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CCP Shills on the CSM

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Nevyn Auscent
Broke Sauce
#341 - 2013-10-08 10:44:54 UTC
Also refer page 2 of the 'larger' (otherwise known as equally spammed by a few people) thread for references to several other organisations that may have already got them as well. And been equally quiet on it.
Bronco Platz
Doomheim
#342 - 2013-10-08 11:23:39 UTC
Nevyn Auscent wrote:
Possibly whoever handed them out didn't consider them worth billions of isk ignoring the collectors who have trillions of isk in their calculations.
Given the ships are crap scorpions after all.
And the CCP involved valued them based on their actual combat worth, not some fictional collector figure. Since why would a collector spend trillions on a ship it's known CCP is going to reissue repeatedly......

You know. Lets use logic here.


Aside all the stupid CCP showed in this affair. You think the didn´t take the market value of the items in account?

Okay, let´s think so for a moment. Why didn´t they give 30 units of Trit then instead? Or simply 150 ISK?

Now for real. CCP knows allways what´s up on Tranq. And they did know the the price that collectors would pay. And keeping the deal secret (the hole point!) underlines this.

This signature is under NDA. Sorry.
wowyouareacow
NANA221 Corporation
#343 - 2013-10-08 11:37:10 UTC
Didn't James 315 suggest to people not to vote for Ripard Teg?
Could he have had a point, or is Ripard still a good CSM member?
Tron 3K
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#344 - 2013-10-08 11:40:33 UTC  |  Edited by: Tron 3K
wowyouareacow wrote:
Didn't James 315 suggest to people not to vote for Ripard Teg?
Could he have had a point, or is Ripard still a good CSM member?

Well James is an idiot and I wouldn't listen to anything he says but if he would of got one semi-ret@rded person to follow what he was saying I could maybe listen to that said semi-ret@rded person.


Apparently you can't say re tard.. Also I wasn't here for the voting.. Only CSM I see regularly is Malcanis and unfortunately he has the same views as Ripard..
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#345 - 2013-10-08 11:41:48 UTC
Ripard Teg - "...If any mistake was made here, it was that CCP decided for whatever reason to keep this gift private..."

Malcanis- "...I said I thought the lack of transparency was not the best way..."

Nevyn Auscent wrote:
...Malacanis is doing a pretty good job of expressing my view point...
Mine also.
Bi-Mi Lansatha
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#346 - 2013-10-08 11:43:59 UTC  |  Edited by: Bi-Mi Lansatha
wowyouareacow wrote:
...is Ripard still a good CSM member?
Even if I totally disagree with him on this one issue... it is after all one issue.

So yes, I consider him a good CSM member.
Kate stark
#347 - 2013-10-08 11:48:34 UTC
i don't think any of the CSMs are bad.

let's put it in perspective; at least they've bothered to comment on the issue (regardless of whether we agree with them, or not) unlike CCP.

Yay, this account hasn't had its signature banned. or its account, if you're reading this.
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#348 - 2013-10-08 12:51:07 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
Mabelaba wrote:
The CSM is nothing but a CCP marketing tool. Think that's obvious by now.


Yes... but it's more than that... It's also a way to make people think they have a vote in the "matter" when actually they don't Twisted
Ranger 1
Ranger Corp
Vae. Victis.
#349 - 2013-10-08 13:51:14 UTC  |  Edited by: Ranger 1
raven666wings wrote:
Mabelaba wrote:
The CSM is nothing but a CCP marketing tool. Think that's obvious by now.


Yes... but it's more than that... It's also a way to make people think they have a vote on the "matter" when actually they don't Twisted

The CSM has never been represented as giving people "a vote" in CCP decisions. Where the hell did you get that ridiculous idea?

The CSM is a sounding board for CCP decisions.
The CSM is considered to give CCP a reasonably accurate idea of what the player base will think about certain things.
The CSM is occasionally asked for idea's or advice.
The CSM relays important information to the player base whenever possible.

At no point in time are CCP decisions put of for a vote, nor should they be.

View the latest EVE Online developments and other game related news and gameplay by visiting Ranger 1 Presents: Virtual Realms.
Jenn aSide
Soul Machines
The Initiative.
#350 - 2013-10-08 14:00:43 UTC
Ranger 1 wrote:
raven666wings wrote:
Mabelaba wrote:
The CSM is nothing but a CCP marketing tool. Think that's obvious by now.


