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On the matter of Cohorts

Author
Roga Dracor
Gladiators of Rage
Fraternity.
#1 - 2013-10-16 13:35:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Roga Dracor
In my time studying the lore of Eve Online, I have found that very little CCP commits to text is innocuous. There is meaning inside meaning behind meaning deeply rooted in innuendo. With regards to the Sleeper mystery, even more so. Dropbear himself alluded to the fact that nothing was done without purpose.

Which brings me to the term Cohort. A cohort is the mortal agent of a vampire, able to operate in the sunlight that they cannot. A cohort was the police force of the ancient city states of Rome. A cohort is what the protagonist of Jita IV-4 calls herself. It is a term committed to print in the description of a structure in WH space (Ruins of Enclave Cohort 27). CCP used the term to describe the Matari group that aided Admiral Ouriya in Stain. I first cast it aside as a subtle hint to the ISD, but, can’t help thinking there is more to it. Meaning deeper than the surface suggests.

Has anyone, willing to share, found this deeper meaning that I have searched for? Perhaps in the novels I have never read? What is a Cohort?

It's no use going back to yesterday, because I was a different person then, and it's a poor sort of memory that only works backward.

Horatius Caul
Kitzless
#2 - 2013-10-16 13:41:37 UTC
Roga Dracor wrote:
Has anyone, willing to share, found this deeper meaning that I have searched for? What is a Cohort?

You see deeper meaning behind everything. You can't expect normal people to look up every single word written in a chronicle on the off-chance that it's part of this grand poetic secret you're so convinced exists.
Roga Dracor
Gladiators of Rage
Fraternity.
#3 - 2013-10-16 15:42:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Roga Dracor
Indeed I do.. P

I see deeper meaning, even in life, than others do.. But, I am certainly not unique, in this respect. Especially around here...

Quote:
I'll take us back a little now, before Jita 4-4 even really existed, to the dawn of the capsuleer era. Some associates of mine at the time discovered that I wasn't just good with their cloning technology, I was capsule compatible too. New arrangements were made. I was second cohort. Joining in the first rush would have drawn a little too much attention, you see, so I waited a year and joined in YC106.


If the above quote doesn't inspire an idea of deeper meaning, well, I guess you're happy to not know, I don't work that way.. Even if it's just to pique the curiosity of individuals like me, there is a hidden meaning in these words..

It could be as simple as an allusion to programming skill and gaming experience, and an application to the ISD.. Writers do that kinda stuff. I happen to believe it is more, especially considering the timing of the chronicle, it's author and the presence of Ruins of Enclave Cohort 27 in Anoikis.

Cohort is not a commonly used word, in any language, it inspires thoughts of conspiracy and duplicity...

My interpretation of the Ruins of Enclave Cohort 27 shows the Devs have a wicked little sense of humor, and like to flaunt their disregard for players preferences in regard to interpretation of the "facts" of the Sleeper mystery. And the use of outside resources, like Wikipedia..

I am therefore, curious as to whose Cohort the protagonist is, Jovian or Enheduanni? It has bearing on the particulars of the chemical compound highlighted in Jita 4-4...

It's no use going back to yesterday, because I was a different person then, and it's a poor sort of memory that only works backward.

Amann Karris
Doomheim
#4 - 2013-10-16 16:51:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Amann Karris
Roga Dracor wrote:
Cohort is not a commonly used word, in any language, it inspires thoughts of conspiracy and duplicity...

Your assumption is that the word is used as a clue, and not as a simple descriptor.

In the context of the quote, the reference for Cohort is in reference to a "second generation" of capsule pilots. This seems fairly clear to me.

This is meant as a clue to the identity of the individual in the story. There are other clues. Mabnen, Blood Raiders, etc. Is it a link to 'Anoikis' and the Sleepers? There is no way to be certain. In such a case, it's likely that it is just a red herring. It could also be a subtle reference to the author's own character in EVE, and a description of how he moves in and out of both Player and Dev society.

Regardless, in context of the story, we can safely assume the protagonist is a "cohort" of capsuleers, indicating he is of the second generation of Capsuleers of the modern "Empyrean" age.

Cohort, however, has many meanings.

Quote:
CCP used the term to describe the Matari group that aided Admiral Ouriya in Stain.

'Cohorts' of Admiral Ouriya would mean 'compatriots' in this particular instance. It is commonly used today with a negative connotation. "He and his cohorts caused much mischief" for instance. It fits in this interpretation of Ouriya and the Matari who aided him.

