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CCP - Why are Somer still in operation?

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Baali Tekitsu
AQUILA INC
#61 - 2013-10-28 17:16:13 UTC
Nathalie LaPorte wrote:
David Kir wrote:


So there you go, Somer is an authorized ETC reseller andthere's a private agreement between them and CCP.

How's that, second rate goonion citizen?


Actually Somer isn't on that list, if you bother to look, so "that" is pretty bad, and you're wrong.


No, youre wrong, as they obviously didnt get banned and therefor ARE an (in)official ETC reseller.

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Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#62 - 2013-10-28 17:16:44 UTC
Na Und wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
Yeah I know, but if CCP don't have the decency to give us an answer then I don't see why I should stop re-posting threads that have already been posted.
At the end of the day I'm going to continue until either they ban me, or they decide that perhaps addressing the concerns of their community is a good idea.
Honestly, it's been going on long enough that I don't really care which anymore. I've got GTA V to play, and by the end of the year 2 shiny new consoles. I'm certainly not going to sit in silence while they discriminate against the rest of the community however.


You could've shortened your post simply by typing, "waah."
Doesn't really have the same level of flare.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#63 - 2013-10-28 17:18:00 UTC
Baali Tekitsu wrote:
Nathalie LaPorte wrote:
David Kir wrote:


So there you go, Somer is an authorized ETC reseller andthere's a private agreement between them and CCP.

How's that, second rate goonion citizen?


Actually Somer isn't on that list, if you bother to look, so "that" is pretty bad, and you're wrong.


No, youre wrong, as they obviously didnt get banned and therefor ARE an (in)official ETC reseller.

Erm no, they really really aren't. They are an affiliate. Anyone can be an affiliate of an ETC reseller, that's up to the reseller, not CCP. Somer don;t sell the ETC, thus are not subject to the ETC sales rules. But then neither would the OP of the linked post be.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Karak Terrel
Foundation for CODE and THE NEW ORDER
#64 - 2013-10-28 17:18:25 UTC
I guess this is one of this moments where CCP is looking what the players do and not what they say...

This is going on for weeks now, If they where discussing that issue internally we would have an answer by now. They are just waiting and hoping that this will die off in the end. But how long has CCP to wait until you all go silent? Do we really have to wait until Fanfest when someone asks them point blank on the live stream? I don't hope so, but that hope is evaporating fast.

I fear if people are not willing to show them (again) over the wallet how sincere they are, we will never get an answer.
Nathalie LaPorte
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#65 - 2013-10-28 17:20:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Nathalie LaPorte
Baali Tekitsu wrote:
Nathalie LaPorte wrote:


Actually Somer isn't on that list, if you bother to look, so "that" is pretty bad, and you're wrong.


No, youre wrong, as they obviously didnt get banned and therefor ARE an (in)official ETC reseller.


By that logic I'm an official ETC reseller too. No thanks. I'll stick to my definition of official ETC resellers, which is to look at the actual list of official ETC resellers which has been posted in this thread multiple times and includes neither me nor Somer.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#66 - 2013-10-28 17:23:27 UTC
Karak Terrel wrote:
I guess this is one of this moments where CCP is looking what the players do and not what they say...

This is going on for weeks now, If they where discussing that issue internally we would have an answer by now. They are just waiting and hoping that this will die off in the end. But how long has CCP to wait until you all go silent? Do we really have to wait until Fanfest when someone asks them point blank on the live stream? I don't hope so, but that hope is evaporating fast.

I fear if people are not willing to show them (again) over the wallet how sincere they are, we will never get an answer.
If they don't answer, then yes, this will continue until CCP give a definitive answer one way or the other. Once that answer is given, that's no promise it will all end, but they need to respond to their community.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Baali Tekitsu
AQUILA INC
#67 - 2013-10-28 17:25:55 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Baali Tekitsu wrote:
Nathalie LaPorte wrote:
David Kir wrote:


So there you go, Somer is an authorized ETC reseller andthere's a private agreement between them and CCP.

How's that, second rate goonion citizen?


Actually Somer isn't on that list, if you bother to look, so "that" is pretty bad, and you're wrong.


No, youre wrong, as they obviously didnt get banned and therefor ARE an (in)official ETC reseller.

Erm no, they really really aren't. They are an affiliate. Anyone can be an affiliate of an ETC reseller, that's up to the reseller, not CCP. Somer don;t sell the ETC, thus are not subject to the ETC sales rules. But then neither would the OP of the linked post be.


And because the thread linked in OP was locked with
Quote:

If you want to become an authorized ETC reseller, please contact the CCP Customer Support via support@eveonline.com.

as one of the reasons/advices listed and SOMER getting 30 Ishukone Scorpions instead of the same treatment I guess they are resellers.

excuse my bad english

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David Kir
Errantry Armaments
#68 - 2013-10-28 17:38:45 UTC  |  Edited by: David Kir
Lucas Kell wrote:
lol, you are truly an epic genius.
Somer are NOT an ETC reseller. Markee Dragon is an ETC reseller, of which Somer is an affiliate (so Some just links people to Markee and gets paid to do so). Now, If you read the thread that you and I have both linked, you'll read about "Shattered Crystal". They are also a registered ETC reseller. The OP of the other thread would be an affiliate of them, the same way Some is to markee.

