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SOV tearing down the old.

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Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#281 - 2013-11-01 14:16:25 UTC  |  Edited by: Infinity Ziona
Onictus wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
Onictus wrote:
Dracvlad wrote:
, this is no revolution, its evolution.




No its just making it more annoying for SOV holders, no more no less.

....all while gaining nothing



It means that all those poor truesec systems that you never use which are on the edge of your areas of control can be attacked and you will have to defend them, of course its going to annoy you, what it will do is gain additional fights for you and for others, I guess that is not what you want is it, which will annoy you having to defend your area of control, oh the horror of it!

No, I think he's right. You shouldn't have to be FORCED to do stuff in EvE to hold sov. Sov should be just a given, as long as you can create an alliance and coalition like CFC you should really just be given everything because if you're not you'll "destroy EvE" or "spam lots of siphons" or other really cool stuff.

And like honestly, between sleeping, working, having a life and stuff there really isn't any time to be doing annoying stuff like defending your space or anything like that. We need to be fair after all.


What he's not mentioning is that while he wants it to be really easy to come in and ninja cap a system that it takes 3 weeks to build back up the SOV to do usefull things like put in jump bridges and whatnot.

You can't ninja a system if its got people in it.

If I have to go to work or sleep is it fair for me to demand my AFK piloting freighter full of loot becomes invulnerable? Would you agree with that?

That's basically what you guys are saying. You don't have the people online or the numbers to defend all your systems, but you expect when you're AFK that they become invulnerable and all your useful stuff like upgrades are immune from damage.

That's a WoW mentality. This is not WoW. Loss is an inevitable part of not being at your keyboard when your stuff is floating in space. If you don't want it blown up don't AFK or don't deploy it.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#282 - 2013-11-01 14:21:11 UTC  |  Edited by: Onictus
Infinity Ziona wrote:


That's a WoW mentality. This is not WoW. Loss is an inevitable part of not being at your keyboard when your stuff is floating in space. If you don't want it blown up don't AFK or don't deploy it.




No we had to kick someone out for every system we hold. I spent three months fighting the war for fountain, and another couple weeks cleaning up in delve.

However, asking for around the clock human coverage for the fifty some-odd systems we hold is a little excessive. People have other things they want/need to do, and starting at empty POSs is likely not it


They are far from invulnerable, you can jump in and shoot at all sorts of things.
Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#283 - 2013-11-01 14:53:51 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:

You can't ninja a system if its got people in it.

If I have to go to work or sleep is it fair for me to demand my AFK piloting freighter full of loot becomes invulnerable? Would you agree with that?

That's basically what you guys are saying. You don't have the people online or the numbers to defend all your systems, but you expect when you're AFK that they become invulnerable and all your useful stuff like upgrades are immune from damage.

That's a WoW mentality. This is not WoW. Loss is an inevitable part of not being at your keyboard when your stuff is floating in space. If you don't want it blown up don't AFK or don't deploy it.


strawman is made from straw.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#284 - 2013-11-01 14:56:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Jenn aSide
Tauranon wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:

You can't ninja a system if its got people in it.

If I have to go to work or sleep is it fair for me to demand my AFK piloting freighter full of loot becomes invulnerable? Would you agree with that?

That's basically what you guys are saying. You don't have the people online or the numbers to defend all your systems, but you expect when you're AFK that they become invulnerable and all your useful stuff like upgrades are immune from damage.

That's a WoW mentality. This is not WoW. Loss is an inevitable part of not being at your keyboard when your stuff is floating in space. If you don't want it blown up don't AFK or don't deploy it.


strawman is made from straw.


Special education straw at that.

If infinity is so dead set against "automation" protecting player's stuff when "the players themselves should be doing that", why isn't there a single anti-CONCORD post by said Infinity lol.
Kyle Sev
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#285 - 2013-11-01 15:09:13 UTC
I know this was written back in 2011 so not sure if some of these things have been fixed but wouldent some of the things posted in this blog help improve SOV to a degree? http://www.tentonhammer.com/eve/spymaster/71
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#286 - 2013-11-01 15:11:25 UTC
Destructable stations are still a bad idea.
Yeep
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#287 - 2013-11-01 15:30:36 UTC
Onictus wrote:
Destructable stations are still a bad idea.