Quote:
My interpretation of the Ruins of Enclave Cohort 27 shows the Devs have a wicked little sense of humor, and like to flaunt their disregard for players preferences in regard to interpretation of the "facts" of the Sleeper mystery. And the use of outside resources, like Wikipedia..

The problem here is that these sites were created prior to the interest in Sleepers. They were created long before players even knew there was going to be Sleepers. How could they know that players would use wikipedia so much, or that it would lead them on so many wild chases? I doubt that they would. 27, however, is an important number in EVE fiction. There's a rather important story that includes the number 27 in it as a rather interesting

The most likely interpretation is one that explains the name in this particular instance.

Cohort 27; what interpretations would fit in context?

EDIT:

For the record, it can safely be assumed that the protagonist of Jita 4-4 is Hilen Tukoss. The reference to C3 is a hint here, as well as Mabnen (a test site for a specific weapons test).

https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Hilen_Tukoss
https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/C3

His defection to the Minmatar Republic is most likely linked to research into a certain enslavement tool used by Amarrians.

Blink
Horatius Caul
Kitzless
#5 - 2013-10-16 17:16:36 UTC
Cohort is a very meaningless word. It can mean so many different things, several of them extremely generic, that looking for any deliberate meaning in it is a waste of time.

It was a Roman military division, comprising several Centuries. Several Cohorts formed a Legion. Cohort was not a word for Roman policemen, a Cohortes Urbanae or Cohortes Vigilum was a military police unit, but saying that a Cohort was the name of the Roman police is horribly misleading. In fact, in Latin it was also a word for yard or enclosure.

As a legacy of the Roman military structure, Cohort remains a term for a military force, especially in fiction.

In science, namely in biology, statistics, and demographics, we have some very clear definitions of 'cohort'. In biology, cohort is zoological grouping between class and order. In statistics, it's any group of subjects who have a perticular thing in common, be it that they lived through a specific accident, that they all smoke, or that they work on the same floor. The statistical term extends into demographic research, where generational cohorts are grouped by having experienced and shared certain events. Studies of people of a generation from birth to death is often called Cohort Studies.

And it's also a term for a group of students going through a specific education together.

If you look at any definition of cohort, you'll see that it's given as a synonym for 'group'. Now isn't that as general as anything can get? The military context ("There's the commander and his cohort" "That man is part of X's cohort") has also made it a synonym of 'follower', which again is utterly generic.

Quote:
Cohort is not a commonly used word, in any language, it inspires thoughts of conspiracy and duplicity
It may not be used in common parlance, but the extremely wide and generic range of meanings it has, and the fact that it stirs up feelings means that it is already entrenched in our vocabulary. Personally, I don't feel that cohort is a word of conspiracy or deceit, to me it's just a word for a military unit. If you are writing a story and want to use a word to hint at the nature of a thing, you don't use a word that can mean anything as generic as 'group' or 'friend' or 'unit' or 'yard'.
Roga Dracor
Gladiators of Rage
Fraternity.
#6 - 2013-10-16 18:20:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Roga Dracor
Enclave Cohort 27, Cohort Urbane 27 Police Precinct 27, the specific precinct of a certain TV show that has immense popularity, Law & Order.. I can't make anyone buy into it.. It is very easy to change a structures name to fit circumstances.. It is inevitable there will be naysayers.. I believe it, and you can't dissuade me from this belief.. The Shattered remnants of Law and Order.. Seems rather straight forward to me..

Cohort isn't the only word, it is used in context, the entire quote provides some context. I guess I am Second Cohort then too... If it is as simple as that.. But you seem to neglect this context.. Such as "New arrangements were made..". Such belies the idea that he decided to start playing the game...

And finally I asked for constructive input, not deconstructive criticism, though it is, I guess, your right to inject such..P

It's no use going back to yesterday, because I was a different person then, and it's a poor sort of memory that only works backward.

Amann Karris
Doomheim
#7 - 2013-10-16 18:31:24 UTC
Roga Dracor wrote:
Cohort isn't the only word, it is used in context, the entire quote provides some context. I guess I am Second Cohort then too... If it is as simple as that.. But you seem to neglect this context..

I would say you're wrapping everything into the same context, which just doesn't make sense. A short story, a news article, and a site in wormhole space do not share the same context. You're perfectly within your rights to see some connection, but I just don't see it.

