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Ice still moving to null?
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Acac Sunflyier
The Ascended Academy
#1 - 2011-11-18 04:41:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Acac Sunflyier
You guys gave heavy impressions during the summer that this expansion was going to have massive redistribution. But, on the crucible page, there wasn't anything about it and you've been mum on the topic. Any change to the plan?

Edit: By you guys, I mean CCP.
Shivus Tao
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#2 - 2011-11-18 04:59:20 UTC
It would be nice even if the initial redistribution is just temporary. The systems with terrible sec status and thus not worth putting military upgrades in need something to make them actually worth holding and populating.
Acac Sunflyier
The Ascended Academy
#3 - 2011-11-18 05:04:07 UTC
Shivus Tao wrote:
It would be nice even if the initial redistribution is just temporary. The systems with terrible sec status and thus not worth putting military upgrades in need something to make them actually worth holding and populating.



Well there was a dev blog about it before the new forums. They were really excited about it. CCP Soundwave even described it as more focused on industry changes than anything else in a video. But, then everything just dropped off the radar. With Crucible coming out on the 29th, you'd expect to hear something
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#4 - 2011-11-18 05:24:18 UTC
i hope not, we want high-sec ice to stay there forever

Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Assagai Invari
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2011-11-18 05:28:18 UTC
Andski wrote:
i hope not, we want high-sec ice to stay there forever


Quite right, because at least it gives the Goons something to do and forces miners to be aware rather than AFK mining.

"Wives are just Tech 2 girlfriends...cost more, higher resists, stricter fitting requirements, and they use more powergrid." - Admiral Castine.
Acac Sunflyier
The Ascended Academy
#6 - 2011-11-18 05:33:03 UTC
Assagai Invari wrote:
Andski wrote:
i hope not, we want high-sec ice to stay there forever


Quite right, because at least it gives the Goons something to do and forces miners to be aware rather than AFK mining.


yeah but moving it to null does the exact same thing.


Anybody remember this dev blog?

http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=946


ole source of ice and high-end minerals
For further discussion. Nullsec should be the only place we're injecting (at least some of the) ices, zydrine, megacyte and morphite into the game. This ensures that nullsec mining retains a unique value proposition, and guarantees that mining time for these types is priced according the risk and effort involved in nullsec extraction.
Denidil
Cascades Mountain Operatives
#7 - 2011-11-18 05:53:15 UTC
it was listed as CONSIDERED, not "we're doing this", not even "we might do this" but simply "it was an idea bounced around"

Tedium and difficulty are not the same thing, if you don't realize this then STFU about game design.
Katrina Oniseki
Oniseki-Raata Internal Watch
Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
#8 - 2011-11-18 08:54:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Katrina Oniseki
You people are ******* dense.

Denidil wrote:
it was listed as CONSIDERED, not "we're doing this", not even "we might do this" but simply "it was an idea bounced around"


QFT

Katrina Oniseki
pussnheels
Viziam
#9 - 2011-11-18 09:18:27 UTC
Katrina Oniseki wrote:
You people are ******* dense.

Denidil wrote:
it was listed as CONSIDERED, not "we're doing this", not even "we might do this" but simply "it was an idea bounced around"


QFT

this
Pretty sure they will not remove every thing IF they ever did
would be a hillarious sight all those cap pilots mining their own ice

I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire
Acac Sunflyier
The Ascended Academy
#10 - 2011-11-18 10:46:12 UTC
I distinctly remember CCP Soundwave, in a YouTube video, describing this as being a heavy industry change (think it was an AT video).
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#11 - 2011-11-18 10:48:49 UTC
Acac Sunflyier wrote:
Assagai Invari wrote:
Andski wrote:
i hope not, we want high-sec ice to stay there forever


Quite right, because at least it gives the Goons something to do and forces miners to be aware rather than AFK mining.


yeah but moving it to null does the exact same thing.


Anybody remember this dev blog?

http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=946


ole source of ice and high-end minerals
For further discussion. Nullsec should be the only place we're injecting (at least some of the) ices, zydrine, megacyte and morphite into the game. This ensures that nullsec mining retains a unique value proposition, and guarantees that mining time for these types is priced according the risk and effort involved in nullsec extraction.



It was never about moving all Ice out of hi-sec, only about leaving only the lowest value ice in hi-sec.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016
Acac Sunflyier
The Ascended Academy
#12 - 2011-11-18 10:51:02 UTC
Malcanis wrote:
Acac Sunflyier wrote:
Assagai Invari wrote:
Andski wrote:
i hope not, we want high-sec ice to stay there forever


Quite right, because at least it gives the Goons something to do and forces miners to be aware rather than AFK mining.


yeah but moving it to null does the exact same thing.


