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Balancing Feedback: Tier3 Battlecruisers

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Foofad
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#681 - 2011-11-17 06:11:52 UTC
Can I counterpetition that the Naga stays a hybrid platform and also gets even more love in that regard?
Rip Minner
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
#682 - 2011-11-17 06:29:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Rip Minner
Apex Bex wrote:
Aglais wrote:
You do realize that you could just, I dunno, train that giant ******* gap in your skillset where hybrid turrets should be.

Don't whine to CCP because you were too lazy to train hybrids. They're going to be less broken once the Naga is out, so you actually may have a desire to do so.


Considering the time commitment required, Hybrids aren't worth the punt. I'd be better off cross training to Minmatar and projectiles. At least I know they'll work.

The fact remains, four ships, four races and only three weapon systems represented. It's a glaringly obvious omission.



Brother I just want to tell you that I share your pain.

Tha fact remains, four ships, four races and only two weapon systems represented, It's a glaringly obvious omission.

Becouse Hybirds are just as broken on Gallente ships even with Tracking/DMG bonus. I want Drones and I want them on that 800-1000dps level at least with Garde 2's. and even demand that there are no other weapon systems be on the ship. Becouse the other ships get no drone bays it should get no High slot weapons.

Is it a rock point a lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship point a lazer at it and profit. I dont see any problems here.
Rip Minner
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
#683 - 2011-11-17 06:45:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Rip Minner
OT Smithers wrote:
The actual reason that CCP ditched the torps and cruise missiles is that both have serious issues in PvP (this is, of course, the reason that you so rarely see Caldari BS's on the field). Specifically, travel time, explosion velocity, and explosion radius. CCP could EASILY address the problems using bosuses on the Naga, but they cannot do so without shining a spotlight on the problem overall -- as they would end up with a BC that outclasses the existing Caldari BS's. This would leave them with the option of either fixing these weapons across the board, or fixing the bonuses on Caldari BS's to also address the issues.

Both of those bring with them their own set of problems: specifically, development time they do not want to spend, and faster missioning.

None the less, this solution is bullshit.

Essentially, they are releasing the expansion with an Amarr BC, a Minmatar BC, and two Gallente BC's.



Pls for the love of Drones stop trying to push Hybirds onto Gallente ships. They are omost just as bad on are ships for pvp or missioning too. Real Gallente's know this and know that Drone's are the real Gallente weapon system. Just as the real Caldari weapon system is Missiles. So as I see it were both geting *crewed again together all over again.

Is it a rock point a lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship point a lazer at it and profit. I dont see any problems here.
Rip Minner
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
#684 - 2011-11-17 06:51:52 UTC  |  Edited by: Rip Minner
The Gallente Prayer

Our Drones, who art in Drone Bays
Hallowed be thy Drone Bandwidth
Thy Senterys come
Our enemies be done
In low sec
As it is in Empire
Give us this day
Our daily gank
And forgive us our WCS's
But we won't forgive them that use them against us
And lead us not into bubbles,
But deliver us from scramblers
For thine is the thermal
The explosive
The kinetic
EM

AmenBear

Is it a rock point a lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship point a lazer at it and profit. I dont see any problems here.
Allaera
Kalmincon
#685 - 2011-11-17 06:55:31 UTC
Foofad wrote:
Can I counterpetition that the Naga stays a hybrid platform and also gets even more love in that regard?


/signed Blink
Rip Minner
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
#686 - 2011-11-17 07:04:10 UTC
Packlid wrote:
Phantomania wrote:


Its OK, a petition is being passed around atm.

Make it fair!...Make it Missiles!

Missile Pilots want Equality!

Naga needs a 100% Hybrid Turret NERF!


/signed


/signed

/signed

Is it a rock point a lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship point a lazer at it and profit. I dont see any problems here.
Ganthrithor
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#687 - 2011-11-17 07:22:06 UTC
Caldari are a split-weapons race you morons. They already have a missile BC-- its called a Drake, and you probably fly it already! If you want to stick to missiles, keep flying your Drakes. Stop whining about how you now have a viable rail platform as well (lol, it's like a Ferox except possibly useful as a spaceship!).
Rip Minner
ARMITAGE Logistics Salvage and Industries
#688 - 2011-11-17 07:47:56 UTC
Ganthrithor wrote:
Caldari are a split-weapons race you morons. They already have a missile BC-- its called a Drake, and you probably fly it already! If you want to stick to missiles, keep flying your Drakes. Stop whining about how you now have a viable rail platform as well (lol, it's like a Ferox except possibly useful as a spaceship!).


Big on the possibly part is why you would be better off with the Torp verson. At least then you know you have a useable ship.

Is it a rock point a lazer at it and profit. Is it a ship point a lazer at it and profit. I dont see any problems here.
Naomi Knight
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#689 - 2011-11-17 07:55:26 UTC
Gypsio III wrote:
The obvious solution is to make the Tornado the missile BC. That way the rail-Naga is still a good PVP ship, the idiot carebears have a terrible missile boats to lose in L4 missions to elite frigates, and the problem of the overpowered projectile Tornado is resolved.

After all, Minmatar pilots are always whining about their split weapon systems and their SP-intensive race. Let's give them a proper missile boat so they can make use of all their missile skills.

CCP, we demand missiles for the Tornado! Or at least a 4-4 turrets-missiles split!

Oh crap I envy you , me should be the one who bring up such a briliant idea, nicely done :P
Hitting 3 birds with 1 stroke awesome.

