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EVE: The Free to Play REVOLUTION!

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Maekchu
Doomheim
#121 - 2013-10-31 08:54:33 UTC
Farm that ISK to get yourself a PLEX, and you got yourself a F2P.

Your "initial" investment is only the first month of subs.

But no, the F2P model does not work in EVE, because of how the skill system works.
Yummy Chocolate
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#122 - 2013-10-31 09:23:00 UTC
Kialopreyst wrote:
Jim McMorris wrote:
All current subscribers receive free copy of game.


You know that the software is already free right?

he said "free copy of game". that means we lost.

Frostys Virpio > CCP: Continously Crying Playerbase

Felicity Love >... was thinking "moar popcorn"... but now, seeing the truly awesome contribution this thread is going to make to the Greater Glory Of EVE.... imagonnamakkadapizza....
Lugalbandak
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#123 - 2013-10-31 09:30:01 UTC
uuh dunno , already plexing my accounts , it is kinda free , jeah okey i need to grind 600mil but thats okey

The police horse is the only animal in the world that haz his male genitals on his back
GreenSeed
#124 - 2013-10-31 09:31:11 UTC
the f2p model is not compatible with eve. and looking at the new generation of MMOs, none of the big ones is f2p, they are all paid. nwo, everquestnext, titan, etc, etc.

also, titan is a space mmo from blizzard, once it gets the official announcement this general forum will get unbearable.
Skeln Thargensen
Doomheim
#125 - 2013-10-31 09:37:25 UTC
Xavier Higdon wrote:
I was seriously excited about Star Citizen until they called a corvette size vessel a capital ship. What kind of wimpy space empire can't build anything bigger than that? Dogfights don't interest me one bit, I want grand strategy.


yes this is what makes the comparisons void, it's all on a different scale. eve won't scale down and SC won't scale up.

I'm excited for it but i won't be dropping my eve subs. what makes me drop my eve subs is when i've done everything and there's no new big things in a couple of year's time.

(don't worry, i'll contract my stuffs in this event)

forums.  serious business.
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#126 - 2013-10-31 09:41:18 UTC
Why can't eve survive? Eve has been even on recent years one of the mostly reliable income MMO in the western market.

Stop making idiotic presumptions.


Someday what wil die again are these stupid free to ply games.

Free to play games are not games, they are MADE to you SUFFER.. and that is needed, because if you do not suffer while playignyou will not spend money to reduce this suffering

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#127 - 2013-10-31 09:42:21 UTC
Jim McMorris wrote:
Alright guys I've got this one.

At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run,


Says who apart from you?

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#128 - 2013-10-31 09:44:08 UTC
Jim McMorris wrote:
"Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?"
Because I want this excellent game, not something completely different, no matter how cheap it is (especially since I don't know whether I'll get what I pay for in that other case). You're also setting up a pretty silly false dichotomy. Ignoring the ridiculous presumption that the game is bad, your question is about as meaningful as:

“Why am I still playing this game when I could paint the ceiling in this wonderful fuchsia hue?”
or
“Why am I still playing this game when apples are so tasty?”
or
“Why am I still playing this game when cold fusion would solve the energy crisis?”

Quote:
This question will mean people will unsubscribe.
You're making a huge and unfounded presumption that the question is asked at all, without any consideration of who's asking it. Anyone who asks this does so already because they are not happy with the game — the business model behind it is not a factor. CCP could change into a PMC and they would still leave because they are fundamentally disinterested in the product. They're not lost customers — they're just people who would never have stuck around anyway.

So here's a counter-question: what is there to gain to make these people keep playing a game they have no interest in?

Quote:
Okay guys, so here's how I think CCP should do it.

1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start getting scammed by goons.
2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay.
3) Population of EVE rises. There are huge huge wars because there are so many people fighting and having fun.
4) EVE is a lot better, more dynamic. Look at all of the politics with 400k people fighting for a finite amount of space. Imagine 5 million people fighting for the same amount of space? It would be crazy. Absolutely crazy.

This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well.
No, it would not, and points 3 and 4 do not follow from the premise of points 1 and 2.

What you're asking for is for them to shut down EVE and create a new game with the same IP. This means taking their entire customer base behind the shed and hoping that after that treatment, some of them will come back afterwards. There is little to nothing to suggest that they will. A game needs to be designed for F2P — it can't be transformed into one. Doubly so if the game is competitive since you must design your money-making schemes in such a way that they gel with the competition itself. All the ideas you have require a complete redesign of the game to take the new customer behaviours into account, because without such a redesign, the game will be insanely imbalanced and simply topple over.

