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FIX LOGI FIX MISSILE SHIPS PVP

First post
Author
Grunnax Aurelius
State War Academy
Caldari State
#21 - 2013-09-27 14:34:17 UTC
any smart logi would ignore the painter and add another rep :)

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=342042&find=unread

Robbie Robot
Exiled Kings
Pain And Compliance
#22 - 2013-09-27 14:57:00 UTC  |  Edited by: Robbie Robot
This already exists in a easier to use form. It is called a SW-300 Warrior, which does 5% speed reduction. I think all logis can fit 5 or more of these. You can also bring the Huggin if you want a really long range web. If you are having troubles with missile ships in PvP, and expect this to help in the slightest, I'd have to accuse you of not putting together the right fleets. If anything is wrong with missiles it is that they some have a long delay between when you activate the module, and when the target takes damage, or in other words, flight time. I think a low slot module that increased speed by 15-20% would be more useful.

I'd rather they change logi mechanics such that using a rep on someone with a weapons timer gives the timer to the logi. I'm sure CCP is already working on getting logi's on killmails.
Josilin du Guesclin
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#23 - 2013-09-27 15:47:03 UTC
Oswald Bolke wrote:

of just chuck drone in and assist them on the leader

This.

If you want your logi on killmails, bring some combat drones, and assist them to your DPS. Done.
Ciaphas Cyne
Moira.
#24 - 2013-09-27 17:45:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Ciaphas Cyne
Darling Hassasin wrote:
Ciaphas Cyne wrote:
now most posts in Features and Ideas are self-serving, thats a given. Whats neat about this post is that its so specificly tailored to the OPs wants and desires. I also greatly appreciate the shocked "what do you mean this isnt something every player would want?" attitude.


You should have read the OP to the end and you would realise that I can fly anything I want (and actually do). If I wanted a post about my personal needs it would probably be about docking supercapitals so I would have more of my chars available regularly.

However failposting is a time honoured tradition in eve-o froums so I am glad to see you keeping the faith.


lets analyze the thought process that lead you to this super awesome idea that benefits everyone:

"gee i really like my logi ship but i cant seem to get on killmails..."

"i know! ill put a target painter on!....wait....i cant fit one without making a sacrifice...."

"ah! ive got it! ill go complain on the forums that I want to totally change TPs just so i can make this one fit work"

"and ya know...i may as well ***** about how i cant seem to kill stuff in my drake as well...."

am i close?


I have an idea too. i wanna fit more drone damage amps on my myrmi so lets make a high slot DDA! everyone wants that and its totally balanced! but make the highslot DDA only fit on the exact ship i want it for....oh and its also a mini webber!

"buff only the stuff I fly and nerf everything else"

  • you
Darling Hassasin
Parental Control
Didn't want that Sov anyway.
#25 - 2013-09-28 08:48:09 UTC
Ciaphas Cyne wrote:
Darling Hassasin wrote:
Ciaphas Cyne wrote:
now most posts in Features and Ideas are self-serving, thats a given. Whats neat about this post is that its so specificly tailored to the OPs wants and desires. I also greatly appreciate the shocked "what do you mean this isnt something every player would want?" attitude.


You should have read the OP to the end and you would realise that I can fly anything I want (and actually do). If I wanted a post about my personal needs it would probably be about docking supercapitals so I would have more of my chars available regularly.

However failposting is a time honoured tradition in eve-o froums so I am glad to see you keeping the faith.


lets analyze the thought process that lead you to this super awesome idea that benefits everyone:

"gee i really like my logi ship but i cant seem to get on killmails..."

"i know! ill put a target painter on!....wait....i cant fit one without making a sacrifice...."

"ah! ive got it! ill go complain on the forums that I want to totally change TPs just so i can make this one fit work"

"and ya know...i may as well ***** about how i cant seem to kill stuff in my drake as well...."

am i close?


I have an idea too. i wanna fit more drone damage amps on my myrmi so lets make a high slot DDA! everyone wants that and its totally balanced! but make the highslot DDA only fit on the exact ship i want it for....oh and its also a mini webber!


No you are not close you are quite far away because you are a noob thinking like a noob.

I dont fly Logis. I need to offer a better incentive to people in pvp to fly Logis.

I find it bizzare that with the cruise buffs and extreme proliferation of their use in pve their still havent found a way onto pvp. I was thinking of Phoon, TFI, Raven, CNR, SNI etc not Drake you absolute noob. A HML drake does not seriously benefit from my concept.

The majority (99%) of the few thousand kills I have with my 2-3 mains are from turret ships. I have no kill in a logi (fore example with drones) and no loss ever in a Logi on any of those chars, so either I am the most awsomnesauce Logi pilot ever to fly in EvE or you are a complete noob and your prejudice is entirely unjustified.

