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Random Ice belt deposits
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Omega Flames
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#21 - 2013-10-07 22:23:41 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Omega Flames wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
This would mean hunting down ice fields, and promote a bit of healthy competition. It would also make it a nightmare logistically to run fleets of bots for ice mining, and anything that makes a botters life harder is a good thing.

actually it makes it a nightmare for players to run around and ice mine not bots. there are just 2 ways to stop a bot, either make it so its impossible for a bot to do it or check to see if there is bot code running. Since you'd have to have the current system where ice is listed somewhere then the bot could easily just look that up same as a human would so having them move around doesn't really stop any bots at all (esp if they already can warp to the correct sites in the same system). Ore is plentiful enough that I can simply look around until I find a system that isn't heavily mined and setup operations there...ice mining should be the same.

I don't think many botters would like to waste their time getting bots to aimlessly fly around looking for ice belts. they'd likely just move onto ore. As it is at the moment, botters can now to the second when ice is going to respawn and where. This is why you see floods of them arriving in the ice belts seconds after it spawns.

And you think players want to aimlessly fly around to find ice? Do i really look like I want to make an unknown number of jumps every time I want to mine ice? Oh and ore mining is already more profitable than ice mining. The only time it hasnt was for gallente ice during the ice interdiction. Would you like to see some code that would automatically fly you around several systems and check if there are any ice sigs in system? cause it would be child's play for me to macro that using mouse clicks and OCR. Being able to write the code has NEVER been the issue but rather not getting caught using a macro.
SheepChaser Woolhands
Doomheim
#22 - 2013-10-08 11:29:24 UTC
Supporting random ice deposits. +1
Lucas Kell
Solitude Trading
S.N.O.T.
#23 - 2013-10-08 11:59:45 UTC  |  Edited by: Lucas Kell
Omega Flames wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I don't think many botters would like to waste their time getting bots to aimlessly fly around looking for ice belts. they'd likely just move onto ore. As it is at the moment, botters can now to the second when ice is going to respawn and where. This is why you see floods of them arriving in the ice belts seconds after it spawns.

And you think players want to aimlessly fly around to find ice? Do i really look like I want to make an unknown number of jumps every time I want to mine ice? Oh and ore mining is already more profitable than ice mining. The only time it hasnt was for gallente ice during the ice interdiction. Would you like to see some code that would automatically fly you around several systems and check if there are any ice sigs in system? cause it would be child's play for me to macro that using mouse clicks and OCR. Being able to write the code has NEVER been the issue but rather not getting caught using a macro.
Well no, I know (at least now) you just want to easily return to the same spot and grind ice into isk every 4 hours. I don't really think it should be that easy though.
Sure, the code would not be complex, but it would still be more complex than it currently is. the real question is though, why should you just be handed everything you need on a plate? Why should "competition" of ice mining purely revolve around who can get the most amount of alts into the belt.
Also, the reason ice is not as profitable is because everyone knows where it is and can easily mine it out.
By making ice spawns random, you introduce more competition and you make the market more fluid. I get that you want to protect your easy income, but I honestly think more diversity would be better in the long run.

Oh and with the botters, you miss the point. IF their bots have to fly system to system, they are not making isk. They would be unlikely to chose this as an option over the readily available asteroid belts.

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Omega Flames
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#24 - 2013-10-08 19:11:24 UTC
Lucas Kell wrote:
Omega Flames wrote:
Lucas Kell wrote:
I don't think many botters would like to waste their time getting bots to aimlessly fly around looking for ice belts. they'd likely just move onto ore. As it is at the moment, botters can now to the second when ice is going to respawn and where. This is why you see floods of them arriving in the ice belts seconds after it spawns.

And you think players want to aimlessly fly around to find ice? Do i really look like I want to make an unknown number of jumps every time I want to mine ice? Oh and ore mining is already more profitable than ice mining. The only time it hasnt was for gallente ice during the ice interdiction. Would you like to see some code that would automatically fly you around several systems and check if there are any ice sigs in system? cause it would be child's play for me to macro that using mouse clicks and OCR. Being able to write the code has NEVER been the issue but rather not getting caught using a macro.


Well no, I know (at least now) you just want to easily return to the same spot and grind ice into isk every 4 hours. I don't really think it should be that easy though.
Sure, the code would not be complex, but it would still be more complex than it currently is. the real question is though, why should you just be handed everything you need on a plate? Why should "competition" of ice mining purely revolve around who can get the most amount of alts into the belt.
ok seriously the level of ignorance coming from you is getting a bit overwelling. If you would have actually read what i wrote then you'd see that I have NEVER supported the current system nor did I EVER support the old ice mining mechanics for that matter. I said it should be like ore is now, almost every system having an ice belt and once the ice is mined out then it's gone until DT...just like ore is now. Nothing is being handed to me on any kind of plate, I have to get out there and earn it by mining it. Infact as far as ice mining is concerned most players CANT earn anything cause the ice site is on CD most of the time. No one wants to sit there and wait on the next spawn or hunt down in any random system with a slow mining barge for the next spawn.
Quote:



Also, the reason ice is not as profitable is because everyone knows where it is and can easily mine it out.
By making ice spawns random, you introduce more competition and you make the market more fluid. I get that you want to protect your easy income, but I honestly think more diversity would be better in the long run.
wrong, the reason ice isn't as profitable is because each unit of ice gives very little ice products. 1 racial block only gives out .33 LO, .16 HW, and .75 isotope mats for enough blocks for 1 hours worth of fuel for a large tower. That means you need up to 6 blocks to get 1 hours fuel.
Quote:


