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thinking of moving into a hole purely for PI - doable?

Author
zhoed3
Independent Trade and Exploration Corporation
#1 - 2013-10-24 08:52:28 UTC
I've been running my PI out of lowsec for a bit, but I'm thinking I may make more money from PI in a hole.

Is it doable (cost-wise) to relocate to a hole for PI - I'm thinking of bringing in 2-3 characters, all can scan and cloak, all can fly haulers though only one can fly an Orca.

I don't think any of them would be capable of running sleeper sites.

What are the basics I'd need to bring in - I'm guessing a defended POS and some storage.

Would the PI yields of a C2 or C1 support the running costs and still provide reasonable profit - i.e. 400 - 500 mill per month after POS running costs are covered?

ta
Mike Bravos
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2013-10-24 09:00:34 UTC
Its doable but would be difficult running all that as one person. I would highly recommend at-least a medium pos setup to use as a storage/staging area. Anymore specific questions please let me know.

If you are interested I've got an abandoned wormhole for sale with exceptional PI - honestly the best I've seen after scanning over 100 wh's. Its got Lava x2, barren x3, storm, oceanic, and only one gas. Could setup some great reactions and ISK generation here. Currently selling for 400 mil but would give you half off since your going solo. Anymore specific questions living in wh or about purchasing this one feel free to convo me ingame. Good luck!

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=289537
Glyndi
Doom Generation
Best Intentions.
#3 - 2013-10-24 09:20:36 UTC
zhoed3 wrote:
I've been running my PI out of lowsec for a bit, but I'm thinking I may make more money from PI in a hole.

Is it doable (cost-wise) to relocate to a hole for PI - I'm thinking of bringing in 2-3 characters, all can scan and cloak, all can fly haulers though only one can fly an Orca.

I don't think any of them would be capable of running sleeper sites.

What are the basics I'd need to bring in - I'm guessing a defended POS and some storage.

Would the PI yields of a C2 or C1 support the running costs and still provide reasonable profit - i.e. 400 - 500 mill per month after POS running costs are covered?

ta


Currently in our C5 I have 4 characters doing PI making me an easy 1b per month. As this isn't my only source of income I've set it up to have the least amount of maintenance as possible. Also consider training your ORE Frig and Gas Harvesting skills max asap. When you find CORE gas sites each character has a chance to mine approx. 40m each before the sleepers spawn.

***Note: Core gas sites are really only found in C5/C6 WHs
Sushi Nardieu
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-10-24 10:17:01 UTC
Make sure you prescribe Valium when you setup your PI and gas harvesters.

The Guns of Knowledge 

7enn
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#5 - 2013-10-24 12:08:13 UTC
It's totally doable. Just dive until you find one you like, drop a pos (size does matter), anchor a cha and you are in business. Pick the system based on what you want to make. Some PI products are more profitable than others. Some PI products are more abundantly produced. (you can make 100 of X a day and sell X for 1,000 isk/unit OR you can make 1,000 Y a day and sell Y for 200 isk/unit).

Y makes more isk, but it probably involves more work.... hauling and what not.

My PI strategy has always been most isk for least work, but it's not my primary focus. If you're doing it as your income then you'll probably just go for most isk. Look at a couple of things when picking your PI product. Price per unit. How many units you can make per time. Also look at the volume that is bought and sold on a daily basis. (You can make 300 wonder widgets a day, but if the market only moves 100 wonder widgets a day then you're mostly making a big pile of wonder widgets and not maximizing the isk into your wallet).

If all this market stuff gives you a headache.... buy an enyo and go shoot people. Once you're back to steady go ahead and set up that next planet!!!!

Just math.... wh systems have a truesec of -1.0. It doesn't get any better than that for resources.
zhoed3
Independent Trade and Exploration Corporation
#6 - 2013-10-24 13:19:56 UTC
Thanks guys

I shoot people with my alt, it is great fun...but is also a bit of a drain on my funds Lol hence the PI

Lots of good info here, I'll be scraping together some iskies for a tower, POS mods and first couple of months fuel whilst I look for a suitable hole.

Mike Bravo - if I had the iskies to hand I may well have snapped up that hole off you, but as it is I'm probably not going to be in a position to jump into this for a couple of months whilst I assemble cash, mods, tower, fuel, ships etc

Always good to try new stuff too Cool

Zhoed3
Oska Rus
Free Ice Cream People
#7 - 2013-10-24 13:51:19 UTC
3 chars should be able to plex account and maybe have enough left to fuel medium pos. PI is same in any hole. Truesec is -1.0 in all holes.
7enn
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-10-24 17:44:42 UTC
-1.0 in all wh yes. He's contemplating the move from lowsex to wh space, so the -1.0 truesex is significant when compared to lowsex truesex.

Something to consider is the deployable space huts in the next expansion. I'm not sure of their volume, but they may be an option if they hold enough. My understanding is they are unscannable. Thinking past that, if all your guys are in cloaky haulers that probe, then I'm not sure you even need a pos. I guess it depends on what you are actually doing. If you take the pos fuel out the equation, then the profit goes waaaaay up. No pos = more profit + more hauling.
Glyndi
Doom Generation
Best Intentions.
#9 - 2013-10-24 18:41:12 UTC
7enn wrote:
-1.0 in all wh yes. He's contemplating the move from lowsex to wh space, so the -1.0 truesex is significant when compared to lowsex truesex.

