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Abandoned POS's and Control Tower's are just space junk
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Boomer Budd Marcos
Hell Why Not
#1 - 2013-10-05 12:09:31 UTC
I have found 10 abandoned POS's in just 2 systems - some have been there for over a year (cause I checked the corps wardec history). It would be nice if a) we could unanchor them and make a profit after they have been abandoned for a period of time - b) if like a container that has seen no activity, they vanish after being in space after a pre-determined time - c) we can destroy them without concord killing us.
If a moon has a POS on it than no-one else can put a POS on it correct ??
Mole Guy
Bob's Bait and Tackle
#2 - 2013-10-05 13:25:28 UTC
been suggested numerous times.

the best idea is to make it a hacking mini game. if a tower goes offline and is down for a certain amount of time, we can hack it, change ownership, insert fuel and bring it up as our own. or unanchor and sell.
Lucius Saturninus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#3 - 2013-10-12 16:48:44 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucius Saturninus
If at the very least once the POS runs out of fuel it should start a 30 day clock. After 30 days it and all its structures become abandon and can be claimed or unanchored and taken if you have the appropriate skills.
Abdiel Kavash
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#4 - 2013-10-12 16:51:40 UTC
Just shoot it. No game change is needed because you're too lazy to spend an hour to secure your moon.
Danika Princip
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
#5 - 2013-10-12 16:56:36 UTC
Dec 'em, shoot 'em, steal the mods.
Lucius Saturninus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#6 - 2013-10-12 18:37:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucius Saturninus
Abdiel Kavash wrote:
Just shoot it. No game change is needed because you're too lazy to spend an hour to secure your moon.


The first 2 where fun, blowing up and contracting the owner 1 scrap metal with a note saying here's what left of your POS. But now to go into a C4 and you have 2 abandon dickstars. Its kind of like "Ugh! I'll save my ammo for real targets." I think being able to take or claim the abandon POS and Structures could make it a profitable industry or game career. At least in WH space. K space is a different engine.
Hesod Adee
Perkone
Caldari State
#7 - 2013-10-12 19:38:56 UTC
Abdiel Kavash wrote:
Just shoot it. No game change is needed because you're too lazy to spend an hour to secure your moon.


Do you support the laziness of the people who claim a high-sec moon by sticking an offline large tower on it and waiting until someone pays them to remove it ?
BTW the only risk in this income is that a corp decides that war deccing you to blow up your high sec large tower is a better use of their time than planting a tower on a worthless low-sec moon. If you decide to pull out of this scheme, you just sell the towers and get your ISK back.


Me, I say that if someone is too lazy and/or incompetent to keep their tower fueled or protected while it's offline, then they don't deserve to keep that tower.
Rivr Luzade
Coreli Corporation
Pandemic Legion
#8 - 2013-10-12 21:19:43 UTC  |  Edited by: Rivr Luzade
Boomer Budd Marcos wrote:
I have found 10 abandoned POS's in just 2 systems - some have been there for over a year (cause I checked the corps wardec history). It would be nice if a) we could unanchor them and make a profit after they have been abandoned for a period of time - b) if like a container that has seen no activity, they vanish after being in space after a pre-determined time - c) we can destroy them without concord killing us.
If a moon has a POS on it than no-one else can put a POS on it correct ??


and

Mole Guy wrote:
been suggested numerous times.

the best idea is to make it a hacking mini game. if a tower goes offline and is down for a certain amount of time, we can hack it, change ownership, insert fuel and bring it up as our own. or unanchor and sell.


This is one of the most feasible applications of the hacking game.

UI Improvement Collective

My ridicule, heavy criticism and general pale outlook about your or CCP's ideas is nothing but an encouragement to prove me wrong. Give it a try.
Arthur Aihaken
CODE.d
#9 - 2013-10-12 22:21:54 UTC
Have the inactive ones slowly drift into the moon's gravity well.

I am currently away, traveling through time and will be returning last week.
Lucius Saturninus
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#10 - 2013-10-13 01:45:45 UTC
After trying that mini game at a C4 Data site today I think a hack game would work. Because you cant open those cans unless you got the skills, ship, rigs and knowing. Wow! Shocked
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#11 - 2013-10-13 02:13:51 UTC
Shoot the tower, steal the mods, sell the moon.