DO THIS CCP!!!
Justin Cody
War Firm
#690 - 2011-11-17 08:00:22 UTC
fail.

missiles don't belong on this type of ship until missiles get a proper buff themselves. hell a cruise missile version I would prefer over torps.

make em useful in pvp...more RoF and less able to be sig tanked.

but the naga will do fine on ships above its weight class.
Ganthrithor
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#691 - 2011-11-17 08:31:15 UTC  |  Edited by: Ganthrithor
Dude I literally just went on SiSi and flew a neutron blaster naga. It wasn't half bad-- big tank, speedy ~*enough*~, has 37km range (or somwhere in there) with null. Does decent DPS. I don't know what you guys are complaining about, especially since torpedoes are literally the most god-awful weapon system ever and won't do any damage to anything smaller than an MWDing dread.

Hell, it's even got Ferox factor-- some frigate pilot was all "hey look a terrible ship" and burned right at my Naga when I warped to a combat site at range, resulting in his immediate blapping.
Princess Cellestia
Friendship is Podding
#692 - 2011-11-17 08:35:26 UTC
I don't see why everyone is shitting on the torp naga. That thing ATE battleships like nothing else. "Oh noes, you cant kill little tiny ships!" That wasnt the purpose I saw in the torp naga. I saw fleets of these things mauling battleships and caps, just chewing them apart. Now they're rail boats that will poke at things once then get warped in on by the enemy fleets prober. Sniping is dead, rails are garbage, unless you're in a 10 man fleet just ganking solo industrials in a gate camp. And blasters? Meh, MEH I SAY. Naga is now just a copycat talos.

What was needed is the Naga to have missile velocity bonus and a fire rate bonus, no need for the explosion velocity crap, you want to fly a naga? Beware the hac and the bc. I wanted to fly a naga against caps instead of a stupid hurricane all the time. But now the dream is dead. Might as well just train for projectiles.
Nyio
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#693 - 2011-11-17 08:36:19 UTC
This is what I think about the new ships:
The Gallente ship need to have some drone bonuses and the Caldari need missile bonuses.

That is all. Smile

Golem • CCP In-Game Event 2011.11.23 • Nyio • Grenade?
Raven Ether
Doomheim
#694 - 2011-11-17 08:45:04 UTC
Keep the Naga hybrid bonuses and just add two torp bonuses.


Problem solved.
Blu Blade
Death Watch Guards
#695 - 2011-11-17 08:50:01 UTC
Phantomania wrote:


If I had huge amount of SP in Hybrids and Gunnery, I too would be quick to slate every attempt to make the Naga Layout fair for ALL those missile focused pilots!

Why wouldn't I, I will have a Brand New Caldari and a Brand New Gallente Tier3 BC to play with this winter! Twisted

I mean, it would be waaaay to dificult to fix Missiles and give the Naga the right bonus's to be a decent missile boat!

....wait for all the negative comments by the Hybrid Lovers! Roll





THIS... Naga Missile Boat FTW!
Gypsio III
Questionable Ethics.
Ministry of Inappropriate Footwork
#696 - 2011-11-17 08:57:45 UTC
Princess Cellestia wrote:
I don't see why everyone is shitting on the torp naga. That thing ATE battleships like nothing else.


It was worse against BS than all three other tier 3 BCs, because it had less raw DPS that was more difficult to apply, while having no advantage in survivability. This is why it was worthless.
Herr Wilkus
Aggressive Salvage Services LLC
#697 - 2011-11-17 09:12:13 UTC  |  Edited by: Herr Wilkus
I don't get why all the Caldarisexuals are so upset about the Naga.

Caldari is the PVE race. They aren't supposed to get good PVP ships. If you want to PVP, you train Minmatar and Amarr.

As the Tier3 BC's were intended to be PVP ships, it is quite logical that the Naga had to be the worst.

Some people have been whining and crying on these forums for three years, but they just don't learn.

If God had intended Caldari ships to PVP, tackle mods would fit in low slots.
Sam Bowein
Sense Amid Madness
#698 - 2011-11-17 09:17:58 UTC
If I had to chose, I'd take a Cruise Naga Big smile

With something like 10% damage to kinetic cruise missiles and 5% damage to other cruise missiles ?
A missile speed would be quite useless (for the range at least), and shield resistance is against the t3 BC philosophy
Raven Ether
Doomheim
#699 - 2011-11-17 10:09:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Raven Ether
Raven Ether wrote:
Keep the Naga as is, just add two bonuses for torps and missile hardpoints.



Problem solved.

Raven Ether wrote:
Keep the Naga hybrid bonuses and just add two torp bonuses.


Problem solved.


For the millionth time.


and forget those ******** damage type specific bonuses, they are relics of 2003, might as well suggest something more universal.



Cruise Missiles DO NOT and WILL NOT follow the ship class design, CCP has said so, end of story.

Torps as a secondary close range weapon choice is good enough. So you have railguns for long range, blasters/torps for close.
Phantomania
Lonely Trek
#700 - 2011-11-17 11:19:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Phantomania
Fact- Caldari has more T1 Sub-Caps were Missile Launcher points outway Turret points = Missiles are Caldari's Primary Weapon!

Fact- Caldari has no T1 Sub-Cap Ship that can carry a FULL 8-Slot rack of BS sized Launchers, unlike the other races, which have each at least one BS that can boast 8 of their Primary BS sized weapon!

Fact- CCP needs to fix Caldari's Primary Weapon!

Fact- Naga is supposed to be a Missile Boat with fixed Missiles and decent Missile Bonus's!


Doesn't take a Genius!