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[Rubicon] Warp Speed and Acceleration

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Author
Arec Bardwin
#241 - 2013-10-07 00:37:13 UTC
Sizeof Void wrote:
lol... you must be a child of the video game era, and have never played chess or baseball.
You are comparing the warp tunnel to chess and baseball? Seriously Big smile
Sizeof Void
Ninja Suicide Squadron
#242 - 2013-10-07 02:15:21 UTC
Arec Bardwin wrote:
Sizeof Void wrote:
lol... you must be a child of the video game era, and have never played chess or baseball.
You are comparing the warp tunnel to chess and baseball? Seriously Big smile

No, actually I was talking about you, not the game. :)

Waiting a whole minute for something to happen must be difficult indeed for the ADD-inflicted FPS-addicted younger generation of gamers. I can't even imagine what waiting 2-3 minutes must be like for them. Well... that's not true - I have a 4-year-old nephew. Fortunately, CCP isn't targeting that market... yet. lol.
Dinsdale Pirannha
Pirannha Corp
#243 - 2013-10-07 03:57:09 UTC
Given how few people are posting about this paradigm-shifting game mechanic change, the rage that will kick in after Nov 19th is going to be flat out nuts, when the majority of players, who never read the forums, are impacted by this massive change.

Pretty much every mission runner and incursion runner just saw their effective income slashed due to the increased idle time in warp. Low sec gate camps are going to see a lot more incredibly quick EAF's, and even if you avoid the camp when you jump into a system, they will be waiting for you when you land at the next gate.

Null sec, meh, not much change, unless we really see clouds of Taranis running around, because inties can tackle, but you need an awful lot to do serious damage, and anyone caught by an inty can batphone for help before dying.

The safe bet is that CCP will ease off the changes once the backlash hits, and they will tighten the spreads.
Arec Bardwin
#244 - 2013-10-07 08:02:26 UTC
Sizeof Void wrote:
Arec Bardwin wrote:
Sizeof Void wrote:
lol... you must be a child of the video game era, and have never played chess or baseball.
You are comparing the warp tunnel to chess and baseball? Seriously Big smile

No, actually I was talking about you, not the game. :)
Oh, It was a personal insult, I guess that's fine thenRoll
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
#245 - 2013-10-07 09:32:40 UTC
Dinsdale Pirannha wrote:
Given how few people are posting about this paradigm-shifting game mechanic change, the rage that will kick in after Nov 19th is going to be flat out nuts, when the majority of players, who never read the forums, are impacted by this massive change.

Pretty much every mission runner and incursion runner just saw their effective income slashed due to the increased idle time in warp. Low sec gate camps are going to see a lot more incredibly quick EAF's, and even if you avoid the camp when you jump into a system, they will be waiting for you when you land at the next gate.

Null sec, meh, not much change, unless we really see clouds of Taranis running around, because inties can tackle, but you need an awful lot to do serious damage, and anyone caught by an inty can batphone for help before dying.

The safe bet is that CCP will ease off the changes once the backlash hits, and they will tighten the spreads.


You're wrong about nullsec: this is going to change the nullsec PvP meta a lot.

"Just remember later that I warned against any change to jump ranges or fatigue. You earned whats coming."

Grath Telkin, 11.10.2016

Ynef
Skill Extraction Slavery
#246 - 2013-10-07 09:50:12 UTC
What are the plans for pods? Can an interceptor catch a pod (by warping faster) after this change?
Debora Tsung
Perkone
Caldari State
#247 - 2013-10-07 11:21:35 UTC
Irnal Zek wrote:
Freighters getting even slower Shocked

So without webs Jita-rens and back will take you about 2hours of "select next gate press jump"
Brilliant gameplay.


On the other hand, a 5 minutes warp is enough time to panick and try to get a corp mate to undock and light a cyno. Just in case they're waiting for you at your warp exit point. Straight

Stupidity should be a bannable offense.

Fighting back is more fun than not.

Sticky: AFK Cloaking Thread It's not pretty, but it's there.

Suitonia
The Bastards
#248 - 2013-10-07 13:01:11 UTC
Ynef wrote:
What are the plans for pods? Can an interceptor catch a pod (by warping faster) after this change?


An Interceptor still won't be able to pod you even if it is at the destination of the pod before the pod lands since pods have perfect agility. (Providing the pod is trying to warp as soon as he lands). If you land on a bubble / or an interdictor follows you however then you'll likely get podded.

Contributer to Eve is Easy:  https://www.youtube.com/user/eveiseasy/videos

Solo PvP is possible with a 20 day old character! :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvOB4KXYk-o

CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#249 - 2013-10-07 13:43:30 UTC
Hey guys, I'm back from vacation and am now fully caught up on this thread. I'm gonna reply to a bunch of questions now, and we're not far off from these changes getting onto Sisi so you can all test them out for yourselves!

