 - 2013-10-02 20:01:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Plastic Psycho
Leto Thule wrote:
Ra Jackson wrote:
A well skilled, T2 fit Catalyst shells out over 700dps. That's what you want to use for miners. Cheap Thrasher can kill pods and shuttles, but that's about it.


Out of pure curiosity...

What fit is this? 700 DPS is nuts coming out of a gank cat.

http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/57336-Catalyst-700-DPS-Suicide-Gank.html

Yeah, it's Battle-Fail, but I actually use a variation of this fit, and with the right (not terribly expensive) implants, I can (just) exceed 700DPS (heated).

You need good skills, which I have, but with perfect skills and some careful rework and certain expensive implants, 800DPS is theoretically within reach.


Edit:
Mind you, I normally fly a Cat with Meta-3 blasters, 'cause they're cheaper and most often plenty enough to do the job. But I have tested the T2 Neutrons against Barges, and they will kick out serious hellfire and brimstone. Coveters melt under those blasters like tinfoil in a bonfire. Macks go almost as fast.

To hit higher numbers, you'll need T2 Rigs and some very expensive top-end implants, along with perfect skills. Generally not worth it, except for lulz.

Second Edit:
I usually drop the points. This thing fires hot enough that the tackle is generally superfluous. I instead mount a passive targeter and a ship scanner. Which are very cheap. Big smile
Ghost Phius
Tribal Liberation Force
Minmatar Republic
#7 - 2013-10-02 22:22:09 UTC
Use a catalst for solo ganking in hi-sec. Thrashers are for gangs.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#8 - 2013-10-02 23:20:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Use a Catalyst for anything bigger than a shuttle, use an arty Thrasher for the pods and shuttles. Solstice Project and D400 both use Thrashers to good effect.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Leto Thule
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-10-03 15:50:46 UTC
Plastic Psycho wrote:

http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/57336-Catalyst-700-DPS-Suicide-Gank.html

Yeah, it's Battle-Fail, but I actually use a variation of this fit, and with the right (not terribly expensive) implants, I can (just) exceed 700DPS (heated).

You need good skills, which I have, but with perfect skills and some careful rework and certain expensive implants, 800DPS is theoretically within reach.


Edit:
Mind you, I normally fly a Cat with Meta-3 blasters, 'cause they're cheaper and most often plenty enough to do the job. But I have tested the T2 Neutrons against Barges, and they will kick out serious hellfire and brimstone. Coveters melt under those blasters like tinfoil in a bonfire. Macks go almost as fast.

To hit higher numbers, you'll need T2 Rigs and some very expensive top-end implants, along with perfect skills. Generally not worth it, except for lulz.

Second Edit:
I usually drop the points. This thing fires hot enough that the tackle is generally superfluous. I instead mount a passive targeter and a ship scanner. Which are very cheap. Big smile


Nice. I really need to try this out. Im usually a lowsec FW pilot.. but maybe ill fit one up and go for a cruise today.

Thunderdome ringmaster, Community Leader and Lord Inquisitor to the Court of Crime and Punishment
Plastic Psycho
Necro-Economics
#10 - 2013-10-03 17:49:47 UTC
Just be aware that it really is the epitome of 'glass cannon.' It's slow, it has paper-thin tank, and if pointed by even an Ibis, you can be kited to death with near impunity.
Ra Jackson
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#11 - 2013-10-04 20:44:32 UTC
Plastic Psycho wrote:
Just be aware that it really is the epitome of 'glass cannon.' It's slow, it has paper-thin tank, and if pointed by even an Ibis, you can be kited to death with near impunity.


Most people flying them are usually at -10 sec, so sitting around is not an option anyway :)
Kristopher Rocancourt
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#12 - 2013-11-06 13:47:55 UTC
Moa is the definitive highsec gank tool.

http://killalliance.co.uk/tears/tears-holeysheet/

Ulric Zorn
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2013-11-06 17:51:37 UTC
Add me to the Catalyst list.