Yes... but it's more than that... It's also a way to make people think they have a vote on the "matter" when actually they don't Twisted

The CSM has never been represented as giving people "a vote" in CCP decisions. Where the hell did you get that ridiculous idea?

The CSM is a sounding board for CCP decisions.
The CSM is considered to give CCP a reasonably accurate idea of what the player base will think about certain things.
The CSM is occasionally asked for idea's or advice.
The CSM relays important information to the player base whenever possible.

At no point in time are CCP decisions put of for a vote, nor should they be.


It doesn't matter how many times this has been said since before the 1st CSM (and uit's been said over and over and over), some people will always equate "vote" with "power to do stuff" even though anyone should be able to see without having to be told that the CSM is at best an advisory body.
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#351 - 2013-10-08 14:29:37 UTC
Ranger 1 wrote:

At no point in time are CCP decisions put of for a vote, nor should they be.


I see. Thanks for reinforcing what I wrote. I thought i didn't express myself quite clearly.

Jenn aSide wrote:
CSM is at best an advisory body.


I prefer to use the one located in Account Management under the "Cancel Subscription" section. It seems to gather their attention better.
Murk Paradox
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#352 - 2013-10-08 14:31:12 UTC
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Murk Paradox wrote:
Minus the ability to produce them you mean.

The only thing determined by the lack of production is that the ship will have an increased price compared to it's normal counterpart. The extent of the price increase is a function of how many people want it and what amount of isk they are willing to throw at it. CCP has no control over the latter 2 factors.



CCP has control over the # of them introduced into the game, and as they are meant to be a collectible, therefore their price based on rarity would be relevant, not allowing a proper count is in bad taste.

I'll put it a different way...

You have someone who wants to show their appreciation. They do this with gifting you an item that's known to be rare, based on the fact that the rare item has value, therefore it's a sign of your value to the person.

You are of course excited. One, someone likes you (not a slight =P), and 2, they gave you something not only of a value, but of rarity.

Now, you find out that item you so coveted based on rarity, isn't so rare after all. So the value drops because of it. Not only that, but there may be MORE of them still being produced and awarded to other people.

So much for that individual success right? That person lied to you!

Now you might feel a tad betrayed. Now all your dreams of auctioning that awesome rare item doesn't seem so exciting anymore.

Now, to put that into perspective of this game...

CCP is well aware how much those collector's items are worth, and they have a rarity associated to it by the # currently ingame.

But that # is unknown by the people who have them. The value is unknown.

That's bad form.

The point of having a small # of any item for the sake of rarity is for it to be 1 of X. Granted that X can increase, but you should still be able to know what that X is.

Why have a special limited edition Ferrari if Ferrari doesn't tell you how many they made?

This post has been signed by Murk Paradox and no other accounts, alternate or otherwise. Any other post claiming to be this holder's is subject to being banned at the discretion of the GM Team as it would violate the TOS in regards to impersonation. Signed, Murk Paradox. In triplicate.
James Amril-Kesh
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#353 - 2013-10-08 14:32:42 UTC  |  Edited by: James Amril-Kesh
Jenn aSide wrote:
It doesn't matter how many times this has been said since before the 1st CSM (and uit's been said over and over and over), some people will always equate "vote" with "power to do stuff" even though anyone should be able to see without having to be told that the CSM is at best an advisory body.


And that's fine. CCP still needs to tell the CSM stuff like this. That way the CSM can tell CCP that the playerbase is going to be angry. Then if CCP does it anyway the CSM can be like "told you so". It can be a bargaining chip in future discussions. "This is what happened the last time you didn't listen to us."

Enjoying the rain today? ;)
Kate stark
#354 - 2013-10-08 14:38:13 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
It doesn't matter how many times this has been said since before the 1st CSM (and uit's been said over and over and over), some people will always equate "vote" with "power to do stuff" even though anyone should be able to see without having to be told that the CSM is at best an advisory body.


And that's fine. CCP still needs to tell the CSM stuff like this. That way the CSM can tell CCP that the playerbase is going to be angry. Then if CCP does it anyway the CSM can be like "told you so". It can be a bargaining chip in future discussions. "This is what happened the last time you didn't listen to us."


sorry what's that? CCP can't hear you over the sound of all the IW scorpions they're giving to their new "community partners" (but don't tell any one)

Yay, this account hasn't had its signature banned. or its account, if you're reading this.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#355 - 2013-10-08 14:39:41 UTC
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
It doesn't matter how many times this has been said since before the 1st CSM (and uit's been said over and over and over), some people will always equate "vote" with "power to do stuff" even though anyone should be able to see without having to be told that the CSM is at best an advisory body.

