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New dev blog: ...And Papercuts Were Had By All

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Jonaaz Dsz
DoStuffZ Productions
#321 - 2011-11-18 15:26:31 UTC
Prize for this weeks |337 feature implementations goes to .. ..

*rips envelope*

Team Papercut

\o/ Congrats \o/
CCP Space Cadet
C C P
C C P Alliance
#322 - 2011-11-18 15:27:47 UTC
Aphrodite Skripalle wrote:
jonnykefka wrote:
Don't go back to WoD. Stay with EVE. Please. We have cookies.

^This.
And Chocolate.
What do you want to stay ? I am sure we can bring it.


I LOVE chocolate!
The rest of the team likes beer. :D
CCP Soulblighter
C C P
C C P Alliance
#323 - 2011-11-18 15:31:23 UTC
Qalix wrote:
Quote:
In addition to Dock, Jump, Activate Acceleration Gate, and Enter Wormhole you can also now request to Open Cargo, Scoop to Drone Bay, Scoop to Cargo Bay, Scoop to Ship Maintenance Bay and you’ll attempt to get to the correct range and do the action.

I like all the stuff you guys are doing, but I was a little concerned by this. Often, I do "flyby" scoops where there are a cluster of wrecks or drones sitting in space and I'll line up a course that passes through them. Then I'll do quick scoops/loots as I pass through, but I keep my alignment so that I can warp away quickly if necessary. This change sounds like if I try that, my alignment will be instantly screwed up. If something is in range and thus I don't actually have to move, does my ship alignment change? What if I'm sitting still? Am I understanding it correctly? If I am, there needs to be an option to NOT move towards something.


Flyby scoops are still possible. If you're in range already, nothing new happens. It'll approach if you're out of range to open the can.
Grady Eltoren
Hogyoku
#324 - 2011-11-18 15:41:34 UTC
CCP Soulblighter wrote:
Qalix wrote:
Quote:
In addition to Dock, Jump, Activate Acceleration Gate, and Enter Wormhole you can also now request to Open Cargo, Scoop to Drone Bay, Scoop to Cargo Bay, Scoop to Ship Maintenance Bay and you’ll attempt to get to the correct range and do the action.

I like all the stuff you guys are doing, but I was a little concerned by this. Often, I do "flyby" scoops where there are a cluster of wrecks or drones sitting in space and I'll line up a course that passes through them. Then I'll do quick scoops/loots as I pass through, but I keep my alignment so that I can warp away quickly if necessary. This change sounds like if I try that, my alignment will be instantly screwed up. If something is in range and thus I don't actually have to move, does my ship alignment change? What if I'm sitting still? Am I understanding it correctly? If I am, there needs to be an option to NOT move towards something.


Flyby scoops are still possible. If you're in range already, nothing new happens. It'll approach if you're out of range to open the can.


Ok, another post from me in this (What is soon to be a historical love thread)...

LOOK - another post by a dev literally addressing every single concern a player might have about this change/feature.

I mean it, I went through all 17 pages, and any concerns raised about said features (not begging for other stuff items) was addressed by these guys.

Holy crap!

You guys are so low key about it too.

I am speechless.

Team Papercuts - FTW o7

Everyone owes you a bow for excellent customer service in EVE. Hilmar - take note.
CCP Space Cadet
C C P
C C P Alliance
#325 - 2011-11-18 15:42:28 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Space Cadet
Qalix wrote:
Quote:
In addition to Dock, Jump, Activate Acceleration Gate, and Enter Wormhole you can also now request to Open Cargo, Scoop to Drone Bay, Scoop to Cargo Bay, Scoop to Ship Maintenance Bay and you’ll attempt to get to the correct range and do the action.

I like all the stuff you guys are doing, but I was a little concerned by this. Often, I do "flyby" scoops where there are a cluster of wrecks or drones sitting in space and I'll line up a course that passes through them. Then I'll do quick scoops/loots as I pass through, but I keep my alignment so that I can warp away quickly if necessary. This change sounds like if I try that, my alignment will be instantly screwed up. If something is in range and thus I don't actually have to move, does my ship alignment change? What if I'm sitting still? Am I understanding it correctly? If I am, there needs to be an option to NOT move towards something.


Hopefully Soulblighter won't have to correct me, but I understand it like this:

If you are not in range, you will approach the can, and open it.
If you are already in range, your fly-by will not be interrupted.