After reading some whines about the new order and miner bumping I went to their site and read the section on ganking. This toon had no real skills for anything except picking out sunglasses so I decided to follow the skills path and fit detailed on the site. I got my first solo Retriever the other night and am right about 500 dps. Once I finish the initial skills path I expect to be near 700.

This isn't so much an infomercial for the new order as it is a recommendation of the Catalyst as a great ganking ship.

Miner Bumping Site
Sabriz Adoudel
Move along there is nothing here
#14 - 2013-11-06 22:55:10 UTC
Leto Thule wrote:
Ra Jackson wrote:
A well skilled, T2 fit Catalyst shells out over 700dps. That's what you want to use for miners. Cheap Thrasher can kill pods and shuttles, but that's about it.


Out of pure curiosity...

What fit is this? 700 DPS is nuts coming out of a gank cat.



Three tech II Neutron Blasters, Void ammo, three tech II Magstabs, one each of +10% damage and +10% firing speed rigs.

With my skills and implants, it's 696 DPS. Could be higher if I trained Small Blaster Specialization 5, or splashed out on higher priced hardwirings. (I have all other relevant skills).

Like people have said, thrashers are mostly for lowskilled characters that want to pop autopiloting pods.

I support the New Order and CODE. alliance. www.minerbumping.com
Captain Teuta
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#15 - 2013-11-08 13:51:32 UTC
Suicide ganking is a ******* art my friend. And your sir are well on your way to be coming a master. There is, however, no straight forward and one sided solution that solves them all. Here is what I can pass to you:

Both the fit and the ship you decide to fly in your gank will depend solely on target acquisition.

What hull is the target flying? (Frig, Cruiser, Battlecruisr, or Battleship, etc, etc,.)
How much EHP do they have? (RAW)
What is their resistances? (T1 or T2 Res)
Are they active, passive, or buffer tanked and is their tank currently running? (hardeners, reps, plates, bulk heads, etc.)
Are they afk or atk (at-the-keyboard : Are they 15Km afk off gate, or afk auto piloting and how fast?)

There are a few more things you can take into consideration when choosing your dmg projection. Do you want alpha or straight DPS? Your two BEST options are going to be Blasters and Arties.

As someone stated once you go neg10 getting a decent warp in will be VERY difficult. I suggest at least x2 accounts for ganking. All you really need is a char to use as warp ins but something that can use a ship and cargo scanner is a plus.

Here is a good example of the best times to use one of the two above mentioned dmg projections.

* AFK Hulk in belt. Has no shield or tank mods running - Assuming he has no buffer you can drop him with 1 Fully T2 fit Catalyst in a .5. x2 in a .6 and x2-x3 in a .7 depending on skills.

* AFK Tengu at planet or belt. Has no shield or tank mods running - Assuming he has no buffer you can drop him with 1 fully T2 fit 280mm Arty Thrasher. Preferably two Thrashers as most, but not all, solo attempts fail but It only takes two at best! This is due to the res. Don't drop blasters on a Tengu.

To give you an idea...

POD: T1 Cat or Thrasher
T1 Frigate: Suggest T2 cat while not moving. But T2 thrasher can do it. T1 can as well but if you miss you'll most likely fail.
T2 Frig: Preferably T2 cat if it's an assault frig. (DPS over Volley.
Orca (With no DC and bulk heads): 8-13 catalyst depending on skills
Freighter: 16-18 catalyst depending on skills.

If you are selective and scan your targets you will succeed on the gank 9/10. Hope this helps. Good luck to you! =)
Leto Thule
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#16 - 2013-11-08 13:58:35 UTC
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
Leto Thule wrote:
Ra Jackson wrote:
A well skilled, T2 fit Catalyst shells out over 700dps. That's what you want to use for miners. Cheap Thrasher can kill pods and shuttles, but that's about it.


Out of pure curiosity...

What fit is this? 700 DPS is nuts coming out of a gank cat.



Three tech II Neutron Blasters, Void ammo, three tech II Magstabs, one each of +10% damage and +10% firing speed rigs.

With my skills and implants, it's 696 DPS. Could be higher if I trained Small Blaster Specialization 5, or splashed out on higher priced hardwirings. (I have all other relevant skills).

