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TIDI - killing EVE slowly

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Debora Tsung
Perkone
Caldari State
#61 - 2013-10-24 15:27:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Debora Tsung
Wow, I wish I wasn't too lazy to look up the link to the dev block that explained TiDi and the booming, almost deafening player applause that followed that blog.

I think no Dev ever received as much likes and "let me have your children Plx" comments as CCP Veritas at that time.

EDIT: Oh wait, I wasn't too lazy at all. http://community.eveonline.com/news/dev-blogs/introducing-time-dilation-tidi/

Stupidity should be a bannable offense.

Fighting back is more fun than not.

Sticky: AFK Cloaking Thread It's not pretty, but it's there.
Velicitia
XS Tech
#62 - 2013-10-24 15:27:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Velicitia
Malcanis wrote:
I recommend that people who are concerned by lag (since lag is actually the problem here, not TiDi) watch Veritas' presentation at this year's fanfest.

tl;dr: The "easy wins" vs the lag monster have been won. The remaining wins are going to be much harder (and will therefore take longer), but there are still some big wins available.


so to put things more simply,

They've trained "Lag Killing" to L4. Now they have L5, and Advanced Lag Killing.

Signal11th wrote:
Velicitia wrote:
Signal11th wrote:


Which is great if you are in the fight but not so great if you have no interest in the fight or participation but still have to suffer tidi for 2 hours whilst it goes on and your 10+ jumps away.

Personally Ive got better things to do with my time.


I never said it was a perfect solution ... but better that you're in TiDi than black-screening because of a fight 10 jumps out, isn't it?



Not really no. What's the difference? I couldn't do what I had planned so closed the client and did something else so although petty I couldn't play the game to what I think is an acceptable standard because someone else somewhere else was playing his/her game.


Well, the biggest one is (lagging) "Jumped into system in [insert ship here], and blackscreened ... logged back in a few hours later to an alpha clone" vs. (TiDi) "Jumped into system with 10% TiDi ... dock up and log off til later".

One of the bitter points of a good bittervet is the realisation that all those SP don't really do much, and that the newbie is having much more fun with what little he has. - Tippia
Debora Tsung
Perkone
Caldari State
#63 - 2013-10-24 15:41:35 UTC  |  Edited by: Debora Tsung
Lugalbandak wrote:


yes indeed +1, what a outrage , WE WANT OUR BLACK SCREEN BACK CCP!


Indeed, indeed.

The blackscreens at least gave me a sense of entitlement, of being right, nobody could stand against the righteous fury of an interwebs spaceship captain that lost his ship to something as mundane as lag.

It was hilarious, really. Big smile

Stupidity should be a bannable offense.

Fighting back is more fun than not.

Sticky: AFK Cloaking Thread It's not pretty, but it's there.
Frostys Virpio
State War Academy
Caldari State
#64 - 2013-10-24 15:55:50 UTC
Is this kind of thread the reason why people used to say -A- is ****? Because that thread sure is...
O'Ran
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#65 - 2013-10-24 16:01:49 UTC
lol
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Doomheim
#66 - 2013-10-24 18:05:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Fanbois: "Yay! TiDi is our saviour!"

Me: "TiDi effectively turns regions of space from a realtime game into a turn-based one. No one should be patting themselves on the back with TiDi, because bottom line large fleet battles still suck. If players and FC's have enough time to click a button, go to the local variety store and come back before needing to do another input, someone has lost the plot on what a realtime MMO is..."

I was there, and this discussion should not around 'how does/doesn't TiDi help'. The question should be "CCP, what is your strategic plan for fixing it so that fleet battles are no longer the turn-based vaporware they are today?"

...Sorry, but each time people start heralding TiDi as the second-coming, I on the contrary reflect on the pee/sh!t bucket I needed to keep at my desk during the one big fight I took part in. What happens CCP, when word gets out en mass that the epic large fleet battles of Eve are in substance a lie?

Would you like to know more?
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#67 - 2013-10-24 18:08:57 UTC


Harkonnens suck ass

ORDOS VICTOR

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#68 - 2013-10-24 18:10:04 UTC
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
Fanbois: "Yay! TiDi is our saviour!"

Me: "TiDi effectively turns regions of space from a realtime game into a turn-based one. No one should be patting themselves on the back with TiDi, because bottom line large fleet battles still suck. If players and FC's have enough time to click a button, go to the local variety store and come back before needing to do another input, someone has lost the plot on what a realtime MMO is..."