Anybody remember this dev blog?

http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=946


ole source of ice and high-end minerals
For further discussion. Nullsec should be the only place we're injecting (at least some of the) ices, zydrine, megacyte and morphite into the game. This ensures that nullsec mining retains a unique value proposition, and guarantees that mining time for these types is priced according the risk and effort involved in nullsec extraction.



It was never about moving all Ice out of hi-sec, only about leaving only the lowest value ice in hi-sec.


That's actually the case already. All there are in highsec is racial cubes, the lowest value ice. However, so many people in highsec mine and bot it, it has kept the isotope price very low.
Dradius Calvantia
Lip Shords
#13 - 2011-11-18 10:58:36 UTC
Moving ICE to null allows easier botting. Mining in H sec is way more risky than mining in Null.

A correctly set up ICE mining operation in any Null sec system allows 100% risk free ICE mining.

The only way to stop this is an AFK cloaker in system.. but you still will not get kills, just prevent them from mining.
Acac Sunflyier
The Ascended Academy
#14 - 2011-11-18 10:59:58 UTC
Dradius Calvantia wrote:
Moving ICE to null allows easier botting. Mining in H sec is way more risky than mining in Null.

A correctly set up ICE mining operation in any Null sec system allows 100% risk free ICE mining.

The only way to stop this is an AFK cloaker in system.. but you still will not get kills, just prevent them from mining.


Please, preventing mining is a passive economic warfare.
Tanya Powers
Doomheim
#15 - 2011-11-18 11:07:18 UTC
Acac Sunflyier wrote:
You guys gave heavy impressions during the summer that this expansion was going to have massive redistribution. But, on the crucible page, there wasn't anything about it and you've been mum on the topic. Any change to the plan?


Why should it change?

Why should ice go to null?

How many numbers or graphics are public about the number of bots in high sec or low/null sec mining this one and the real in game impact, not just "words" from nerds that spend all day in front of their computer and think their pod is their real life...

Then without miners in high sec, how Goons could possibly make sort that ganking mechanics change, or force Concord reinforcement so high sec becomes more boring than ever and null sec less appealing than it ever bean?

Very sure there are a few mechanics they're willing to force CCP to change that, they just figured that pissing off the biggest number of players and make them unsub was the best way to model the game has THEY want, and they made it.

Yada yada yada...
Ingvar Angst
Nasty Pope Holding Corp
#16 - 2011-11-18 11:55:53 UTC
Shivus Tao wrote:
It would be nice even if the initial redistribution is just temporary. The systems with terrible sec status and thus not worth putting military upgrades in need something to make them actually worth holding and populating.


Don't be stupid. It would crush the economy.

Six months in the hole... it changes a man.
Ciar Meara
PIE Inc.
Khimi Harar
#17 - 2011-11-18 12:05:09 UTC
I was never intended to move to null only.

The only thing they thought about was changing the belts to be exhaustible.

- [img]http://go-dl1.eve-files.com/media/corp/janus/ceosig.jpg[/img] [yellow]English only please. Zymurgist[/yellow]
Acac Sunflyier
The Ascended Academy
#18 - 2011-11-18 12:13:21 UTC
Ciar Meara wrote:
I was never intended to move to null only.

The only thing they thought about was changing the belts to be exhaustible.


Do you have a source proving this?
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#19 - 2011-11-18 12:19:16 UTC
Dradius Calvantia wrote:
Moving ICE to null allows easier botting. Mining in H sec is way more risky than mining in Null.

A correctly set up ICE mining operation in any Null sec system allows 100% risk free ICE mining.

The only way to stop this is an AFK cloaker in system.. but you still will not get kills, just prevent them from mining.



You don't need kills to win a fight.
Adunh Slavy
#20 - 2011-11-18 12:30:56 UTC
I doubt CCP would move all Ice to null, unless they also put ice in wormhole exploration sites. WHs are very dependent on ice products being widley available all over high sec. If ice were only in null, then ice would likely end up with much fewer distribution points on the markets, the major trade hubs.

Not only is that not good for the WH life style, it reduces the market dynamics of the game, reduces game play options, makes Eve more bland. Personaly I am too lazy to bother with it, but I know a number of people that ship ice products to regions far and wide. They can make a profit doing this because ice products are all over the place, there is enough varinace in distribution and potential transaction cost to make it worth while.

If the sources were only in null, then the majority of the transaction cost would be consumed in getting it to the major trade hubs and there would be little left for the high sec transportation trade players - their incentive to redistribute would be much reduced.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt
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