Since you're doing a relatively complicated maneuver, you will occasionally experience hiccups. The old hiccup would've been "I missed that can". The new hiccup will be "whoops, missed it, now I'll turn around and go back".

[EDIT] HAH, Soulblighter is faster than me.
CCP Soulblighter
C C P
C C P Alliance
#326 - 2011-11-18 15:47:44 UTC  |  Edited by: CCP Soulblighter
s1n1ster m1n1ster wrote:
CCP Soulblighter wrote:
Daedalus Arcova wrote:

Couple of questions:
- Will plotting routes with the autopilot now include jump bridges?
- Will it be possible to reconnect to drones even if you leave system (or dock in a station) and come back? What about carriers - can they reconnect to fighters off-grid?


Sorry, autopilot routes will not include jump bridges. I looked into what that would take briefly and decided that it fell a little too far outside the scope of what our team was trying to tackle.

Reconnect to drones requires you to be on-grid with the drones in question. You can reconnect after leaving system, docking, re-logging or otherwise abandoning them... the only caveat is that you are in the same ship that launched them to begin with.



Wouldn't it been easy to have a checkbox "use alliance JB or not" in the auopilot settings ???

or was it too difficult due to the fact of calculating the route?

what was the issue in that not being done?

im curios :)


Adding a checkbox is easy. It's making the checkbox do something new that is the hard part Blink

Granted, even in this case I don't think it would be very hard. But it would require a better understanding of the autopilot code than I posses, which means that I would have to spend time getting familiar with the system, track down potential edge cases with injecting new connections with a new connection type into the map data set that autopilot uses to find the shortest route for you. There's a lot of caching of data that happens with map information since there is so much of it, so the idea of screwing with that took the task from an easy addition to a potentially risky feature, in so far as there could be unforeseen fallout with other map features.

Add in the fact that we're talking about feature creep, and my time starts to look like it could be better spent implementing something that benefits more people and causes less potential fallout.

That said, this is the kind of thing BFF should be able to take on no problem since they'll be around to support it. I suggest you post it in the new "small things" thread that's currently stickied in General Discussion if it's not there already.
CCP Soulblighter
C C P
C C P Alliance
#327 - 2011-11-18 15:49:37 UTC
Grady Eltoren wrote:
Everyone owes you a bow for excellent customer service in EVE. Hilmar - take note.


Bows are unnecessary, but we'll gladly accept beer. Cool
Bessa Miros
#328 - 2011-11-18 15:54:07 UTC
Just read these changes - these are great . Nice work and thanks for doing them - esp the drones trying to get back to the ship before you warp out!!
Qalix
Long Jump.
#329 - 2011-11-18 15:55:31 UTC
CCP Space Cadet wrote:
Qalix wrote:
Quote:
In addition to Dock, Jump, Activate Acceleration Gate, and Enter Wormhole you can also now request to Open Cargo, Scoop to Drone Bay, Scoop to Cargo Bay, Scoop to Ship Maintenance Bay and you’ll attempt to get to the correct range and do the action.

I like all the stuff you guys are doing, but I was a little concerned by this. Often, I do "flyby" scoops where there are a cluster of wrecks or drones sitting in space and I'll line up a course that passes through them. Then I'll do quick scoops/loots as I pass through, but I keep my alignment so that I can warp away quickly if necessary. This change sounds like if I try that, my alignment will be instantly screwed up. If something is in range and thus I don't actually have to move, does my ship alignment change? What if I'm sitting still? Am I understanding it correctly? If I am, there needs to be an option to NOT move towards something.


Hopefully Soulblighter won't have to correct me, but I understand it like this:

If you are not in range, you will approach the can, and open it.
If you are already in range, your fly-by will not be interrupted.

Since you're doing a relatively complicated maneuver, you will occasionally experience hiccups. The old hiccup would've been "I missed that can". The new hiccup will be "whoops, missed it, now I'll turn around and go back".

[EDIT] HAH, Soulblighter is faster than me.

I guess I'll reserve final judgement until I actually try it out, but since a missed can would mean I had to select the act for it to tell me "out of range" I won't know I'm changing alignment until I'm actually turning around and that might be a bad thing. Food for thought.