I was there, and this discussion should not around 'how does/doesn't TiDi help'. The question should be "CCP, what is your strategic plan for fixing it so that fleet battles are no longer the turn-based vaporware they are today?"

...Sorry, but each time people start heralding TiDi as the second-coming, I on the contrary reflect on the pee/sh!t bucket I needed to keep at my desk during the one big fight I took part in. What happens CCP, when word gets out en mass that the epic large fleet battles of Eve are in substance a lie?


How is it a lie when 4000 people are beating eachother in the face?
Beekeeper Bob
Beekeepers Anonymous
#69 - 2013-10-24 18:10:14 UTC
Treborr MintingtonJr wrote:
TIDI is awesome, it means I can fight, go to the toilet and cook dinner (with greater success) at the same time. Might even have time to walk to Co-op and back :-) huzzah


After getting killed the first time in the BL fight, I self-destructed, went and walked the dogs, got something to eat, got back and still hadn't gotten back to station.....

Signature removed - CCP Eterne
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#70 - 2013-10-24 18:15:49 UTC
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
Fanbois: "Yay! TiDi is our saviour!"

Me: "TiDi effectively turns regions of space from a realtime game into a turn-based one."
No more turn-based than it already is.

Quote:
Sorry, but each time people start heralding TiDi as the second-coming, I on the contrary reflect on the pee/sh!t bucket I needed to keep at my desk during the one big fight I took part in.
Fair enough. Back before the second coming, you had plenty of time to go to the loo once you blackscreened, disconnected, and then had no ability to log in and play the game for the next 8 hours…

And no, the large fleet battles are not a lie, largely thanks to TiDi (again, in sharp contrast to the past where it wasn't so much a large fleet battle as a mutual disconnect-fest).
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Doomheim
#71 - 2013-10-24 18:22:22 UTC
Tippia wrote:

...
And no, the large fleet battles are not a lie, largely thanks to TiDi (again, in sharp contrast to the past where it wasn't so much a large fleet battle as a mutual disconnect-fest).


Well, as I said....

"What does boggle though is how many players (and fanbois trolling the EVEO forums) are stuck in a sad Stokholm-syndrome of having lived with this poor infrastructure & architecture for so long, that any improvement is cause for jubilation and blind tongue-bathing of CCP's efforts...

'TiDi purgatory slowness isn't so bad, you should have seen when we were in disconnect hell...' "

Would you like to know more?
Caviar Liberta
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#72 - 2013-10-24 18:25:29 UTC
Remiel Pollard wrote:
Posting in a stealth buff icelandic server hamsters thread.


forget the hamsters, what we need are viking of the Eric the Red type but on roids running in a big wheel to power the server.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#73 - 2013-10-24 18:30:55 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
Well, as I said....
…the fights happen whether you like it or not, so calling them a lie is itself a lie.

No matter how much you rage over this disconnect between the reality of the situation and your wishes that it were otherwise, and no matter how much you heap abuse over people who enjoy being able to play the game, the fact remains that they're able to play the game. What boggles the mind is that you think they should be unhappy because of this.
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Doomheim
#74 - 2013-10-24 18:42:01 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
Well, as I said....
…the fights happen whether you like it or not, so calling them a lie is itself a lie.

No matter how much you rage over it and heap abuse over people who enjoy being able to play the game, the fact remains that they're able to play the game. What boggles the mind is that you think they should be unhappy because of this.

Question Tippia..

Will the architecture and infrastructure that today results in high TiDi during the much heralded large fleet battle get budget to fix its horrible performance sooner or later (or never), if people like you get the community to bury head in the sand ala Stokholm syndrome?

I ask this, because you seem to think you are doing the EvE community a service with your fanboism and 'nothing to see here, move along' crap, but its actually people that say the emperor has no clothes that drive positive change. For example, remember that little episode around micro transactions and pay to win? Was that reversed because asshats like you said 'nothing to see here', or because people railed against it?

p.s.
Were you a writer for Pravda during the Russian Berlin-wall era? I recognize your writing style I think...

Would you like to know more?
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#75 - 2013-10-24 18:45:28 UTC
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
Tippia wrote:

...
And no, the large fleet battles are not a lie, largely thanks to TiDi (again, in sharp contrast to the past where it wasn't so much a large fleet battle as a mutual disconnect-fest).


Well, as I said....

"What does boggle though is how many players (and fanbois trolling the EVEO forums) are stuck in a sad Stokholm-syndrome of having lived with this poor infrastructure & architecture for so long, that any improvement is cause for jubilation and blind tongue-bathing of CCP's efforts...