And that's fine. CCP still needs to tell the CSM stuff like this. That way the CSM can tell CCP that the playerbase is going to be angry. Then if CCP does it anyway the CSM can be like "told you so". It can be a bargaining chip in future discussions. "This is what happened the last time you didn't listen to us."

Why would ccp give the csm a bargaining chip.

It's much better to force them in front like human flameshields. Might be a warcrime, but eve online is harsh and cold.

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#356 - 2013-10-08 14:40:10 UTC
Kate stark wrote:
James Amril-Kesh wrote:
Jenn aSide wrote:
It doesn't matter how many times this has been said since before the 1st CSM (and uit's been said over and over and over), some people will always equate "vote" with "power to do stuff" even though anyone should be able to see without having to be told that the CSM is at best an advisory body.

And that's fine. CCP still needs to tell the CSM stuff like this. That way the CSM can tell CCP that the playerbase is going to be angry. Then if CCP does it anyway the CSM can be like "told you so". It can be a bargaining chip in future discussions. "This is what happened the last time you didn't listen to us."

sorry what's that? CCP can't hear you over the sound of all the IW scorpions they're giving to their new "community partners" (but don't tell any one)

If you can hear it, they clearly weren't doing a good job of hiding it...

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Signal11th
#357 - 2013-10-08 14:40:16 UTC
Murk Paradox wrote:
Tyberius Franklin wrote:
Murk Paradox wrote:
Minus the ability to produce them you mean.

The only thing determined by the lack of production is that the ship will have an increased price compared to it's normal counterpart. The extent of the price increase is a function of how many people want it and what amount of isk they are willing to throw at it. CCP has no control over the latter 2 factors.



CCP has control over the # of them introduced into the game, and as they are meant to be a collectible, therefore their price based on rarity would be relevant, not allowing a proper count is in bad taste.

I'll put it a different way...

You have someone who wants to show their appreciation. They do this with gifting you an item that's known to be rare, based on the fact that the rare item has value, therefore it's a sign of your value to the person.

You are of course excited. One, someone likes you (not a slight =P), and 2, they gave you something not only of a value, but of rarity.

Now, you find out that item you so coveted based on rarity, isn't so rare after all. So the value drops because of it. Not only that, but there may be MORE of them still being produced and awarded to other people.

So much for that individual success right? That person lied to you!

Now you might feel a tad betrayed. Now all your dreams of auctioning that awesome rare item doesn't seem so exciting anymore.

Now, to put that into perspective of this game...

CCP is well aware how much those collector's items are worth, and they have a rarity associated to it by the # currently ingame.

But that # is unknown by the people who have them. The value is unknown.

That's bad form.

The point of having a small # of any item for the sake of rarity is for it to be 1 of X. Granted that X can increase, but you should still be able to know what that X is.

Why have a special limited edition Ferrari if Ferrari doesn't tell you how many they made?


Only when it comes to selling it otherwise its as worthless as anything else in your hangar.

God Said "Come Forth and receive eternal life!" I came fifth and won a toaster!
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#358 - 2013-10-08 14:44:39 UTC
:1trit:

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
raven666wings
Cyber Chaos Crew
#359 - 2013-10-08 14:46:07 UTC  |  Edited by: raven666wings
Kate stark wrote:

sorry what's that? CCP can't hear you over the sound of all the IW scorpions they're giving to their new "community partners" (but don't tell any one)


new "community partners" AKA Scammers'R'Us Twisted
Zen Guerrilla
CTRL-Q
Ushra'Khan
#360 - 2013-10-08 14:51:11 UTC
I ASLO FIND IT TOTALLY AUNFAIR THAT SOMEBODY AT CCP GAVE SOMETHING TO SOMEONE FOR SOMETHING THEXY DID AND IT WASNT ME.
I MEAN, I DONT DO ANYTHING OTHER THNA COMPLAIN ON THE FORUMS AND I NEVER DID ANYTHING SPECIAL FOR THE GAEM BUT I DESERVE SOMETHING. OR, IF I GET NOTHING, SO SHOULD EVERYODY ELSE.

Am i doing this right?

pew pew