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Low Sec Bulk Ore Transport?
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Victoria Grensam
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#1 - 2013-10-10 19:03:00 UTC
Hello all,

I'm still very new to Eve, (LOVING it so far!) so please forgive an noobishness that you may find in my post...

I'm currently in the business of buying up the cheapest ore I can find, hauling it to a station where I have the best standings (which is in high sec) refining it and then selling the minerals. I'm struggling with getting my ore out of low sec safely. Right now I'm just using a Tayra since I don't have the skills for the T2 yet. That thing is made out of (very heavy) paper mache, so I understand that's a big part of it.

But, what do all you experts think I should be working toward - the Crane or Bustard? It sounds like the Crane is the safest, but I'm looking at a lot lower cargo capacity. Opposite for the Bustard. Perhaps there are some other T2 Indys that you would recommend, but those would be even further out for me since I'd have to start over with that racial industrial skill. Any other suggestions would be welcome too. I've looked at doing contracts, but that cuts too deep into my margin for now.

I've found a few threads comparing some of these vessels, but most of the time they're not really concerned with the huge volumes that I'm hoping to move.

Any thoughts or comments are much appreciated!
Sexy Cakes
Have A Seat
#2 - 2013-10-10 19:11:29 UTC
With a bustard you can fit a cloak and a MWD and pull the cloak/MWD trick and get out of lowsec safely enough once you know what you're doing.

You hit the wall of needing a jump freighter already, grats! Now you just have to get around it.

Not today spaghetti.
Batelle
Federal Navy Academy
#3 - 2013-10-10 19:52:30 UTC
blockade runner cargo capacity leaves a lot to be desired, and IMO is not suited to bulk cargo that's relatively low value (compared to mods or high end minerals). The DST is mostly safe in lowsec, but its not covops-safe. Its probably the best choice, but you'll definitely want to augment that by scouting the route ahead of time, knowing your surroundings, and monitoring the starmap for active players in space and recent kills.

Keep in mind that while the DST is quite tanky, if anything gets more than 2 points of warp disruption on you, then you're still gonna die.

"**CCP is changing policy, and has asked that we discontinue the bonus credit program after November 7th. So until then, enjoy a super-bonus of 1B Blink Credit for each 60-day GTC you buy!"**

Never forget.
Praxis Ginimic
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-10-10 20:59:20 UTC
Get out of that npc corp and into a player corp where you will have friends to help scout you through dangerous gates and web you into warp. After the Rubicon changes to warp acceleration go through it should just take one guy in a cheap frig.
Victoria Grensam
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#5 - 2013-10-10 21:13:49 UTC
Praxis Ginimic wrote:
Get out of that npc corp and into a player corp where you will have friends to help scout you through dangerous gates and web you into warp. After the Rubicon changes to warp acceleration go through it should just take one guy in a cheap frig.


Yeah, I'm kind of anti-social like that though. Smile I do have a RL friend who is going down the covert ops ship path (whatever that may be - I've done < 0 research on that line). Maybe I'll be able to talk him into scouting for me, but it sounds like it'd be a pretty boring job...

Thanks for the advice, everyone!
Ayzn Betokhn
Pandemic Horde Inc.
Pandemic Horde
#6 - 2013-10-10 21:29:36 UTC
The safest thing is to work towards the crane or other blockade runner for warping cloaked. You may want to look at refining in low sec, and then hauling minerals. (or look at hauling minerals into low sec, buy prices are sometimes better there) The problem with the deep space transports is that they handle like a boat on dry land, aligning and warping off seems to take forever compared to even a normal industrial. The experience feels similar to flying a freighter or orca. If a gate camp sees you cloak and heads to your last position, you will probably get uncloaked because you won't have gone far. The deep space transport is so big and ungainly that just bumping you around a few times might be enough to keep you from getting away. The blockade runners are fun to fly, the deep space transport is much more painful.
Iyokus Patrouette
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#7 - 2013-10-10 21:36:26 UTC
\o/ don't you just love the logistical nightmare of it all at times?

You could also try talking to the people around you, They may be needing all that Ore you are shipping away and be willing to pay for your stuff, That way you don't have to haul very far, and neither do they. You might not get the same pricing as you would in hauling it. but the time spend not hauling and mining instead could well and truely make up for it.

Another option is to scan down wormholes when they come your way and see if they spit you out in high sec. (this route does still offer the danger of getting ganked.)

---- Advocate for the initiation of purple coloured wormholes----

Huttan Funaila
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#8 - 2013-10-10 22:12:48 UTC
Miasmos. It has a huge ore hold, is dirt cheap and is reasonably agile. Amount of ore carried depends on your Gallente Industrial skill.
Quote:
[Miasmos, Zippy]
Inertia Stabilizers II
Inertia Stabilizers II
Warp Core Stabilizer I
Warp Core Stabilizer I

Medium Shield Extender II
Medium Shield Extender II
Medium Shield Extender II
1Z-3 Subversive ECM Eruption

Improved Cloaking Device II
[empty high slot]

Medium Low Friction Nozzle Joints I
Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I

With evasive maneuvering 5, you warp in 7 seconds.

You may as well use the cheapest warp core stabs, and the only ships that will tackle you have faction warp scramblers or are a heavy interdictor. The burst ECM may help (probably won't), but you are most likely dead if you get tackled by either. If you use the burst ECM in high sec, without setting your safety to green, you will get concorded.