Like people have said, thrashers are mostly for lowskilled characters that want to pop autopiloting pods.


Yeah, since that post i have conducted a few ganks with cats. Tried for a skiff last night though and failed misersably with 4 cats in a .5 system. I think he had shield mods though, and wasnt AFK.

Thunderdome ringmaster, Community Leader and Lord Inquisitor to the Court of Crime and Punishment
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#17 - 2013-11-08 14:54:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Solstice Project
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
Leto Thule wrote:
Ra Jackson wrote:
A well skilled, T2 fit Catalyst shells out over 700dps. That's what you want to use for miners. Cheap Thrasher can kill pods and shuttles, but that's about it.


Out of pure curiosity...

What fit is this? 700 DPS is nuts coming out of a gank cat.



Three tech II Neutron Blasters, Void ammo, three tech II Magstabs, one each of +10% damage and +10% firing speed rigs.

With my skills and implants, it's 696 DPS. Could be higher if I trained Small Blaster Specialization 5, or splashed out on higher priced hardwirings. (I have all other relevant skills).

Like people have said, thrashers are mostly for lowskilled characters that want to pop autopiloting pods.

With a properly fitted thrasher you can kill shuttles, noobships, lightly tanked frigates AND their pods
in one go under sentry fire. You can't do that with a catalyst.

Different ships for different situations.

A thrasher is much better suited to gank unded sentry fire than a catalyst.
Captain Teuta
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2013-11-08 14:55:42 UTC
Leto Thule wrote:
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
Leto Thule wrote:
Ra Jackson wrote:
A well skilled, T2 fit Catalyst shells out over 700dps. That's what you want to use for miners. Cheap Thrasher can kill pods and shuttles, but that's about it.


Out of pure curiosity...

What fit is this? 700 DPS is nuts coming out of a gank cat.



Three tech II Neutron Blasters, Void ammo, three tech II Magstabs, one each of +10% damage and +10% firing speed rigs.

With my skills and implants, it's 696 DPS. Could be higher if I trained Small Blaster Specialization 5, or splashed out on higher priced hardwirings. (I have all other relevant skills).

Like people have said, thrashers are mostly for lowskilled characters that want to pop autopiloting pods.


Yeah, since that post i have conducted a few ganks with cats. Tried for a skiff last night though and failed misersably with 4 cats in a .5 system. I think he had shield mods though, and wasnt AFK.


Oh yeah man. Skiffs got a buff. They now have Battleship size EHP. You'll never solo a skiff in high sec on a gank. Ever. Only shoot for macks and hulks as far as t2 barges.
Taal Khurin
Acorn Harvesting
#19 - 2013-11-08 22:10:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Taal Khurin
Captain Teuta wrote:


Oh yeah man. Skiffs got a buff. They now have Battleship size EHP. You'll never solo a skiff in high sec on a gank. Ever. Only shoot for macks and hulks as far as t2 barges.


Especially the fearsome nano-skiff orbiting at 14km
Karrl Tian
Doomheim
#20 - 2013-11-08 22:17:25 UTC
Solstice Project wrote:
Sabriz Adoudel wrote:
Leto Thule wrote:
Ra Jackson wrote:
A well skilled, T2 fit Catalyst shells out over 700dps. That's what you want to use for miners. Cheap Thrasher can kill pods and shuttles, but that's about it.


Out of pure curiosity...

What fit is this? 700 DPS is nuts coming out of a gank cat.



Three tech II Neutron Blasters, Void ammo, three tech II Magstabs, one each of +10% damage and +10% firing speed rigs.

With my skills and implants, it's 696 DPS. Could be higher if I trained Small Blaster Specialization 5, or splashed out on higher priced hardwirings. (I have all other relevant skills).

Like people have said, thrashers are mostly for lowskilled characters that want to pop autopiloting pods.

With a properly fitted thrasher you can kill shuttles, noobships, lightly tanked frigates AND their pods
in one go under sentry fire. You can't do that with a catalyst.

Different ships for different situations.

A thrasher is much better suited to gank unded sentry fire than a catalyst.


Was beginning to think I was alone.
12Next page