EVE General Discussion

I own a highsec Archon, and while pondering about the upcoming player owned customs offices (POCOs) in highsec, I started thinking that it would be fun if I could use my Archon to help destroy the initial NPC Interbus customs offices that needs to be destroyed before players can put up their own. I had until now been of the impression that highsec capitals should generally never be involved in PvP, but PvE is okay. I was familiar with the rules listed in the red box at wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Capitals_in_Highsec, and I came to the conclusion that killing the NPC office faster would not really be much of an advantage, since other players could basically just sit and watch, and be ready to put up their own office as soon as the NPC one had been destroyed. Anyone can shoot the NPC office and they will likely be destroyed pretty quickly anyway, but I decided to open a support ticket and ask CCP to be on the safe side.

What followed got me a little surprised and confused. After a little back and forth, I asked for clarification about the first rule, specifically asking if this was refering to attacking NPC entities as well. I would have liked to just paste the reply here, but I think that might be against the rules. I will instead say that the first paragraph of the reply stated categorically that the rule was covering PvE as well. The second paragraph then said that killing belt rats is okay, refering to them as trivial.

It seemed like the reply was contradicting itself, so when even GMs are interpreting the rules confusingly, it might be time to update them.

The existing rules are as follows:

1. Capital ships may under no circumstances be used for aggression.
2. If at war, or with war declaration pending, you may not take your capital ship out of station.
3. You may not use your capital ship’s attributes to gain any sort of advantage over other players while in high security space.
4. You may not sell or put your capital up for sale while in high security space.

I am now suggesting updating them to something like this:

1. High security capitals may never be actively involved in PvP by doing hostile actions or remote assistance towards any other player owned entity.
2. High security capitals may only be involved in PvE if the activity in question can be done just as easily/well by a sub-capital ship.
3. High security capitals may not be put on the market, or otherwise sold/traded for any kind of gain.

I dropped the rule about wars because it seemed redundant, only covering the act of undocking - if you simply remained in space it would seem like no rules were broken. I also think that the new first rule covers any kind of PvP that the capital could be involved in during a war, and if one is concerned that the simple presence of a capital can affect a war, I would argue that it is really dumb to declare war while flying highsec capitals. It is much more logical to receive wardecs however, my Archon pilot actually received one yesterday, probably just because they wanted to shoot my Archon. Which is a good reason to let them undock, everybody wants to see capitals go boom, right?

These rules would also clearly state that "mock pvp fights with members of your own corp" is not allowed, clearing up any kind of doubt the author of the wiki page seems to have, as mentioned at the bottom of said page. I believe this to be reasonable, since socalled reverse awoxing seems to be common.

I believe these rules will also clearly show what kind of activity would be allowed. As long as an exhumer can mine just as well, you can use your capital for mining. As long as a battleship can kill rats just as easily, you can use your capital for this. But in relation to doing level 4 security misions, it would be obvious that the capital would have an far easier time tanking the rats than any battleship, so this would not be okay. My rattlesnake can tank level 3 security missions all day, so this would be okay again.

Highsec capitals will only become more and more rare as the years go by, which makes them more and more of an attraction. We don't want to lose them to silly confusion about rules.

And now back to the customs offices. Under the suggested rules, it would be okay to attack the NPC office with my Archon if a battleship could do the same just as well. Given the nature of these offices, the only attribute on a ship that would matter would be the dps, no NPCs or players will be fighting back, so tank does not matter. An Archon with 15 fighters can do 1500 dps, but fighters get no bonus from Drone Damage Amplifier II, so by using 7 of those and 15x Ogre II, it can get a dps of 1746 according to EFT. I then tried fitting a Dominix Navy Issue and got myself a surprise. By fitting 6x Neutron Blaster Cannon II, 3x Drone Damage Amplifier II, 4x Magnetic Field Stabilizer II and 5x Ogre II, it gets a dps of 1789 with Void ammo. Both fits are with max skills, no implants and no midslots or rig slots used.

So a Dominix Navy Issue can actually get a higher dps than my Archon. If my capital had been a dreadnaught or even a Thanatos, it would have been different. But my capital is an Archon, it will never leave Otela and its fighters have trouble hitting belt rats. We are some people here from different corps wanting to work together to set up POCOs with zero tax, and would love to see some fighters in action as we clear out the Interbus offices. Destroying these offices only happens once, so it could be called an event. Many highsec dwellers have never seen a carrier before, how many have seen one putting its fighters to good use?

I think this would be fair use of an Archon, what do you think?

(PS: My Archon pilot is Astesia and can be seen regularly in the Otela ice belt)

No...

Nope.

I don't see a problem with using your capital on interbus customs office since it's a one time deal. Those rules should be updated as well.

Let me preface by saying I don't know what the punishment is for breaking the hi sec capital rules as it isn't listed in that link.

If you feel so strongly about making this a historic thing and want to show off for the locals why don't you?

This is on the thought process that the consequences will likely be loss of your capital in hi sec, which is largely useless anyway. So why not let it go out with a great story to tell?

Jeez big red box and I missed it. :)

good thing drones aren't a module.. ?

I suggest the rules be amended so that the punishment is the relocation is to VFK.

When you engage an interbus customs office you will get a suspect timer so my question is what would you do if someone engaged and scrammed your Archon?

Everyone above farted "No" has never give reasonable counter arguments of why pve activity like this can't go through, as someone said they are jealous much