I'd be ok with destructible stations if all your assets appeared in the closest NPC station after a delay of say a week. You could even have NPC haulers people could attack to slow the moving process down.
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#288 - 2013-11-01 15:33:15 UTC
Yeep wrote:
Onictus wrote:
Destructable stations are still a bad idea.


I'd be ok with destructible stations if all your assets appeared in the closest NPC station after a delay of say a week. You could even have NPC haulers people could attack to slow the moving process down.



Except no one would ever run out of anything but NPC space. There wouldn't be a reason, anyone with a super fleet could restage your **** for you.
Kyle Sev
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#289 - 2013-11-01 15:38:51 UTC
Onictus wrote:
Yeep wrote:
Onictus wrote:
Destructable stations are still a bad idea.


I'd be ok with destructible stations if all your assets appeared in the closest NPC station after a delay of say a week. You could even have NPC haulers people could attack to slow the moving process down.



Except no one would ever run out of anything but NPC space. There wouldn't be a reason, anyone with a super fleet could restage your **** for you.

maybe make it so they only take 1 hauler worth of stuff. So at random you keep some stuff and lose all the other stuff.
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#290 - 2013-11-01 15:40:33 UTC
Onictus wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:


That's a WoW mentality. This is not WoW. Loss is an inevitable part of not being at your keyboard when your stuff is floating in space. If you don't want it blown up don't AFK or don't deploy it.




No we had to kick someone out for every system we hold. I spent three months fighting the war for fountain, and another couple weeks cleaning up in delve.

However, asking for around the clock human coverage for the fifty some-odd systems we hold is a little excessive. People have other things they want/need to do, and starting at empty POSs is likely not it

this logic would lead to:
- my freighter should be travelling AFK completely safe

Why?
- I already worked hard (scammed lots of people) and got my ship.
- i have RL tasks and can't be online and at the keyboard for 24/7

Onictus wrote:
They are far from invulnerable, you can jump in and shoot at all sorts of things.

Well. You can bump my freighter or target or whatever. But DESTROYING of my freighter can only occur when i'm at the keyboard!

Yes, it looks stupid doesn't it?

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
March rabbit
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#291 - 2013-11-01 15:43:34 UTC
Onictus wrote:
Destructable stations are still a bad idea.

non-destructible stations only lead to 100% coverage of 0.0 by outposts

It's ok when you look at 0.0 like it is high-sec empire without CONCORD. But for "distant wild west" it looks pretty stupid

The Mittani: "the inappropriate drunked joke"
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#292 - 2013-11-01 17:01:04 UTC
March rabbit wrote:
Onictus wrote:
Destructable stations are still a bad idea.

non-destructible stations only lead to 100% coverage of 0.0 by outposts

It's ok when you look at 0.0 like it is high-sec empire without CONCORD. But for "distant wild west" it looks pretty stupid



That would be as lot of eggs to drop.
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#293 - 2013-11-01 19:30:30 UTC
TL;DR

Day tripper, rebel alliance heroes feel entitled to destroy what they insist should still take weeks to build up, because they're bored and other people should serve their amusement.

But ganking miners is still wrong.



"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Dracvlad
Taishi Combine
Astral Alliance
#294 - 2013-11-01 20:06:39 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
TL;DR

Day tripper, rebel alliance heroes feel entitled to destroy what they insist should still take weeks to build up, because they're bored and other people should serve their amusement.

But ganking miners is still wrong.



TL;DR

Miners who don't tank their ships deserve to die, alliances that do not protect and use their space deserve to lose it!

When the going gets tough the Gankers get their CSM rep to change mechanics in their favour.

Blocked: Teckos Pech, Sonya Corvinus, baltec1, Shae Tadaruwa, Wander Prian, Daichi Yamato, Jonah Gravenstein, Merin Ryskin, Linus Gorp
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#295 - 2013-11-01 20:12:01 UTC
Dracvlad wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
TL;DR

Day tripper, rebel alliance heroes feel entitled to destroy what they insist should still take weeks to build up, because they're bored and other people should serve their amusement.

But ganking miners is still wrong.



TL;DR

Miners who don't tank their ships deserve to die, alliances that do not protect and use their space deserve to lose it!


They do protect their space. They drop onto anyone who messes with it.

As for using their space, how about we make a reason for low end truesec to exist, then we can talk about that. You cannot blame people for not wanting to live in the most useless space in the game. The only reason for anyone to own those systems is to flip the bird to everyone else at large.