So in short, what you posted was utter nonsense, written without taking the 60 seconds it would take to read and understand the relevant posts.

Try again.



I am indeed utterly wrong and I stand corrected, as Somer obviously isn't on that list.
I shouldn't drink and post.

But say, why do you think Somer hasn't been banhammered yet?

CCP clearly knows about their business, and is still allowing them to do their thing.

This is still CCP's game, and they're free to do whatever they like with it.
They're also free to support whatever organizations they might want to, be it Somer or Brazzers or some sud-american drug cartel.

We already have PLEX aka authorized RMT, why couldn't CCP authorize another such form of business?

Do they have internal policy transparency rules?

Do they owe you something?

Short answer: no.
Long answer: noooooooooooooooooooooooooo.

Don't like it?
You're free to unsub and make your feelings matter.

EDIT(I almost forgot the obligatory goon bashing): So when are you getting evacced to free some renter space?

Friends are like cows: if you eat them, they die.
Nathalie LaPorte
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#69 - 2013-10-28 18:00:40 UTC
David Kir wrote:


I am indeed utterly wrong and I stand corrected, as Somer obviously isn't on that list.
I shouldn't drink and post.

*irrelevant questions and facts which are obviously true to everyone omitted for brevity*



So, you admit that you are wrong and Lucas is right, and that you should stop posting... amazing, a debate which was actually resolved with the party in the wrong admitting it, on EVE-O forums.
Meizu Kho
Kho Incorporated
The Lone Space Wolves
#70 - 2013-10-28 18:25:21 UTC
David Kir wrote:


But say, why do you think Somer hasn't been banhammered yet?

CCP clearly knows about their business, and is still allowing them to do their thing.

This is still CCP's game, and they're free to do whatever they like with it.
They're also free to support whatever organizations they might want to, be it Somer or Brazzers or some sud-american drug cartel.



Sure, ccp is free to do whatever they want, they can give out T2 BPO's to some players or alliances if they like aswell. but if they do, i think they should be open and honnest about it and tell it to our face. This discussion deserves an answer.
David Kir
Errantry Armaments
#71 - 2013-10-28 18:29:50 UTC
Nathalie LaPorte wrote:


So, you admit that you are wrong and Lucas is right, and that you should stop posting... amazing, a debate which was actually resolved with the party in the wrong admitting it, on EVE-O forums.


O fine red wine, thou breath of autumn's being
Thou, from whose alcoholic presence the stupidity
Is driven, like life from an EVE player fleeing...

Friends are like cows: if you eat them, they die.
Good Posting
Doomheim
#72 - 2013-10-28 18:30:23 UTC
Karak Terrel wrote:
I guess this is one of this moments where CCP is looking what the players do and not what they say...

This is going on for weeks now, If they where discussing that issue internally we would have an answer by now. They are just waiting and hoping that this will die off in the end. But how long has CCP to wait until you all go silent? Do we really have to wait until Fanfest when someone asks them point blank on the live stream? I don't hope so, but that hope is evaporating fast.

I fear if people are not willing to show them (again) over the wallet how sincere they are, we will never get an answer.


Yeah, don't worry, this month i will pay with cash to CCP because there is no way on Earth that i'm going to give 1.8 bill to a random player because he wants a Nyx-LolFit Vindicator-whatever without effort. Effort, a word that many people use here conveniently and always according to their arguments.

Ah, do you mean the Somer issue? I don't give a damn.
Nathalie LaPorte
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#73 - 2013-10-28 18:42:55 UTC
David Kir wrote:
Nathalie LaPorte wrote:


So, you admit that you are wrong and Lucas is right, and that you should stop posting... amazing, a debate which was actually resolved with the party in the wrong admitting it, on EVE-O forums.


O fine red wine, thou breath of autumn's being
Thou, from whose alcoholic presence the stupidity
Is driven, like life from an EVE player fleeing...


Ironically, the poet whom you are mangling there, Percy Bysshe Shelley, advocated total abstinence from alcohol, regarding "fermented liquors, as slow, but certain poisons. "

Carry on.
Gogela
Epic Ganking Time
CODE.
#74 - 2013-10-28 18:47:54 UTC
Doc Fury wrote:
"All animals are equal, but some animals are more equal than others".

CCP has made it pretty clear they will not answer any direct questions about this, at least not until they can figure out some convoluted way to spin it to be positive for players. So, enjoy your upcoming survey and locked threads, and keep buying PLEX!


+1 for Animal Farm

Signatures should be used responsibly...
David Kir
Errantry Armaments
#75 - 2013-10-28 19:04:25 UTC  |  Edited by: David Kir
Nathalie LaPorte wrote:

Ironically, the poet whom you are mangling there, Percy Bysshe Shelley, advocated total abstinence from alcohol, regarding "fermented liquors, as slow, but certain poisons. "
Carry on.


