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Drone Regions
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Severian Carnifex
#21 - 2011-11-17 17:22:33 UTC
Razin wrote:
Severian Carnifex wrote:

about "Unique"...
You can have unique things in your house when you have all the rest what you need and dont need for living...
and eve only what have in infinite amounts are problems... so solve them and then add unique things (and don't beak it all again).

You can eliminate uniqueness in the name of progress, but in the end you risk being left with a generic landscape without any character, unable to foster attachment or any sense of scale and wonder required for immersion.


And you think that's the most important uniqueness in eve... and that ppl will rage-quit if CCP change it and only what will left in eve is generic landscape??? Roll
bornaa
GRiD.
#22 - 2011-11-17 19:16:09 UTC
Severian Carnifex wrote:
Razin wrote:
Severian Carnifex wrote:
Elanor Vega wrote:
Get rid of mineral drops from drones!!!!



Yea... mineral faucet from drones must be removed...

Not that I mind, but what other faucet would you replace it with?



CCP can be lazy and replace it with ISK...
one more region with same ISK faucet as all others would not make ISK value less at all...
and when we have incursions on incursions on incursions... that change will have infuence of 0%...
and it would SAVE minerals market...

Or CCP can be smart and make some other value thing in EVE that can be exchanged (like LP or LP or tags) or sold on market (like parts or blueprints for production)...
But no point to do second thing and waste DEV time when other things make 99,9% of the problem...

This way you solve at least one problem, devaluation of minerals and goods...

And for all that ppl that will call me "carebear" for this said... (i dont know why some ppl are calling others like that when they rase this subject... but...)
Who is biggest carebear?
I can not think of bigger carebear that that one that mine in BS...



I support this service!!!

Please CCP give that other part of EVE at least a chance!!!

Look at this thread for ppls ideas:
https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=32607

Ill quote OP:

Aquila Draco wrote:
I have read somewhere DEVs reply about removing mineral drops from drones and putting something else on its place
CCP, can you please give us update on this, please? Is this coming?

That's very nice change and players would be thankful.
Please remove minerals from drones.


*Edit:
@ CCP
In this thread are some nice suggestion how to revive industry... please... give us response...
Are you going to do anything on subject of rebalancing mineral faucets/drains ratio???


In state in what EVE is now there are huge problems on this subject.
The most of all minerals in EVE are coming from drones. And when you add up on that loot drops you are at the point where mining dont play significant role at all.
That is WRONG.
Mining needs to be THE largest SOURCE (If not only) source of minerals in EVE.

Think a little about it...
- Is it normal to go to mine with shotgun to mine???
- Is it normal that shooting down planes give you more materials for making new planes then mining? (WOW we have here Perpetual motion here)
- Is it normal that profession for which you must have PhD is giving you revenue of burger flipper proffesion?
- Is it normal that profession for which you must have PhD give you place in society for whitch ppl are saying "they need to learn their place, its at the bottom.... where they belong."

Well... all that "normal stuff" we have in EVE.

Lets translate that on EVE:

- You load your weapons on your combat ship and kill drones and rats to aquire minerals.
- You aquire more minerals (much more) with shooting drones and rats then with mining.
- Mining skill tree is larger then for some other, much more lucrative professions (now), and you the least revenue.
- Mining skill tree is larger then for some other, much more lucrative professions (now), and ppl are saying to your face "miners need to learn their place, its at the bottom.... where they belong."

You see something wrong here???
Ppl in this thread have solutions for this problem!!!




And about Manufacturing...

Manufacturing of basic T1 items is... well... dead...
And that is the first step for young players that decide to go indy way in EVE, and it is dead.
I think thats just wrong.

I will not here be writing real world comparisons (but I could do it) about it but i'll say it directly.
That industry is based on T1 meta 0 items... isn't it easy ko just remove that items from loot drops???
Easy and efficiently problem solved.


Revive industry in EVE, please.

Thnx you in advance.


*used intelectual property of many ppl in this thread.

[Yes, I'm an Amateur](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRa-69uBmIw&feature=relmfu)
JitaJane
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#23 - 2011-11-17 19:44:07 UTC
I've pointed this out elsewhere and am half sure that this will be ignored but here goes: The value of isk is not entirely determined by the supply of isk. It is the ratio between isk and capital goods. Minerals are one of the biggest capital goods. Therefore if you reduce the influx of minerals and change nothing else (or through bounties actually increase the influx of isk) you have the same (or greater) volumes of isk competing for less minerals and prices will rise. Manufacturing chains and trading are just mediums to facilitate the isk/ goods ratio.

90% of of the time my posts are about something I actually find interesting and want to learn more about. Do not be alarmed.

Gealla
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#24 - 2011-11-17 20:02:51 UTC
Drone regions is not an "ISK Faucet" as some of you seem to think, no ISK is created in the drone regions, period.

The drone poo that drops is sold to other players for their ISk, so the region changes the ISK Flow, but does not create ISK. If you change the poo to bounties, the region will then be an ISK faucet just like any other 0.0 region. If you make items from the poo and sell it, it's still ISK from anotehr player, not created wealth.

