Intergalactic Summit

I can see your rational behind your thinking. Every time there is an incorrect verdict, it can almost always be pointed at the jury. However despite it's faults, the jury is very important. The Jury's necessity mainly stems from being as fair to the persecuted as possible. To uphold our principle that we believe a man is innocent until proven guilty.

The jury is mainly to provide a neutral perspective on the case. Political and social pressure, and in some cases, corruption, can often cause a judge to make the wrong verdict. The Jury also ensures that you are being reviewed by people similar to you, or your "peers." This tends to eliminate bias that may take place against the persecuted. Jury members are also interviewed very meticulously by both the defense and prosecution. This means that jury members will be as impartial as possible and not total idiots.

Of course, a Jury is an optional right and it can be waived if the defendant feels that the jury will hurt him or be detrimental to solving the case.



True, but I'd imagine it would be fairly difficult to do so.

This eases my mind to a certain degree oddly. Given the high profile of this case and the obvious strong opinions of the people for and against, I would have been concerned that a jury made of Federation citizens (I assume you have to be a citizen to be a juror) would have been biased. Given that the accused has the right to waive the jury and be judged by, well just a judge, gives me the impression that the trial would be fairer.

So three guys attack one guy.
They attack him.
He defends himself and kills his three attackers.
Now he is on trial for being too competent in defense of himself.
You must be kidding?

Let's put this in terms a capsuleer can understand:
Three Gallente ships try to gank me, being the better combat pilot I destroy them, then Concord gets to arrest me and put me on trial?
Are the Gallente crazy?

I can only assume you didn't bother to read any of the posts where I explained where self-defence ends and assault/murder can begin.

If he killed the three assailants whilst they were in the process of trying to kill him then he will not be charged for or found guilty of their murders. If his attackers attempted to withdraw or surrender and he killed them - that's aggravated homicide, at the least. Possibly plain old homicide. If he defended himself using an illegal weapon, he may well do time for possessing that illegal weapon.

None of this is because he 'defended himself too well'.

You know, unless the Black Eagles are behind this and want him arrested for.... something...

The evidence is generally revealed at the trial - in Gallente proceedings it is sometimes revealed to the defence counsellors beforehand.

People have asked how he could possibly be facing charges for defending himself - based on my own tenure as a law enforcement agent, I've simply answered that question. No I wasn't there. No I don't have access to the charges or the evidence against him. Yes I have seen similar situations over the border in the State - have been the arresting officer. Have given evidence to the tribunal.

Should he be charged for defending himself? Not according to Gallente law.

Could he have been charged for offences arising from circumstances surrounding his defence of his person? Yes, absolutely he could have.

I'm glad to hear it, I always try to observe local customs when I travel too, and I understand that the 'other side' is quite small in Caldari space.

I find it interesting that so many only want to define nationality through ethnicity. Sane Minmatar people freely live in and are loyal members of all three human empires of New Eden. Minmatar people contribute as productive law abiding citizens in the Caldari State, in the Gallente Federation, and in the Minmatar Republic.

For the sake of clarity I do not accept the inhuman slavery cultists as a human empire of New Eden. I do not classify those held in horrific bondage by the inhuman slavery cultists as being their loyal members. Clearly any Minmatar serving willingly those Amarr monsters are not sane.

Remember, Kyllsa, that the law essentially serves the same purpose as religion in the otherwise agnostic Gallente Federation. Without having a strong spiritual and moral code, the Gallente wrote their own in their legal codices. As such, they're not going through the trial because it's necessarily fair to do so. Plenty of people think that if three people attack one person then the three people end up dead, that is justice. The Gallente need to follow the letter of their law, though, and thus if, at any point, those three people were not attackers, then the Matari is a murderer in the eyes of the Federation. It isn't necessarily a case of the Gallente persecuting this as a matter of racial purity (obviously, that's just the reason we're hearing about this one case instead of following every one of the self-defense legal defenses in the Federation) as much as it is about having to strictly follow their moral compass. To the Gallente, he needs to go to trial, whether it's just or not. That's simply a part of their culture.

I think, in the end, your culture is no excuse for breaking the law. As a traveler in foreign spaces myself, I can't go to a government official and say, "I am Amarrian, I have learned to do such-and-such, therefore you will respect my cultural right to do so." When you are in the Federation, or any empire, you need to do as the Gallente do to an extent. I may have aversions to certain things that are legal here. Drip use among commoners in the Amarrian Empire would instantly make it my duty to personally do something about it given even my rather unremarkable position. In the Gallente Federation, I simply have to call the police if it is illegal and ignore it if it is one of the many legal substances that can be abused. All citizens aren't necessarily seen to be tasked with civic law enforcement by station, they employ people to do that.

So whether this Brutor is guilty or not, or whatever reasons he is guilty or not, or whether we even think the law by which he is judged is just or not, those are all inconsequential. What he did is cause for a judicial inquest where he is by the law he was subject to at the time. There isn't any other way it can be. If he didn't want to be subject to the laws there, his only options would be to change the laws or leave the Federation. Now, right or wrong, he's at the mercy of the jury and the court.

One thing about the Gallente system, though, is that jury trials give some room for interpretation. If his entire jury thinks the way you do, whether or not it's necessarily true according to law, he will go free.

I suppose in more simple terms, what I said is that this is not a political statement. We are simply more aware of it for political reasons. There are plenty of people in the Federation on trial for similar things right now. We aren't paying attention to them because this man is a member of a minority.

Just or not, if you kill people in the Federation and they have any cause to question your motives, you go to trial. It is as simple as that. Whether he was justified in killing them is not a relevant issue. What is at issue is whether he killed people according to the proscribed manner of the law.

I hope that clarifies what I said somewhat.

Boy that...make..I....what?