Something to consider is the deployable space huts in the next expansion. I'm not sure of their volume, but they may be an option if they hold enough. My understanding is they are unscannable. Thinking past that, if all your guys are in cloaky haulers that probe, then I'm not sure you even need a pos. I guess it depends on what you are actually doing. If you take the pos fuel out the equation, then the profit goes waaaaay up. No pos = more profit + more hauling.


I think they said to storage of that deploy-able is 50,000m3 which is a good amount but would fill fast. 1-2 weeks worth of Tier 2 PI from mine will fill 1.5 Epythals.
zhoed3
Independent Trade and Exploration Corporation
#10 - 2013-10-24 22:45:03 UTC
I had thought about the deployable depot that's coming, but I'd thought that it was scannable/probe-able?

If I can hide a depot or two in a hole, with some cloaky haulers + Orca, then I'd certainly give that some thought, no POS running costs is obviously a boost to profit, high levels of paranoia + cloak will keep my adrenaline levels up Lol as would the thought of maybe having to leave an empty Orca hanging around in space as it's not the most maneuverable of ships for sliding up to a poco

Something else to think about, but the basic premise of doing solo PI in a hole sounds do-able, so onwards I go Big smile
TXG SYNC
Dad Jokes R Us
#11 - 2013-10-24 23:01:35 UTC
zhoed3 wrote:
...some cloaky haulers + Orca, then I'd certainly give that some thought...


Most itinerant wormholers who don't want POS expense just use an Orca and 2 characters. Put a T3 in the hold for running sites, a cloaky scanning frigate, and a hauler to get your PI out (or not, you can just use the Orca if you don't mind the risk).

Heck, we provide a POS for our members and many nevertheless elect to keep their shiny ships and loot in their Orca. More secure against awoxers.
Evangelina Nolen
Sama Guild
#12 - 2013-10-25 07:25:35 UTC
Sushi Nardieu wrote:
Make sure you prescribe Valium when you setup your PI and gas harvesters.


This, F*CK PI.
Xen Solarus
Furious Destruction and Salvage
#13 - 2013-10-25 16:52:34 UTC
Very doable, just don't go higher than a C3 if you're looking to do this solo, capitals would ruin your day.

Finding one with the right mix of planets would be the challenge, most i imagine would already be claimed. Putting out a reward to get someone else to do the searching for you would be your best bet. Just be sure to pay upon establishment of the POS to avoid the backstab.

And finally, if you do find one, and are serious about moving in, i'd highly recommend you setup a large tower with at least 6 of each type of ECM and all the trimmings. That should keep you nice and safe. Then You'd just need some POCOs! Cool

All the best.

Post with your main, like a BOSS!

And no, i don't live in highsec.  As if that would make your opinion any less wrong.  

Borsek
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#14 - 2013-10-28 10:51:59 UTC
C1 hisec, medium dickstar pos, bring at least 5 chars, combat scan hole before grabbing the PI. Either buy a hole with pocos or hire a group or waste your own time taking down pocos and setting up your own. ROI with 5 chars should be about 1 month with a 300m pos, 250m fuel and 5 pocos - 1.4b investment for everything (about 30M/char/5planets), 10m/char/day/5planets. So about 1.5b/ month, just enough to plex 2 accounts and 1char free to do other stuff with.
Phoenix Jones
Small-Arms Fire
#15 - 2013-10-28 18:28:15 UTC
A few notes.

1) make sure at least two characters can scan. You'd hate to lose your hole cause your 1 scan character got podded.

2) have at least two scan ships. A t1 scan ship is fine, fit a proto cloak. I would fit probe launchers on your indies also.

Yaay!!!!

zhoed3
Independent Trade and Exploration Corporation
#16 - 2013-10-29 22:54:13 UTC
thanks guys,

all characters (4 or 5) can scan, all ships will have probes and there'll always be at least one character in the hole at all times. Plan is for them to move in and stay there unless they are shipping stuff out/in.

Remaining character will be out and about elsewhere no doubt getting into trouble Pirate

Just saving up the iskies, gathering together tower, mods, ships and finalising training - probably be moving into a hole around christmas time, maybe a little earlier.
Evangelina Nolen
Sama Guild
#17 - 2013-10-30 01:45:11 UTC
zhoed3 wrote:

Just saving up the iskies, gathering together tower, mods, ships and finalising training - probably be moving into a hole around christmas time, maybe a little earlier.


F that noise. Find a wh with C3 static, go HAM.
Fitz Muller
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#18 - 2013-10-30 23:18:18 UTC
I have 7 PI toons each with 5 planets and advanced planetology level 3, and each character brings in about 400mil per month in PI goods. That is plenty to pay for fueling a tower and plexing the accounts. In saying that, I don't enjoy doing PI, have and I am lazy, so my extractors are on 7 day cycles. If you were into it more and did a 24 hour cycle or so you would easily double what I am making.