Bam, now you're profiting from clearing moons.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Hesod Adee
Perkone
Caldari State
#12 - 2013-10-13 02:30:48 UTC
RubyPorto wrote:
Shoot the tower, steal the mods, sell the moon.

Bam, now you're profiting from clearing moons.

How much ISK per hour would that be ?
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#13 - 2013-10-13 03:22:07 UTC
Hesod Adee wrote:

Me, I say that if someone is too lazy and/or incompetent to keep their tower fueled or protected while it's offline, then they don't deserve to keep that tower.



That's nice. Why don't you go ahead and war dec them, attack their high sec tower, and see if they are too lazy to defend it?

If they don't defend it? Bash tower, take moon.

If they do? You either win, and take the moon anyway, or you lose, and the moon was never going to be yours to begin with.
Hesod Adee
Perkone
Caldari State
#14 - 2013-10-13 04:07:32 UTC
Domanique Altares wrote:
Hesod Adee wrote:

Me, I say that if someone is too lazy and/or incompetent to keep their tower fueled or protected while it's offline, then they don't deserve to keep that tower.



That's nice. Why don't you go ahead and war dec them, attack their high sec tower, and see if they are too lazy to defend it?

If they don't defend it? Bash tower, take moon.

If they do? You either win, and take the moon anyway, or you lose, and the moon was never going to be yours to begin with.


How long do you think it takes to remove an undefended large tower in high sec ?
Assume a small corp. 20 people in it at most. Be sure to consider what they want a high sec POS for, and what that implies about their trained skills.

How do you plan to keep the attacking pilots paying enough attention during the attack that they can respond to the defenders showing up ?

How much do high sec merc groups charge for removing an offline large tower ?
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#15 - 2013-10-13 06:50:19 UTC
Hesod Adee wrote:
How long do you think it takes to remove an undefended large tower in high sec ?
Assume a small corp. 20 people in it at most. Be sure to consider what they want a high sec POS for, and what that implies about their trained skills.


If they can't be bothered to do it themselves, they can pay someone to do it for them, find an empty moon, or buy a moon from someone.

Quote:
How do you plan to keep the attacking pilots paying enough attention during the attack that they can respond to the defenders showing up ?


"CCP should magic our enemies towers away because we might risk our ships by not being at the keyboard while shooting our enemies towers ourselves."

Quote:
How much do high sec merc groups charge for removing an offline large tower ?


Ask them.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Hesod Adee
Perkone
Caldari State
#16 - 2013-10-13 08:40:54 UTC
Why should someone who is unwilling, or unable, to fuel a POS be able to claim a moon and stop someone who is willing and able to fuel a POS from setting up their own ?

Or, in the extreme case: Why should someone who is not even subscribed to Eve be able to claim moons for himself ?

RubyPorto wrote:
Hesod Adee wrote:
How long do you think it takes to remove an undefended large tower in high sec ?
Assume a small corp. 20 people in it at most. Be sure to consider what they want a high sec POS for, and what that implies about their trained skills.


If they can't be bothered to do it themselves, they can pay someone to do it for them, find an empty moon, or buy a moon from someone.


If you don't answer my question, I'll just assume you realize that giving an honest answer would be devastating for your argument.

Quote:
Quote:
How do you plan to keep the attacking pilots paying enough attention during the attack that they can respond to the defenders showing up ?


"CCP should magic our enemies towers away because we might risk our ships by not being at the keyboard while shooting our enemies towers ourselves."


Are you saying you think that people should be able to earn ISK with no risk, and no input on their part ?

Because that's what offline high sec towers are. You just plant the tower, then wait for someone to want the moon enough to pay for it. Worst case, you just recover the tower and sell it to get your ISK back. Should someone war dec you, and actually start attacking the POS you can wait till boredom has defeated them, then swing by in a single ship and start popping attackers.

If they had to fuel those towers, then they would at least risk spending more in fuel costs than they get from the eventual sale.

Or are you saying that it's unreasonable for CCP to treat subscribed playe

Quote:
Ask them.

Are there any high sec merc groups willing to take out a high sec POS ?