I likewise advocate the right to "mangle" any poet's works as I most like.

EDITx2: do you happen to be a poetry reader?

Friends are like cows: if you eat them, they die.
samualvimes
Brothers At Arms
#76 - 2013-10-28 19:06:50 UTC
So what you and others are saying is that for SOMER to be legit they should stop offering free blink credit for GTC sales linked through from their site?

ie no incentive to go through them?

And then that's OK?

If you've never tried PvP in EvE it's quite possible you've missed out on one of the greatest rushes available in modern gaming.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#77 - 2013-10-28 19:11:53 UTC
David Kir wrote:
But say, why do you think Somer hasn't been banhammered yet?

CCP clearly knows about their business, and is still allowing them to do their thing.

This is still CCP's game, and they're free to do whatever they like with it.
They're also free to support whatever organizations they might want to, be it Somer or Brazzers or some sud-american drug cartel.

We already have PLEX aka authorized RMT, why couldn't CCP authorize another such form of business?

Do they have internal policy transparency rules?

Do they owe you something?

Short answer: no.
Long answer: noooooooooooooooooooooooooo.

Don't like it?
You're free to unsub and make your feelings matter.

EDIT(I almost forgot the obligatory goon bashing): So when are you getting evacced to free some renter space?
They haven't got banhammered because the rules put on everyone else aren't being put on them. And yes, it's CCPs game and they can do what they want. but we, as CCPs customers not only have the right, but we have the obligation to raise our concerns and demand an answer.
At this point in time, I'm not at the stage where I'd consider unsubbing, though I am reducing my number of accounts. Other have totally unsubbed though, and in honesty, it wouldn't take too much more of a push to get me gone. CCP have to compete with other games coming out the same as any other company. The more customers they lose, the easier it is for us remaining here to make the decision to quit.
But at the end of the day, CCP shouldn't be letting it get to the stage where all we want is communication and they are pushing people to quit with their refusal to even acknowledge our concerns.

As for the evac, who knows, if ever. I'll go with the always popular Soon™.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#78 - 2013-10-28 19:22:08 UTC
samualvimes wrote:
So what you and others are saying is that for SOMER to be legit they should stop offering free blink credit for GTC sales linked through from their site?

ie no incentive to go through them?

And then that's OK?

Yes, exactly.
Though CCP should clarify in their EULA that no receiving of cash for any form of credit which can in turn be raffled or exchanged for isk or in-game items is allowed. Just to prevent anyone else coming up with a similar scheme.
Obviously all lawyered out and such.

But to be honest, if CCP came back and said:
"Our official statement is: We do what we want, Somer can do this, you can't, so **** you!"
That would still be better than the absolutely nothing they are saying now. They addressed the fact that they gave Somer stuff, and that's fine, but they haven't addressed the RMT issues.

The Indecisive Noob - EVE fan blog.

Wholesale Trading - The new bulk trading mailing list.
Nathalie LaPorte
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#79 - 2013-10-28 19:23:18 UTC
David Kir wrote:


I likewise advocate the right to "mangle" any poet's works as I most like.


Non sequitur. And completely offtopic to the thread, for the double victory. Do you also think that the prohibition of offtopic posting on private forums such as these is an affront to your free speech?

Just to reiterate, you're talking about your free speech rights as an evasion tactic, because you find it hard to deal with the fact that the OP is correct in every particular, and because you are distraught that quoting a dev post which actually proves you wrong, combined with constant insults towards goons, was not an effective means of making a reasonable argument.

Like most people who are upset with this situation, I'm upset not because I can't handle the rules, but because they aren't be equally applied. If Somer and certain others are allowed to run that type of business, but I'm not, arbitrarily, then yes, I would unsubscribe. Unsubscribing without giving CCP a chance to rectify the situation would be childish; as is suggesting that others unsubscribe as a first resort.

Quote:
EDITx2: do you happen to be a poetry reader?


So it would appear.
Nathalie LaPorte
Native Freshfood
Minmatar Republic
#80 - 2013-10-28 19:24:54 UTC  |  Edited by: Nathalie LaPorte
Lucas Kell wrote:
samualvimes wrote:
So what you and others are saying is that for SOMER to be legit they should stop offering free blink credit for GTC sales linked through from their site?

ie no incentive to go through them?

And then that's OK?

Yes, exactly.
Though CCP should clarify in their EULA that no receiving of cash for any form of credit which can in turn be raffled or exchanged for isk or in-game items is allowed. Just to prevent anyone else coming up with a similar scheme.
Obviously all lawyered out and such.

But to be honest, if CCP came back and said:
"Our official statement is: We do what we want, Somer can do this, you can't, so **** you!"
That would still be better than the absolutely nothing they are saying now. They addressed the fact that they gave Somer stuff, and that's fine, but they haven't addressed the RMT issues.


The EULA already clearly outlaws this behavior, in my opinion. Term 10 of the terms of service. The application and enforcement of this term is another matter entirely.