You've got your own interpretation. I've attempted to point out some potential errors in that interpretation. Ignore it if you want.
Horatius Caul
Kitzless
#8 - 2013-10-16 18:59:56 UTC
Quote:
And finally I asked for constructive input, not deconstructive criticism, though it is, I guess, your right to inject such.
Constructive criticism doesn't mean to blindly agree or to build on your ideas as you present them. To poke holes in your argument is not deconstructive.

"I was second cohort" = "I was in the second group" or "I was second generation" while also carrying the meaning of 'follower' and not a leader.

You keep implying that CCP's writers are leaving some kind of hidden messages that only you are perceptive enough to pick up on. You're scratching at every semi-obscure word or recurring phrasing, and where does it get you?

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar.
Roga Dracor
Gladiators of Rage
Fraternity.
#9 - 2013-10-17 19:23:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Roga Dracor
First of all, no word is meaningless.. I was one of the first to suggest that Kitz were Enclaves, long before you adopted that corporate monacre. That statement reeks of ignorance. Second, I have implied no such thing. Simply look around at the various blogs, like Ravas' to see that many others find syncopy in CCP's work. Third, Dropbear has all but said there IS a grand design, though it obviously lacks some pieces here and there. “We are still waiting...”

I readily admit I am a fanboy of CCP's work.. I claim no superior knowledge, no hidden insight, no extrasensory abilities that others lack. Amann, I am not directing this at you so much, I appreciate your candor and your civil presentation of your thoughts. But, I have heard this spiel before. If anyone chooses to think me an overbearing fool who seeks unmitigated attention, look through the archives. I have dealt with this undeserved hostility for years.

I don't know why I assume such certainty in these matters, perhaps it is some borderline prescience due to my obsessive\compulsive personality, perhaps it is because I was weened on the Hardy Boys\Nancy Drew mysteries as a lad, followed by long bouts of Doctor Who and Mystery Theater as a teen. Maybe I'm just lucky..

I was called a Jove obsessed idiot when I stated unequivocally, my belief that the Sleepers were the Jovian Stasis People. Wonder of wonders, I was right. Look into the archives yourselves. Don't take my word for it. The proof is in the pudding. I quit Arek 'Jaalan for the same reason, there is a segment of the community that seems to hate the direction the lore has taken, and fight tooth and nail to insure it trudges along as slowly as they can manage. Rpers who think five make believe marriages and two homosexual trysts ignited in a station bar epitomize epic role play.. It must have been this segment that Tony G. pandered to with all the gratuitous sex in his novels(note, I never read any of them, the reviews were enough to make me avoid them). There is also a very healthy segment that has much more compassion and patience than I do, and I salute them.

So I will simply make some prophecies, based on my own research and beliefs, many of which have been refined and drawn from the works of others, too numerous to mention, and leave this thread at that. Many thanks to them all! We will let posterity decide the verity of my words. Love me, hate me. I will lose no sleep over it... So, here we go.

Cohort will be a pertinent word in the Sleeper mystery. The Enheduanni will be found to have “ascended” to a post physical form, with no corporeal existence, per se.. They use the Coronation Platforms to achieve this, and likely feed on the gas reserves in Anoikis. They hover about the Assembly Halls, doing whatever it is they do. The Jove have entered into a symbiotic existence with some of the Rogue Drones. The Talocan were the early Jove. They were the garbage men of mankind, recycling the detrius men cast aside, drawing all kinds of knowledge and advances from the trash of others. A year or so from now I will revisit this subject, just to see.. I am a CCP fanboy, as stated above, I plan to be around...

Sometimes a troll is just a troll.

For those who wish to blow me up for my unkind words, look to Dust 514, I spend most of my free time there these days. I will even go so far as to announce my affiliation. I am a proud member of the Ultramarines! Oh, and contrary to what you might think, we fight mostly for the Gallente...

P.S. Thank you Amann, I had never read the C3 writeup until following your link.. It explains alot, and also hints at who the protagonist in the story is. It is not Hilen Tukoss. She is female, and it relates to another chronicle that features Hilen Tukoss..

From Anoikis(chronicle)
Quote:
It was his job to follow her now.

"That was One I just had here. Did you get a trace on the call?"

“Carirgnottin, sir. She's not moving either. We have her on infrared at the moment, and she's still in place.”

“ Two is still missing?"

"Yes, sir."

"Understood."


I had never understood this part of the chronicle until reading about C3, the idea of the two active clones confused me to no end...

It's no use going back to yesterday, because I was a different person then, and it's a poor sort of memory that only works backward.