But are you really saying that by not having 24/7 gatecamps to kill anyone who enters each and every system in Goon space, that they aren't protecting their space?

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Scatim Helicon
State War Academy
Caldari State
#296 - 2013-11-01 20:12:59 UTC
Stations should not be fully destructible since that just pushes everyone to NPC stations to store all their stuff, but should be much more (expensively) upgradeable whilst at the same time being open to much more damage and degradation of both their upgraded and basic facilities by hostile action.

Every time you post a WiS thread, Hilmar strangles a kitten.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#297 - 2013-11-01 20:16:40 UTC  |  Edited by: Infinity Ziona
Onictus wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:


That's a WoW mentality. This is not WoW. Loss is an inevitable part of not being at your keyboard when your stuff is floating in space. If you don't want it blown up don't AFK or don't deploy it.




No we had to kick someone out for every system we hold. I spent three months fighting the war for fountain, and another couple weeks cleaning up in delve.


I know for a fact that CFC's possession of Period Basis and Paragon Soul and every conquerable station in those two regions were not the result of kicking someone out. You bought them with isk.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#298 - 2013-11-01 20:17:44 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Onictus wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:


That's a WoW mentality. This is not WoW. Loss is an inevitable part of not being at your keyboard when your stuff is floating in space. If you don't want it blown up don't AFK or don't deploy it.




No we had to kick someone out for every system we hold. I spent three months fighting the war for fountain, and another couple weeks cleaning up in delve.

However, asking for around the clock human coverage for the fifty some-odd systems we hold is a little excessive. People have other things they want/need to do, and starting at empty POSs is likely not it


They are far from invulnerable, you can jump in and shoot at all sorts of things.

I know for a fact that CFC's possession of Period Basis and every conquerable station in those two regions were not the result of kicking someone out. You bought them with isk.


Buying land... now that has no historical precedent of any kind whatsoever. What scoundrels.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.
Infinity Ziona
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#299 - 2013-11-01 20:21:38 UTC
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Onictus wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:


That's a WoW mentality. This is not WoW. Loss is an inevitable part of not being at your keyboard when your stuff is floating in space. If you don't want it blown up don't AFK or don't deploy it.




No we had to kick someone out for every system we hold. I spent three months fighting the war for fountain, and another couple weeks cleaning up in delve.

However, asking for around the clock human coverage for the fifty some-odd systems we hold is a little excessive. People have other things they want/need to do, and starting at empty POSs is likely not it


They are far from invulnerable, you can jump in and shoot at all sorts of things.

I know for a fact that CFC's possession of Period Basis and every conquerable station in those two regions were not the result of kicking someone out. You bought them with isk.


Buying land... now that has no historical precedent of any kind whatsoever. What scoundrels.

I didn't comment as to whether it was good or bad. I'm merely correcting his error on fighting for every system they hold.

CCP Fozzie “We can see how much money people are making in nullsec and it is, a gigantic amount, a shit-ton… in null sec anomalies. “*

Kaalrus pwned..... :)
Kaarous Aldurald
Black Hydra Consortium.
#300 - 2013-11-01 20:23:31 UTC
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Kaarous Aldurald wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:
Onictus wrote:
Infinity Ziona wrote:


That's a WoW mentality. This is not WoW. Loss is an inevitable part of not being at your keyboard when your stuff is floating in space. If you don't want it blown up don't AFK or don't deploy it.




No we had to kick someone out for every system we hold. I spent three months fighting the war for fountain, and another couple weeks cleaning up in delve.

However, asking for around the clock human coverage for the fifty some-odd systems we hold is a little excessive. People have other things they want/need to do, and starting at empty POSs is likely not it


They are far from invulnerable, you can jump in and shoot at all sorts of things.

I know for a fact that CFC's possession of Period Basis and every conquerable station in those two regions were not the result of kicking someone out. You bought them with isk.


Buying land... now that has no historical precedent of any kind whatsoever. What scoundrels.

I didn't comment as to whether it was good or bad. I'm merely correcting his error on fighting for every system they hold.


You do realize he means Fatal Ascension, right? He said "fifty some-odd systems". Pretty sure the CFC as a whole holds far more.

L2Read.

"Verily, I have often laughed at the weaklings who thought themselves good because they had no claws."

One of ours, ten of theirs.

Best Meltdown Ever.