If you are interest in checking the accuracy of the above send me a pm for the names of the chars to check out. If not. FOCUS ON DISCUSSING THE MERITS AND DEMERITS OF THE ISSUE AT HAND rathert than trying to eb a knwoitall...
Barrogh Habalu
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#26 - 2013-09-28 09:37:00 UTC
Darling Hassasin wrote:
Insane fitting requirements. 99% reduction for fitting it in the Logi role bonus.

CCP can already include "only fits to certain ships" property, this fitting kamasutra isn't needed anymore.
That, and why do people here like to approach issues through esoteric workarounds? Why not suggest something to be addressed straight, like assist flags?

On a side note, some logis already have bonuses for tracking links. I see your point in adding something that can be applied to missiles aswell, so overall gist of your suggestion kind of makes sense.
Paul Panala
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#27 - 2013-10-01 18:40:49 UTC
I don't see why Logi ships should be better than they already are. As you said, they can already turn the tide for a fleet, why should they also get e-war? The kill mail/final blow system is broken anyway, who cares?
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
Agony Empire
#28 - 2013-10-01 19:15:35 UTC
Jezza McWaffle wrote:
Good Logi pilots wont care about killboard whoring plus why would a logo pilot want to lock up an enemy ship which will interfere with his locked targets and reps.


So he can rep the enemy (on accident) of course!
Crellion
Nano Rhinos
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#29 - 2013-10-02 12:07:21 UTC
Paul Panala wrote:
I don't see why Logi ships should be better than they already are. As you said, they can already turn the tide for a fleet, why should they also get e-war? The kill mail/final blow system is broken anyway, who cares?


Yeah as I said this IS a valid point but the proposal is a whole nexus of things fixing at the same time the missile ships. Things like the problems faced when a Logi is locking both enemy and friendly are ALSO valid points and I am somewhat inclined to think that they may be balance enough against each other.
Kenrailae
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#30 - 2013-10-02 12:11:06 UTC
<- Logi pilot


Please do NOT put a target painter bonus on my logistics ship. One more bonus I DON'T need, like my tracking link bonus on my Oneiros.


In fact, please REMOVE the tracking link bonus and give me a sensor strength or capacitor recharge bonus instead.

The Link idea is nice and all... but that's not really what I'm flying a Scimi/Oneiros for. I'm flying it to rep my fleet bro's.






OP, at the end of the day, if you're having to bribe your logi dudes with Kill mails to get them to fly logi, you need to invest in proper logi pilots. Logi isn't about Kill mails. It's about making an otherwise impossible situation not only possible, but likely.

Yes, it can be frustrating, flying logi ALL the time. But a GOOD logi pilot's value can't be measured in SP.

But trying to bribe them into doing the job, so to speak, doesn't get you good logi pilots....

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal

Maximus Aerelius
PROPHET OF ENIGMA
#31 - 2013-10-02 12:13:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Maximus Aerelius
Kenrailae wrote:
<- Logi pilot

OP, at the end of the day, if you're having to bribe your logi dudes with Kill mails to get them to fly logi, you need to invest in proper logi pilots. Logi isn't about Kill mails. It's about making an otherwise impossible situation not only possible, but likely.

Yes, it can be frustrating, flying logi ALL the time. But a GOOD logi pilot's value can't be measured in SP.

But trying to bribe them into doing the job, so to speak, doesn't get you good logi pilots....


I completely agree, it's a career path not a glory hunt. Also a Logi Pilot.

In short I think what Kenrailae was saying was "LogiBro's = BestBros = o/\o" Lol
Darling Hassasin
Parental Control
Didn't want that Sov anyway.
#32 - 2013-10-02 12:37:36 UTC
Kenrailae wrote:
<- Logi pilot




OP, at the end of the day, if you're having to bribe your logi dudes with Kill mails to get them to fly logi, you need to invest in proper logi pilots. Logi isn't about Kill mails. It's about making an otherwise impossible situation not only possible, but likely.



Not sure what they get out of it but as you are a Logi pilot and I am not, I ll take your word for it. v0v
Maximus Aerelius
PROPHET OF ENIGMA
#33 - 2013-10-02 13:24:13 UTC
Darling Hassasin wrote:
Kenrailae wrote:
<- Logi pilot

OP, at the end of the day, if you're having to bribe your logi dudes with Kill mails to get them to fly logi, you need to invest in proper logi pilots. Logi isn't about Kill mails. It's about making an otherwise impossible situation not only possible, but likely.