Oh and with the botters, you miss the point. IF their bots have to fly system to system, they are not making isk. They would be unlikely to chose this as an option over the readily available asteroid belts.
And I'm not making any isk if i have to fly system to system to track down an ice belt either. When you have a mechanic that's no fun for people that actually increases the want for people to just write a bot to do it, not drive them away from botting.
Goatman NotMyFault
Lubrication Industries
#25 - 2013-10-09 09:09:19 UTC
bump
OdinEr SlappiTarmen
Doomheim
#26 - 2013-10-09 12:51:38 UTC
like the idea. +1
Terribilia Horribilis
Doomheim
#27 - 2013-10-09 17:07:15 UTC
supporting this idea!
Eliza Loney
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#28 - 2013-10-09 18:05:54 UTC
+1

Ice used to be boring, not it is just as boring but >over there> instead.

I would like a GM / DEV / CSM to sit in a high-sec ice system and count how many ice miners on on belt in the first 30 seconds, first 5 mins etc.

The isboxer crowd aside, how many people can realistically get to ice if you are roaming for it? I know the 4 hour timer is easy to predict but prove to us that all the miners that show up in unison and activate their beams at the same time are NOT bots?

I gave up on ice mining after the change because I do not have 20ish alts to help me out. Forgive me if I am wrong but I should be able to ENJOY my game play with having a few hundred bot like people show up.

I have shut down my POS operation because the prices have gone up and I cannot be on every 4 hours to mine ice ( job, eating etc )
Violetta Wong
Doomheim
#29 - 2013-10-09 22:08:33 UTC
Thumbs up for this!
Goatman NotMyFault
Lubrication Industries
#30 - 2013-10-10 08:43:33 UTC
Eliza Loney wrote:
+1

Ice used to be boring, not it is just as boring but >over there> instead.

I would like a GM / DEV / CSM to sit in a high-sec ice system and count how many ice miners on on belt in the first 30 seconds, first 5 mins etc.

The isboxer crowd aside, how many people can realistically get to ice if you are roaming for it? I know the 4 hour timer is easy to predict but prove to us that all the miners that show up in unison and activate their beams at the same time are NOT bots?

I gave up on ice mining after the change because I do not have 20ish alts to help me out. Forgive me if I am wrong but I should be able to ENJOY my game play with having a few hundred bot like people show up.

I have shut down my POS operation because the prices have gone up and I cannot be on every 4 hours to mine ice ( job, eating etc )


Ive jumped into icebelts with a miningfleet of 6 and ended that belt fast, never got so many threats and insult as then. People tend to be very obsest and protective over what they assume is their ice. Ergo is random belts more fair for all.
Hesod Adee
Perkone
Caldari State
#31 - 2013-10-10 08:51:46 UTC
Omega Flames wrote:
And you think players want to aimlessly fly around to find ice?

I'd expect players to get an arrangement with people who are already spread out over high sec to watch for ice anoms and tell the miners when they show up.
Femalis Horribilis
Doomheim
#32 - 2013-10-10 19:10:38 UTC
me like +1
Goatman NotMyFault
Lubrication Industries
#33 - 2013-10-10 21:54:08 UTC
Hesod Adee wrote:
Omega Flames wrote:
And you think players want to aimlessly fly around to find ice?

I'd expect players to get an arrangement with people who are already spread out over high sec to watch for ice anoms and tell the miners when they show up.


Well i cant say ive seen people roaming around scanning to find ore depsits, but i can see ure point that some will go hunting... but i belive it wont be in a large scale
Suriv Virus
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#34 - 2013-10-11 10:03:08 UTC
Supporting random ice deposits. +1
Omega Flames
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#35 - 2013-10-11 20:11:25 UTC
Hesod Adee wrote:
Omega Flames wrote:
And you think players want to aimlessly fly around to find ice?

I'd expect players to get an arrangement with people who are already spread out over high sec to watch for ice anoms and tell the miners when they show up.

id expect you to be smart enough to realize people arent going to tell their competition where the next spawn is at
Huttan Funaila
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#36 - 2013-10-11 21:54:53 UTC
Goatman NotMyFault wrote:
why cant we mine ice from ice planets??

Because Wampa and Tauntaun are endangered creatures.
Goatman NotMyFault
Lubrication Industries
#37 - 2013-10-11 22:15:42 UTC
Huttan Funaila wrote:
Goatman NotMyFault wrote:
why cant we mine ice from ice planets??

Because Wampa and Tauntaun are endangered creatures.


Damn it, so hunting them is now banned??? ;p
Bleeding RoidRider
Doomheim
#38 - 2013-10-12 23:13:45 UTC
like this idea. +1
Owen Levanth
Sagittarius Unlimited Exploration
#39 - 2013-10-13 12:03:35 UTC
Ice mining on planets sounds dumb, in (real) space there is a lot more ice and much easier to "mine", so letting people go the other way wouldn't make sense lore-wise, it wouldn't make economical sense, it wouldn't make logical sense. Why go through all the trouble of launching and exporting ice from the ground if there is already plenty in space and for free?

Now random ice belt deposits in space I could get behind. If CCP adds random space monsters hiding in the ice, I'll intend to fully support it! +22
Toilett Brush
SSansha Empire
#40 - 2013-10-14 14:31:34 UTC
Support author on this. +1
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