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie

CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#250 - 2013-10-07 13:43:45 UTC
Terje Teinturier wrote:
Is it possible that the session timer becomes a problem for faster ships traversing relatively small systems?

Players may run into it in small systems if they warp very very fast after jumping, but since you can easily get around it in the same way as when you want to burn back (just wait a few seconds while under gatecloak) we don't really see a problem.

FlinchingNinja Kishunuba wrote:
How do accelerator gates work with this? Will the speeds still be from ship attributes? So a frig can beat a cruiser if activating at the same time?

Yup. Acceleration gates just start a normal warp behind the scenes, so they will get the same changes.

Wolf Kyosuke wrote:
Is it correct for me to presume that, despite these changes, it is still considered an exploit to avoid concord by warping either on or off grid after ganking a miner in a destroyer even though it would be easier to do now?

Yes, avoiding CONCORD's response is always an exploit no matter how you do it.

Cage Man wrote:
Is this going to impact fleet warp mechanics, ie if a fleet warps at the same time, fleet warp and everyone is full speed aligned, will the whole fleet still come out of warp together or will the smaller ships land first ?

Fleet warps will continue to lock the whole fleet into the slowest warp speed of any ship catching the warp. When a group uses fleet/wing/squad warps everyone that warped together will still arrive at the same time.

Debir Achen wrote:
I note shuttles, pods, and noobships aren't listed. Currently, shuttles are 2/6 (same as frig), noobships 1/3 (same as cruiser, etc) and I believe pods are 1/3 also. What happens to these post-retribution?

Shuttles will remain equal with T1 frigates, Rookie ships and Capsules will remain the same as T1 Cruisers.

ZoraTestra wrote:
Are you taking into account the Eifyr and Co. 'Rogue' Warp Drive Speed series implants?

Those will continue to work in the same way as before, but will now be useful since the attribute they affect will also affect acceleration.

Altrue wrote:
First, thanks for finally changing this mechanic ! You rock !

Now about the changes themselves, they are pretty good... EXCEPT !

1- Attack BC should warp faster than other BCs imo.

2- Where is the orca on your chart ? Capital ship ? (If yes, this is a very bad idea imo :D)

3- You killed my rigged 20Au/sec travel rapooooor :-( (because his base warp speed will now be 10 au /sec if I read the chart correctly)

1 - We don't feel that a warp speed increase on the Attack BCs is warranted, just as the attack frigs and cruisers don't get warp speed increases.
2 - Orca warps at battleship speeds
3 - Your raptor will actually make virtually any practical warp faster after these changes than before. The increase in acceleration rate more than counteracts the decrease in max warp speed.

Marian Devers wrote:
Question:
In Rubicon, the "WarpSpeedMultiplier" will now affect warp speed acceleration. Why was this parameter chosen, instead of making SHIP MASS affect acceleration?

We're very hesitant to attach even more things to the mass attribute right now. Doing it this way gave us better control over the balance we wanted to achieve.

Warde Guildencrantz wrote:
can we get a low slot module that increases warp speed? like a nano.

This kind of thing is very possible, we're playing around with a bunch of options now.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie

TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#251 - 2013-10-07 13:55:02 UTC
I don't really like it where there's a stat you can improve with a rig, but not with a module. Warp speed is one of those. Penalties to shields would be nice, give armour bros a break.
Bubanni
Corus Aerospace
#252 - 2013-10-07 13:55:50 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
ZoraTestra wrote:
Are you taking into account the Eifyr and Co. 'Rogue' Warp Drive Speed series implants?

Those will continue to work in the same way as before, but will now be useful since the attribute they affect will also affect acceleration.


would be awesome if the https://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Eifyr_and_Co._'Rogue'_Warp_Drive_Speed_WS-615 implant series (warp speed implant) was made into another slot like 9 or even 10 :D

Supercap nerf - change ewar immunity https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194759 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934

Warde Guildencrantz
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#253 - 2013-10-07 13:59:47 UTC
it would be awesome if pirate omegas had their own slot...

TunDraGon ~ Low sec piracy since 2003 ~ Youtube ~ Join Us

Bubanni
Corus Aerospace
#254 - 2013-10-07 14:04:19 UTC
Warde Guildencrantz wrote:
it would be awesome if pirate omegas had their own slot...