I do as much ratting up there as I did in providence and wicked creek and make about the same sort of money doing it. I'd prefer bounties as then I wouldn't have to ship all the crap out......
BigCountry
Sniggerdly
Pandemic Legion
#25 - 2011-11-17 20:06:32 UTC
Such misunderstandings of the drone regions.....

BTW is they took out alloys the mineral vacuum that would create would be rediculous... you really have to stop and think about it ...

Alara IonStorm
#26 - 2011-11-17 20:13:23 UTC
BigCountry wrote:

BTW is they took out alloys the mineral vacuum that would create would be rediculous...

Not really. The Vacuum would be filled by Mining which would draw a much larger crowd as supplies of Minerals dwindle and costs increase.
IGNATIUS HOOD
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#27 - 2011-11-17 20:22:24 UTC
Dr Karsun wrote:
"get rid of mineral drops from drones" say the hardcore pvpers...

I wanna see the hardcore pvpers paying +50% on each single ship they buy because A - miners are ganked B - no drone minerals C - mining is boring (what most people think any way).

It's all working fine. The drone regions are still the worst place to pve in eve, don't make it a desert where even russian bots won't want to live...


I prefer tedious sirrah. The PVP folks should try mining in a WH sometime. I'll give you tedious and raise you the heavy weight of impending doom and fiery death at the hands of the cold blooded and deadly silent T3/HAC/Cane/Drake crowd that show up at the apparent near radomness no NPC could ever truly replicate.

Nothing is as terrifying as the mind of another human intending to do you harm. How truly resourceful is man when he intends to committ evil deeds. Twisted
"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats."   --H.L. Mencken
IGNATIUS HOOD
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#28 - 2011-11-17 20:34:57 UTC
JitaJane wrote:
I've pointed this out elsewhere and am half sure that this will be ignored but here goes: The value of isk is not entirely determined by the supply of isk. It is the ratio between isk and capital goods. Minerals are one of the biggest capital goods. Therefore if you reduce the influx of minerals and change nothing else (or through bounties actually increase the influx of isk) you have the same (or greater) volumes of isk competing for less minerals and prices will rise. Manufacturing chains and trading are just mediums to facilitate the isk/ goods ratio.


I disagree, ISK as a currency has a value determined by its availability and that number keeps growing becuase more ISK is 'printed' PI, Ratting, Mining, PLEX, than the ships and modules and structures are destroyed in game resulting directly in inflation.

Add in the fact that ships, modules, and structures suffer no depreciation it contributes to the problem as well.

I think the self balancing nature of ISK loss to ISK creation is out of whack and as much as I hate to say it this might be a Carebear problem. Conflict avoidance is bad for business. EVE needs more death and destruction becuase its good for business.
"Every normal man must be tempted at times to spit upon his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats."   --H.L. Mencken
Alara IonStorm
#29 - 2011-11-17 20:37:25 UTC
IGNATIUS HOOD wrote:
becuase more ISK is 'printed' PI, Ratting, Mining, PLEX, than the ships and modules and structures are destroyed in game resulting directly in inflation.

The Highlighted add absolutely 0 ISK into the game.
Catlos JeminJees
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#30 - 2011-11-17 21:06:03 UTC
Gealla wrote:

I do as much ratting up there as I did in providence and wicked creek and make about the same sort of money doing it. I'd prefer bounties as then I wouldn't have to ship all the crap out......



Quoted for truth


I make about the same(if not less) amount of Isk here than i did in catch. the only diff is that i have to move all my mineral out and that costs me more isk that goes to other players
Joshua Aivoras
Tech IV Industries
#31 - 2011-11-17 21:11:53 UTC
Either this and/or remove meta 0 drops from rats

95% of the players are loving EVE, the other 5%? On the forums.
K Suri
Doomheim
#32 - 2011-11-17 21:17:59 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
BigCountry wrote:

BTW is they took out alloys the mineral vacuum that would create would be rediculous...

Not really. The Vacuum would be filled by Mining which would draw a much larger crowd as supplies of Minerals dwindle and costs increase.

Which in turn will make for more ganking opportunities, the killing of more Hulks, making more forum rage, driving up mineral and T2 goo prices even further................ making the CFC and Russians richer......

The more things change..................................
Alara IonStorm
#33 - 2011-11-17 21:24:00 UTC
K Suri wrote:

Which in turn will make for more ganking opportunities, the killing of more Hulks, making more forum rage, driving up mineral and T2 goo prices even further................ making the CFC and Russians richer......

The more things change..................................

Not really. There would be no new opportunities. I bet if I logged on now, what ever system I am in there will be a Barge that I could gank.

The field of targets is soooo populated that added 2000 more would not effect anything accept lessening an individuals chance of getting Ganked. Not only would it be rarer but the extra profits will make any lose sting less.

The biggest chanch with an increase in Mineral worth would be an increase in Null Sec Mining.
Crucis Cassiopeiae
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#34 - 2011-11-17 21:28:05 UTC  |  Edited by: Crucis Cassiopeiae
K Suri wrote:
Alara IonStorm wrote:
BigCountry wrote:

BTW is they took out alloys the mineral vacuum that would create would be rediculous...