Does it make a difference if you can convince the mercs that everyone in the corp that owns the POS isn't subscribed ?
Domanique Altares
Rifterlings
#17 - 2013-10-13 08:53:52 UTC
Hesod Adee wrote:

How long do you think it takes to remove an undefended large tower in high sec ?
Assume a small corp. 20 people in it at most. Be sure to consider what they want a high sec POS for, and what that implies about their trained skills.


Exactly as long as it takes anywhere else.

Your other questions are irrelevant; I don't care how many of them there are, or what they want it for; their financial issues are not mine. If they can't make a return on bashing someone else's POS, then obviously they shouldn't be bashing it. Their skill training, or lack thereof, is also not my issue.

If they want that moon badly enough, they'll find a way to take it. If they can't find a way, then they don't want it badly enough, and should move on to something else.

Quote:

How do you plan to keep the attacking pilots paying enough attention during the attack that they can respond to the defenders showing up ?


I don't plan on it; if I need a POS bashed, I'll round up people who don't suffer attention deficit issues, and can stay on task. If they decide to go wandering off to make a sandwich or watch TV or pull their crank and subsequently die to a response fleet, then they deserved to die. This is basic PvP operation; if someone can't manage this, they shouldn't be bashing a POS. They will also be completely unprepared and unable to defend any POS that they own, so good luck to them hanging onto it when someone else comes looking for that moon.

Quote:

How much do high sec merc groups charge for removing an offline large tower ?


I have absolutely no idea, nor do I care. If you do, you might try soliciting their services in the relevant area of the forums.
RubyPorto
RubysRhymes
#18 - 2013-10-13 09:13:55 UTC  |  Edited by: RubyPorto
Hesod Adee wrote:
Why should someone who is unwilling, or unable, to fuel a POS be able to claim a moon and stop someone who is willing and able to fuel a POS from setting up their own ?

Or, in the extreme case: Why should someone who is not even subscribed to Eve be able to claim moons for himself ?


Why should someone who is unwilling or unable to shoot down a structure that can do nothing to fight back be able to take real estate from someone who claimed it first?

Quote:
If you don't answer my question, I'll just assume you realize that giving an honest answer would be devastating for your argument.


Exactly EHP/DPS seconds. Do your own homework. Armageddons with Sentries and Pulse lasers tend to be preferred. I'll let you work out why.

Quote:
Are you saying you think that people should be able to earn ISK with no risk, and no input on their part ?


They're risking a tower.

Quote:
Because that's what offline high sec towers are. You just plant the tower, then wait for someone to want the moon enough to pay for it. Worst case, you just recover the tower and sell it to get your ISK back. Should someone war dec you, and actually start attacking the POS you can wait till boredom has defeated them, then swing by in a single ship and start popping attackers.
Now they're risking their ships and inputting quite a bit of effort, especially since you can just kill the tower when none of your wardec targets are online.

Oh, and if they tear down the tower in response to your wardec, guess what, you got your moon. Op success.

Quote:
Are there any high sec merc groups willing to take out a high sec POS ?

Does it make a difference if you can convince the mercs that everyone in the corp that owns the POS isn't subscribed ?


Ask them. They're over in C&P.

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths." -Abrazzar "the risk of having your day ruined by other people is the cornerstone with which EVE was built" -CCP Solomon
Zappity
New Eden Tank Testing Services
#19 - 2013-10-13 09:43:08 UTC
Of course they should be hackable. The number of abandoned POSes is ridiculous, especially in J-space.

I would prefer there to be more of a consequence to leaving such a player-owned structure offline. At the moment you can effectively put them in 'sleep' mode and be woken up with plenty of time to spare if someone shows an interest in it. Not very EVE - like.

Zappity's Adventures for a taste of lowsec and nullsec.
Altered Ego
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#20 - 2013-10-13 16:32:11 UTC
Hesod Adee wrote:
... Or, in the extreme case: Why should someone who is not even subscribed to Eve be able to claim moons for himself?


I've read and supported dozens of these posts, but this is a magnificent point that I don't think I've ever heard before.

RubyPorto wrote:
Why should someone who is unwilling or unable to shoot down a structure that can do nothing to fight back be able to take real estate from someone who claimed it first?


The whole point of hacking an offline pos is that no one wants the thing, nor do they want the resources, anymore.
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