Yeah, that's why I asked if it could get a different slot, because I fly with pirate omega, but wish I could also use a warp speed implant hehe

Supercap nerf - change ewar immunity https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=194759 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934

CCP Fozzie
C C P
C C P Alliance
#255 - 2013-10-07 14:08:25 UTC
And now a quick note on freighters. We knew that we wanted to expand the spread between the slowest warping ships and the fastest, and we didn't want to take the tempting but potentially damaging route of just buffing everything and making the galaxy smaller for every ship.

Obviously there's a fine line to walk here, but I think we found a strong compromise with the amount that we raised the freighter and JF warp speeds. It is definitely an increase in their average warp times, which is intentional. But it's not back breaking and I believe that it's quite well balanced in relation to their massive cargoholds. For trips where faster warp speeds are needed, people always have the choice of taking smaller volumes in something like an industrial or DST.

Options like adding rigs to freighters could very well happen someday, as we're fairly open that that idea and have been giving it some thought. However we're not going to commit to anything along those lines at this time.

Game Designer | Team Five-0

Twitter: @CCP_Fozzie
Twitch chat: ccp_fozzie

TrouserDeagle
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#256 - 2013-10-07 14:15:03 UTC
CCP Fozzie wrote:
And now a quick note on freighters. We knew that we wanted to expand the spread between the slowest warping ships and the fastest, and we didn't want to take the tempting but potentially damaging route of just buffing everything and making the galaxy smaller for every ship.

Obviously there's a fine line to walk here, but I think we found a strong compromise with the amount that we raised the freighter and JF warp speeds. It is definitely an increase in their average warp times, which is intentional. But it's not back breaking and I believe that it's quite well balanced in relation to their massive cargoholds. For trips where faster warp speeds are needed, people always have the choice of taking smaller volumes in something like an industrial or DST.

Options like adding rigs to freighters could very well happen someday, as we're fairly open that that idea and have been giving it some thought. However we're not going to commit to anything along those lines at this time.


You should look at jump drive travel if you want to make the galaxy big again.
Tikitina
Doomheim
#257 - 2013-10-07 14:42:22 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
And now a quick note on freighters. We knew that we wanted to expand the spread between the slowest warping ships and the fastest, and we didn't want to take the tempting but potentially damaging route of just buffing everything and making the galaxy smaller for every ship.

Obviously there's a fine line to walk here, but I think we found a strong compromise with the amount that we raised the freighter and JF warp speeds. It is definitely an increase in their average warp times, which is intentional. But it's not back breaking and I believe that it's quite well balanced in relation to their massive cargoholds. For trips where faster warp speeds are needed, people always have the choice of taking smaller volumes in something like an industrial or DST.

Options like adding rigs to freighters could very well happen someday, as we're fairly open that that idea and have been giving it some thought. However we're not going to commit to anything along those lines at this time.


You should look at jump drive travel if you want to make the galaxy big again.


As in, remove it.

Garviel Tarrant
Beyond Divinity Inc
Shadow Cartel
#258 - 2013-10-07 14:43:01 UTC
TrouserDeagle wrote:
I don't really like it where there's a stat you can improve with a rig, but not with a module. Warp speed is one of those. Penalties to shields would be nice, give armour bros a break.


Actually this..

Why are there no rigs with shield penalties? =<

BYDI recruitment closed-ish

Bouh Revetoile
In Wreck we thrust
#259 - 2013-10-07 14:44:05 UTC
Garviel Tarrant wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
I don't really like it where there's a stat you can improve with a rig, but not with a module. Warp speed is one of those. Penalties to shields would be nice, give armour bros a break.


Actually this..

Why are there no rigs with shield penalties? =<

Like electronic superiority rigs for example ?
Callic Veratar
#260 - 2013-10-07 15:08:33 UTC
Tikitina wrote:
TrouserDeagle wrote:
CCP Fozzie wrote:
And now a quick note on freighters. We knew that we wanted to expand the spread between the slowest warping ships and the fastest, and we didn't want to take the tempting but potentially damaging route of just buffing everything and making the galaxy smaller for every ship.

Obviously there's a fine line to walk here, but I think we found a strong compromise with the amount that we raised the freighter and JF warp speeds. It is definitely an increase in their average warp times, which is intentional. But it's not back breaking and I believe that it's quite well balanced in relation to their massive cargoholds. For trips where faster warp speeds are needed, people always have the choice of taking smaller volumes in something like an industrial or DST.

Options like adding rigs to freighters could very well happen someday, as we're fairly open that that idea and have been giving it some thought. However we're not going to commit to anything along those lines at this time.


You should look at jump drive travel if you want to make the galaxy big again.


As in, remove it.



It doesn't need to be removed to make things slower. Give jumping a spool up timer, have the jump transition take time (0.1ly/s?), reduce jump distance, or increasing fuel consumption would all make it harder to jump so quickly.