Not really. The Vacuum would be filled by Mining which would draw a much larger crowd as supplies of Minerals dwindle and costs increase.

Which in turn will make for more ganking opportunities, the killing of more Hulks, making more forum rage, driving up mineral and T2 goo prices even further................ making the CFC and Russians richer......

The more things change..................................


I dont agree with you... prices would not be that high at all...

but...

So... what are you saying...
keep little man broke so that some big mans don't have more???

Vote Issler Dainze for CSM7! http://community.eveonline.com/council/voting/Vote.asp?c=470 
Zimmy Zeta
Perkone
Caldari State
#35 - 2011-11-17 21:37:51 UTC
Sakurako Kimino wrote:
drone regions need to be changed, how, i am not 100% sure but i do think give the npc bountys and bring the alloys inine with module drops from the other nul sec regions.

....


I don't understand. Why the drone regions? Mining is broken, not the drone regions. CCP should fix mining and make it worthwhile again.
So many people harvest drone alloys for a reason: because it is more efficient and less tedious than mining. The problem is mining. Drone harvesting is working, mining is not. So why get rid of the working part instead of fixing the broken part?

I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it. Yes, I do feel bad about it.
K Suri
Doomheim
#36 - 2011-11-17 21:38:28 UTC
Crucis Cassiopeiae wrote:
K Suri wrote:
Alara IonStorm wrote:
BigCountry wrote:

BTW is they took out alloys the mineral vacuum that would create would be rediculous...

Not really. The Vacuum would be filled by Mining which would draw a much larger crowd as supplies of Minerals dwindle and costs increase.

Which in turn will make for more ganking opportunities, the killing of more Hulks, making more forum rage, driving up mineral and T2 goo prices even further................ making the CFC and Russians richer......

The more things change..................................


I dont agree with you... prices would not be that high at all...

but...

So... what are you saying...
keep little man broke so that some big mans don't have more???

I'm surmising that if there is truth in 74% of minerals is supplied by drones and the slack gets picked up by miners, then the majority of supply is bought into contestable space.

I say "contestable" in that the drone goo comes from solidly occupied space now that would require a major invasion to choke supply.

With a shift to predominately highsec mining (that's an assumption) - a concerted event like Hulkageddon with Goons input could put a serious dent in the supply - at least in low-ends.

Just a thought.
Alara IonStorm
#37 - 2011-11-17 21:47:12 UTC
Zimmy Zeta wrote:

I don't understand. Why the drone regions? Mining is broken, not the drone regions. CCP should fix mining and make it worthwhile again.
So many people harvest drone alloys for a reason: because it is more efficient and less tedious than mining. The problem is mining. Drone harvesting is working, mining is not. So why get rid of the working part instead of fixing the broken part?

This is an important part of fixing Mining. Minerals are not ISK but can be exchanged for ISK. When the amount of Minerals being brought in outstrips the amount being destroyed the price goes down and stockpiles rise.

Eliminating a major source of Minerals outside of Mining will thereby increase the value of the Minerals being Mined.

Mining Fixed.
Kietay Ayari
Caldari State
#38 - 2011-11-17 21:48:39 UTC
Can someone explain to me what is wrong with drones? o_o

Ferox #1
Alara IonStorm
#39 - 2011-11-17 21:56:46 UTC
Kietay Ayari wrote:
Can someone explain to me what is wrong with drones? o_o

Drones produce Minerals. Minerals are sold to other players and used to build things meaning there is a point where there value goes down because to many have been brought in.

You can get more Minerals popping Drones then max skill Mining. It is one of the main reasons Mining as a profession is not profitable.
Zimmy Zeta
Perkone
Caldari State
#40 - 2011-11-17 21:57:54 UTC
Alara IonStorm wrote:
Zimmy Zeta wrote:

I don't understand. Why the drone regions? Mining is broken, not the drone regions. CCP should fix mining and make it worthwhile again.
So many people harvest drone alloys for a reason: because it is more efficient and less tedious than mining. The problem is mining. Drone harvesting is working, mining is not. So why get rid of the working part instead of fixing the broken part?

This is an important part of fixing Mining. Minerals are not ISK but can be exchanged for ISK. When the amount of Minerals being brought in outstrips the amount being destroyed the price goes down and stockpiles rise.

Eliminating a major source of Minerals outside of Mining will thereby increase the value of the Minerals being Mined.

Mining Fixed.


I for one will never, ever set a foot into a mining barge again. I think most of us started of with mining, in a newbie mining corp. And most of us eventually found out, that paying monthly for a game where you spend most of your time semi-afk watching tv while doing the same boring repetitive bull*** over and over again is simply terrible. Most people moved on from mining to other activities and discovered how much fun eve can be. And you really want to force them all back into their barges by eliminating the alternatives to mining?

I'd like to apologize for the poor quality of the post above and sincerely hope you didn't waste your time reading it. Yes, I do feel bad about it.