You'll notice that all the money-making schemes they have right now are completely reliant on it being a subscription-based game. You are trying to use them as examples of what they can expand on if the game was made F2P, without considering that doing so means those examples will immediately be rendered invalid.

Oh, and…
Quote:
At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run,
…based on what, exactly?
Kagura Nikon
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#129 - 2013-10-31 09:45:22 UTC
GreenSeed wrote:
the f2p model is not compatible with eve. and looking at the new generation of MMOs, none of the big ones is f2p, they are all paid. nwo, everquestnext, titan, etc, etc.

also, titan is a space mmo from blizzard, once it gets the official announcement this general forum will get unbearable.



You mean the one that was scrapped in may this year and wil start all over again?

"If brute force does not solve your problem....  then you are  surely not using enough!"
Santo Trafficante
Kira Inc.
#130 - 2013-10-31 09:46:48 UTC
Jim McMorris wrote:
Alright guys I've got this one.

At the moment, EVE cannot survive in the long-run, which is what CCP want the game to be a - a game lasting decades, not years. With biggies like Star Citizen coming round with one-time fees and no-subs, there's gonna be some serious questions asked by the players. Questions like this:

"Why am I still paying for this bad bad game when star citizen is a lot cheaper?"

This question will mean people will unsubscribe. We've also noticed a big trend in the MMO world going away from subs, that trend isn't fully done yet. But when it is, who knows what'll happen to the CCP.

The big business model transFORMATION

Okay guys, so here's how I think CCP should do it.

1) EVE becomes free. Anybody can make account, download and start getting scammed by goons.

2) CCP sells character slots, ship paints, golden pods and more clothes and stuff. Basically, CCP sells as much as it can that doesn't have an impact on gameplay.

3) Population of EVE rises. There are huge huge wars because there are so many people fighting and having fun.

4) EVE is a lot better, more dynamic. Look at all of the politics with 400k people fighting for a finite amount of space. Imagine 5 million people fighting for the same amount of space? It would be crazy. Absolutely crazy.

This would probably INCREASE CCPs profits as well. I'd recommend that they do this IPO on the stockmarket they were talking about, as that will get the big businesses interested and posting articles about this awesome sci-fi sim. All of the hardcore eve fans, like the mitani, will probably buy shares - so they'll have even more money to improve the game.

As they improve the game more people play and buy cosmetic items and CCP get richer.

Thoughts please.


Thread update:

Thanks for feedback guys, I think there are a few more points worth adding here.

1) CCP should also consider the option of buy to play. Perhaps a £39.99 to get access to the game client, but fees after that - this would ensure there is a paywall to supplement CCP profits and keep out the hacking community. With the increased profits, CCP would have greater confidence in following a strictly cosmetic cash4items scheme.

Buy to play has been an extremely successful model and I think it is particularly relevant to EVE ONLINE. Why? The model in GW2 has triggered slow but steady growth, this is the type of growth CCP has always been experiencing with EVE. http://massively.joystiq.com/2013/08/23/lead-designer-says-guild-wars-2-is-growing-its-playerbase/

2) Secondly, a steam launch as free to play would be a great bolster to current numbers. 0.9 of the world's population has a steam account. http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/10/30/0-9-of-the-global-population-have-steam-accounts/


Get the F*** out Lamington and learn to eve cuz from what u wrote i see u got no effin clue how the things goin'
Temuken Radzu
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#131 - 2013-10-31 10:23:24 UTC
It might be possible to introduce a free to play model in eve together with a paid model. The idea is this: when you have a subscription or plex, you will play the game normally like it is now. But when playing without a subscription, the time it takes to train your skills will be doubled and you can't fly capital ships.
How does this sound?
Solstice Project
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#132 - 2013-10-31 10:28:35 UTC
Santo Trafficante wrote:
Get the F*** out Lamington and learn to eve cuz from what u wrote i see u got no effin clue how the things goin'
Santo ! \o/ :D
Debora Tsung
Perkone
Caldari State
#133 - 2013-10-31 10:36:16 UTC
Temuken Radzu wrote:
It might be possible to introduce a free to play model in eve together with a paid model. The idea is this: when you have a subscription or plex, you will play the game normally like it is now. But when playing without a subscription, the time it takes to train your skills will be doubled and you can't fly capital ships.
How does this sound?