Alternatives: lose the burst ECM and replace with microwarp. This adds at least 1 second to warp time. Dropping the rigs when you add the microwarp might not add to warp time. Local Hull inertia stabilizers have the same agility boost as tech 2 and may be cheaper in your area.
Orakkus
ImperiaI Federation
Goonswarm Federation
#9 - 2013-10-10 22:45:53 UTC
If I were you, I'd be on the test server right now checking out how each one of these ships mentioned actually will fly under the new warp acceleration rules. Those changes will absolutely determine how successful your current venture will be.

He's not just famous, he's "IN" famous. - Ned Nederlander
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#10 - 2013-10-11 01:14:44 UTC
Don't transport ore through low-sec at all, even if you have friends. Its risking an expensive ship for a low profit.

Putting money in the Salvation Army bucket at your local grocery store will at least help someone else if you want to give away your money. Because I guarantee you will lose more than you make.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
ZAKURELL0 LINDA
KarmaFleet
Goonswarm Federation
#11 - 2013-10-11 02:14:39 UTC
Huttan Funaila wrote:
Miasmos. It has a huge ore hold, is dirt cheap and is reasonably agile. Amount of ore carried depends on your Gallente Industrial skill.
Quote:
[Miasmos, Zippy]
Inertia Stabilizers II
Inertia Stabilizers II
Warp Core Stabilizer I
Warp Core Stabilizer I

Medium Shield Extender II
Medium Shield Extender II
Medium Shield Extender II
1Z-3 Subversive ECM Eruption

Improved Cloaking Device II
[empty high slot]

Medium Low Friction Nozzle Joints I
Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I

With evasive maneuvering 5, you warp in 7 seconds.

You may as well use the cheapest warp core stabs, and the only ships that will tackle you have faction warp scramblers or are a heavy interdictor. The burst ECM may help (probably won't), but you are most likely dead if you get tackled by either. If you use the burst ECM in high sec, without setting your safety to green, you will get concorded.

Alternatives: lose the burst ECM and replace with microwarp. This adds at least 1 second to warp time. Dropping the rigs when you add the microwarp might not add to warp time. Local Hull inertia stabilizers have the same agility boost as tech 2 and may be cheaper in your area.

sees instacane and u got wrecked. dun fly in LS like that

RIP Iron Lady
Salpad
Carebears with Attitude
#12 - 2013-10-11 02:27:52 UTC
Cipher Jones wrote:
Don't transport ore through low-sec at all, even if you have friends. Its risking an expensive ship for a low profit.

Putting money in the Salvation Army bucket at your local grocery store will at least help someone else if you want to give away your money. Because I guarantee you will lose more than you make.


I'm puzzled too. How can it be worth the trouble to move low value-desity stuff like ore several jumps, through low-sec? In order to achieve an ISK-per-hour ratio that isn't absolutely sucky even by noob standards, you'd have to buy that ore in low-sec at really cheap prices.

And I doubt that they're actually that low.
Praxis Ginimic
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#13 - 2013-10-11 03:28:13 UTC
Did you guys read the op? He bought the ore in low sec because it was the lowest price he could find. Don't get me wrong though, I do agree that it is bad business practice.

OP, get that ore out of low sec however you can but stop buying it out there. The logistics and inevitable losses will turn what may seem like a lucrative venture into a losing proposition.

ABC's are less expensive in Jita beacause that is where the large block 0.0 alliances bring there stuff to market. Low end ores are slightly less expensive in Amarr because that is where Chribba hangs out. (Or something like that. IDK, I'm not a miner) Buy high end ores in Jita, refine, transport to Amarr for market. Then buy low end ores in Amarr, refine and transport your minerals back to Jita for market. Rinse and repeat.

You will have competition because that is where the minerals game is at and that is the reason why Test and the Goons gank freighters on the choke-point gate between Caldari and Amarr space.

Have fun with that.
Ireland VonVicious
Vicious Trading Company
#14 - 2013-10-11 03:41:23 UTC
If you are serious about low sec / null sec goods moving you want a rorqual and a jump freighter.
You can actually never risk a gate camp with this combo. High to low sec moves are easy in a JF.
Rorqual is the best m3 mover in game due to fuel cost ratio compared to jump freighter and a lot of that m3 has to be ore.

Moving Ore around with any thing less in those areas is a waste of time.

If you want to use a T2 hauler for low sec hauling start trading things that are not so m3 heavy.
Naoru Kozan
Perkone
Caldari State
#15 - 2013-10-11 05:42:44 UTC
http://youtu.be/9uBcK_c8Gy4

Guide on how to do the MWD + cloak trick.

[Miasmos, Lowsec Hauler]
Warp Core Stabilizer I
Warp Core Stabilizer I
Damage Control II
Nanofiber Internal Structure II

Experimental 10MN Microwarpdrive I
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
'Cetus' ECM Shockwave I

Improved Cloaking Device II
[empty high slot]

Medium Ancillary Current Router I
Medium Low Friction Nozzle Joints I
Medium Low Friction Nozzle Joints I

Something like that should work. Like the others said: check the map for recent kills etc and scout the route in a cheap fast frigate if it's deep in lowsec. If it's a route your using regularly setup on-grid bookmarks so you can observe the gates, set up insta-undocks from stations you use, seperate the local window from the chat window so you can quickly check who is in local, learn how to use the directional scanner and don't go through Rancer P

Happy Hauling!