And awesome response time btw
TLweken
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#330 - 2011-11-18 15:58:06 UTC  |  Edited by: TLweken
Probably the only dev blogs where I agree that all the changes made were are useful, well done. CCP should do this so much more, it would make EVE much more fun to play. Also getting all the UI bugs out the game would be useful.
CCP Space Cadet
C C P
C C P Alliance
#331 - 2011-11-18 15:58:20 UTC
CCP Soulblighter wrote:
Grady Eltoren wrote:
Everyone owes you a bow for excellent customer service in EVE. Hilmar - take note.


Bows are unnecessary, but we'll gladly accept beer. Cool


How about crossbows?
I think I'd settle for a crossbow.
Xenial Jesse Taalo
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#332 - 2011-11-18 15:58:40 UTC
Was it you guys who added the minimise button to the mission popups? I know it's too late for requests but um.. here's a request.

· Add a standard close button also.

Simply because with the big CLOSE button at the bottom, hotkey functionality doesn't work. I think this is the only close-able window in the same I can't just close by reflex. Everytime it appears I get reminded, oh, no hotkey working this time.


Any chance?
Typhu5
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#333 - 2011-11-18 16:00:27 UTC
CCP Space Cadet wrote:
CCP Soulblighter wrote:
Grady Eltoren wrote:
Everyone owes you a bow for excellent customer service in EVE. Hilmar - take note.


Bows are unnecessary, but we'll gladly accept beer. Cool


How about crossbows?
I think I'd settle for a crossbow.


That's so rofl and lol.
Jarnis McPieksu
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#334 - 2011-11-18 16:07:57 UTC
CCP Soulblighter wrote:
Grady Eltoren wrote:
Everyone owes you a bow for excellent customer service in EVE. Hilmar - take note.


Bows are unnecessary, but we'll gladly accept beer. Cool


Hilmar; These guys need a vanload of beer after Crucible has shipped. Seriously.
CCP Space Cadet
C C P
C C P Alliance
#335 - 2011-11-18 16:17:10 UTC
I've been watching this forum thread a little too diligently (I have work to do!) but I wanted to thank everybody for all the awesome comments, feedback and questions.

I also wanted to give a shout out to an un-sung hero of team papercuts: CCP Conrad.

The 4 people credited in this devblog are all programmers, who did code work, but for all the changes we cranked out, one single superhero had to QA every feature, about half a dozen times PER FEATURE.

Sadly, this message will get lost to many, since it's on page 17 of the thread, but if everybody could send some thanks towards CCP Conrad, that would be awesome.

Thanks guys!

I'm off to go... actually do my job. You guys have been great!
Mjana
Switzerland EVE Corp.
#336 - 2011-11-18 16:17:39 UTC
Shocked *picking up jaw from the floor*
Are you f*** kidding me? You are awesome!!!111

Being a programmer myself, I'm really impressed you pull all that off in just tree weeks. Especially considering that you were maybe not as familiar with the EVE codebase anymore, since you were working on WoD.

Yes, even if the UI uses the core library (carbon), I suppose you still have to find out how to do the "go there, and THEN do that" stuff (warp 'n jump) and finding/reconnecting to drones on grid.

Is there any chance of you staying in the EVE team for a bit longer and doing some more long-overdue UI tweaks? Like....completely re-doing the corp interface for example? Blink
Vyktor Abyss
Abyss Research
#337 - 2011-11-18 16:23:32 UTC
Any chance you can get us some info on T2 Rig production changes?

This was one of the initial statements and all we've heard is they are making salvage more common in some sites and Med and Small 0ME BPCs drop now. Wasn't there more sweeping changes planned for T2 Rigs/production?

Off topic sorry, your papercuts work is great too, just after some info. Cheers.
Jahpahjay
Mechanical Basterds
#338 - 2011-11-18 16:29:07 UTC
THANK YOU!!! \o/
JP1981
Incostante
#339 - 2011-11-18 16:59:45 UTC
FANTASTIC work guys. Its obvious you guys actually play the game!

i <3 ninja coders!
Nika Dekaia
#340 - 2011-11-18 17:02:44 UTC
Awesome work, guys.

Yay for "I-will-QA-anything-you-throw-at-me" CCP Conrad. (though we might have to check on that after Crucible went live Twisted)

CCP, you REALLY should have a resident papercut-team. Those guys will pay for themselves ten-fold.

This really seems to become that legendary and long asked-for fix-patch. Keep it going.