Still bad.

EVE and f2p equals bad. No matter how you put it.

Stupidity should be a bannable offense.

Fighting back is more fun than not.

Sticky: AFK Cloaking Thread It's not pretty, but it's there.
Xavier Higdon
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#134 - 2013-10-31 12:46:23 UTC
If EVE was to go F2P we would lose all of the intelligent people such as Tippia. The man or woman(sorry but this is EVE and you never know), is a reasonable person, with fully formed thoughts and ideas the likes of which you won't find in WOW or LOL. It is players like her that are the backbone of EVE. The goons might have numbers, but without an intelligent person leading the masses they would have nothing. And Tippia isn't alone, there are thousands of people like that, capable of seeing beyond the killmails and wallet size to the big picture that makes EVE so amazing.
Elysium Foxx
Republic Military School
Minmatar Republic
#135 - 2013-10-31 14:18:44 UTC
There is no fun in losing free stuff..... cos its.... worth nothing.

The game would become pretty meaningless.... Go away with your silly ideas.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#136 - 2013-10-31 14:25:59 UTC
Temuken Radzu wrote:
It might be possible to introduce a free to play model in eve together with a paid model. The idea is this: when you have a subscription or plex, you will play the game normally like it is now. But when playing without a subscription, the time it takes to train your skills will be doubled and you can't fly capital ships.
How does this sound?



*Might* have worked when the game was new. But doing that now just means that a bunch of 100 mil SP toons that don't fly capitals anyways won't be paying subs. Bad idea.
Temuken Radzu
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#137 - 2013-10-31 15:17:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Temuken Radzu
Jenn aSide wrote:
Temuken Radzu wrote:
It might be possible to introduce a free to play model in eve together with a paid model. The idea is this: when you have a subscription or plex, you will play the game normally like it is now. But when playing without a subscription, the time it takes to train your skills will be doubled and you can't fly capital ships.
How does this sound?



*Might* have worked when the game was new. But doing that now just means that a bunch of 100 mil SP toons that don't fly capitals anyways won't be paying subs. Bad idea.


Most of those people already dont pay trough plex. This idea is meant that you can play the game as usual, but it will take a looooooong time before you can fly certain ships or use modules this way.
I believe if you want to train a long skill as new player it will be very attractive to take a sub for a month or two to spare yourself a 70 days of training Cruiser 5 or something like that.

At least this idea is better than OP's themepark type of F2P
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#138 - 2013-10-31 15:21:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Temuken Radzu wrote:
Most of those people already dont pay trough plex.
That means they still generate income for CCP. With your idea, they no longer will since they have no reason to get those PLEXes any more.

That's really a general problem with all the kinds of “paid/free hybrids” that are suggested every now and then: they never really provide any solid reason for people to keep paying, little to nothing to compensate for all that lost income. Of course, since F2P and subscription are to business models, rather than just two payment schemes, the (near?) impossibility of combining in any sensible them is hardly surprising.
embrel
BamBam Inc.
#139 - 2013-10-31 15:27:19 UTC
No.
I assume it will take only a short time until F2P becomes P2W. Only with clothing, paintjobs and so on EVE will not generate the necessary cashflows. So the next step will need to be P2W.
And at the time I will not even be able to threaten to unsub.
Icarus Able
Refuse.Resist
#140 - 2013-10-31 15:44:50 UTC
Temuken Radzu wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
Temuken Radzu wrote:
It might be possible to introduce a free to play model in eve together with a paid model. The idea is this: when you have a subscription or plex, you will play the game normally like it is now. But when playing without a subscription, the time it takes to train your skills will be doubled and you can't fly capital ships.
How does this sound?



*Might* have worked when the game was new. But doing that now just means that a bunch of 100 mil SP toons that don't fly capitals anyways won't be paying subs. Bad idea.


Most of those people already dont pay trough plex. This idea is meant that you can play the game as usual, but it will take a looooooong time before you can fly certain ships or use modules this way.
I believe if you want to train a long skill as new player it will be very attractive to take a sub for a month or two to spare yourself a 70 days of training Cruiser 5 or something like that.

At least this idea is better than OP's themepark type of F2P



Someone paying through PLEX is giving CCP almost twice the money. As a plex costs £15 and a sub costs £8. Someone else has to buy the PLEX for £15.



No to F2P all o.f the ideas in this thread for it all awful and riddled with problems. Theres no need to go F2P.