'TiDi purgatory slowness isn't so bad, you should have seen when we were in disconnect hell...' "

Ahh yes, several thousand people fighting in the same battle is a sign of "poor infrastructure & architecture".

Perhaps you could direct us to someone that accomplishes this better?

Should be easy to do right? Smile

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#76 - 2013-10-24 18:49:09 UTC  |  Edited by: Ranger 1
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
Tippia wrote:
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
Well, as I said....
…the fights happen whether you like it or not, so calling them a lie is itself a lie.

No matter how much you rage over it and heap abuse over people who enjoy being able to play the game, the fact remains that they're able to play the game. What boggles the mind is that you think they should be unhappy because of this.

Question Tippia..

Will the architecture and infrastructure that today results in high TiDi during the much heralded large fleet battle get budget to fix its horrible performance sooner or later (or never), if people like you get the community to bury head in the sand ala Stokholm syndrome?

I ask this, because you seem to think you are doing the EvE community a service with your fanboism and 'nothing to see here, move along' crap, but its actually people that say the emperor has no clothes that drive positive change. For example, remember that little episode around micro transactions and pay to win? Was that reversed because asshats like you said 'nothing to see here', or because people railed against it?

p.s.
Were you a writer for Pravda during the Russian Berlin-wall era? I recognize your writing style I think...

I think you are confusing "Stokholm Syndrome" with "understanding the limitations of technology". Blink

As a side note, you do realize that there was never a plan to implement a pay to win scheme right?

Or is this another case of using a catch phrase (Stolkhom Syndrome, pay to win) incorrectly...

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#77 - 2013-10-24 18:51:36 UTC  |  Edited by: Tippia
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
Will the architecture and infrastructure that today results in high TiDi during the much heralded large fleet battle get budget to fix its horrible performance sooner or later (or never), if people like you get the community to bury head in the sand ala Stokholm syndrome?
What horrible performance?

Oh, and you need to read up on what Stockholm syndrome is because it's not what you think it is. Yes, the servers will be (and are being) upgraded continuously as better tech comes along since that's how CCP maintains its industry epeen. Whether you're being abusive to the community or not is not a factor.
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Doomheim
#78 - 2013-10-24 18:57:30 UTC  |  Edited by: Feyd Rautha Harkonnen
Ranger 1 wrote:
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:

Well, as I said....

"What does boggle though is how many players (and fanbois trolling the EVEO forums) are stuck in a sad Stokholm-syndrome of having lived with this poor infrastructure & architecture for so long, that any improvement is cause for jubilation and blind tongue-bathing of CCP's efforts...

'TiDi purgatory slowness isn't so bad, you should have seen when we were in disconnect hell...' "

Ahh yes, several thousand people fighting in the same battle is a sign of "poor infrastructure & architecture".

Perhaps you could direct us to someone that accomplishes this better?

Should be easy to do right? Smile


I noticed two things in your response Ranger 1 in the classic trolling & red-herring deflection genre...

1) You used an abstract measure like 'fighting', without mentioning said 'fighting' took place in a TiDi bubble of molasses, where each move and counter move had up to an hour (or more) between them. Yes, truly compelling online & realtime gameplay to be heralded as a panacea of MMO excellence to be sure... Roll

2) You then tried to deflect ownership by CCP of this crap game experience by asking if anyone else has fixed this problem. Honestly, I don't care what other MMO's have or haven't done, I only care about the one I have paid fees towards are doing as a contrast between what is advertised ('massive online player battles rawr!') and the reality of big fleet battles simply sucking.

Tippia and Ranger 1, I was there. Were you?

Would you like to know more?
Ramona McCandless
Silent Vale
LinkNet
#79 - 2013-10-24 18:59:19 UTC
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
classic trolling & red-herring deflection genre...



Classic "You disagree, you must be trolling" schoolyard name calling at its finest


Just be a man and concede will ya

"Yea, some dude came in and was normal for first couple months, so I gave him director." - Sean Dunaway

"A singular character could be hired to penetrate another corps space... using gorilla like tactics..." - Chane Morgann
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#80 - 2013-10-24 19:12:05 UTC
Feyd Rautha Harkonnen wrote:
Honestly, I don't care what other MMO's have or haven't done
Then you have no basis for calling it horrible performance, for saying that it's poor infrastructure and architecture, and thus the fundamental fallacy of your presupposition is exposed.

It's not trolling or deflection: it's pointing out that you are being abusive against people because you have set up unrealistic expectations and are angry that others take a far more pragmatic viewpoint.