Not sure what they get out of it but as you are a Logi pilot and I am not, I ll take your word for it. v0v


It's the rush of repping someone back from the brink and knowing you did a pro job...I don't bask in "Killboard Glory" but that's OK, it means I've done my job if we get the kill...not the points on some external website. Just my thoughts, I'm sure some LogiBros want to be on those killboards but changing the Logistics Class isn't the way to go about it IMO.
Kitty Bear
Deep Core Mining Inc.
Caldari State
#34 - 2013-10-02 13:27:29 UTC  |  Edited by: Kitty Bear
fly a Logi with a drone bay

launch combat or ecm drones
assist or guard fc

instant killmail whoring for logi pilot
ISD Tyrozan
ISD Community Communications Liaisons
ISD Alliance
#35 - 2013-10-02 19:44:05 UTC
A trolling post was removed.

Forum rule 5. Trolling is prohibited.

ISD Tyrozan

Captain

Community Communication Liaisons (CCLs)

Interstellar Services Department

@ISDTyrozan | @ISD_CCL

Ciaphas Cyne
Moira.
#36 - 2013-10-02 19:46:19 UTC
Kitty Bear wrote:
fly a Logi with a drone bay

launch combat or ecm drones
assist or guard fc

instant killmail whoring for logi pilot


if the OP was being honest in their request than this would already have occurred to them. but this is not the case. OP wants a very specific fit and assumed crying on the forums might get them somewhere. nice try, but a fail all round.

like i said i want more lows on my myrmi but im not gonna have the pompous sense of self entitlement to go around asking for them when i know the game is balanced by professional developers.

good luck with your idea OP, im sure CCP is gonna make that special mod just for you real soon. maybe they will even put it in a pretty box with a red ribbon and your name on.

o7 bye forum warrior. cya round if you ever figure out where that F1 key is.

"buff only the stuff I fly and nerf everything else"

  • you
Ciaphas Cyne
Moira.
#37 - 2013-10-02 19:50:57 UTC  |  Edited by: Ciaphas Cyne
Darling Hassasin wrote:


The majority (99%) of the few thousand kills I have with my 2-3 mains are from turret ships. I have no kill in a logi (fore example with drones) and no loss ever in a Logi on any of those chars, so either I am the most awsomnesauce Logi pilot ever to fly in EvE or you are a complete noob and your prejudice is entirely unjustified.

If you are interest in checking the accuracy of the above send me a pm for the names of the chars to check out. If not. FOCUS ON DISCUSSING THE MERITS AND DEMERITS OF THE ISSUE AT HAND rathert than trying to eb a knwoitall...


god i guess i really hit a nerve.... maybe i WAS a little too close for comfort? i was just guessing but judging by your forum warrior response.... i guess i guess right. sorry bra

"buff only the stuff I fly and nerf everything else"

  • you
Crellion
Nano Rhinos
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#38 - 2013-10-03 05:22:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Crellion
ISD Tyrozan wrote:
A trolling post was removed.

Forum rule 5. Trolling is prohibited.


Dude you are killing me! They asked for my main to prove that the OP is only a forum warrior who... needs to find F1 LOL (I learned F1-F8 8 years ago but never mind). So I post in three very short - toneless and brief sentences the replies.

I am the main. For where I spin my ships check killboards. Direct answers to that Ciaphas dudes questions aaaaaaaand you go and delete my post and now he is barking all over the wrong tree again. Please re-instate my original post and delete this one once you have done so.

I also send you a message with the OP to confirm the facts.

Kthnxbye
Crellion
Nano Rhinos
PURPLE HELMETED WARRIORS
#39 - 2013-10-03 05:29:50 UTC
Ciaphas Cyne wrote:
Kitty Bear wrote:
fly a Logi with a drone bay

launch combat or ecm drones
assist or guard fc

instant killmail whoring for logi pilot


if the OP was being honest in their request than this would already have occurred to them. but this is not the case. OP wants a very specific fit and assumed crying on the forums might get them somewhere. nice try, but a fail all round.

like i said i want more lows on my myrmi but im not gonna have the pompous sense of self entitlement to go around asking for them when i know the game is balanced by professional developers.

good luck with your idea OP, im sure CCP is gonna make that special mod just for you real soon. maybe they will even put it in a pretty box with a red ribbon and your name on.

o7 bye forum warrior. cya round if you ever figure out where that F1 key is.


Drones are not the answer. 1. they are bad at range of fleet fights. 2. they do not help missiles in anyway which is the second part of the rationale behind the proposal.

About the part of your post I highlighted: Bad example. The reason you want that is so that one particular ship which you allready use a lot, you want it to become better. This has, if you look at it soberly, nothing to do with what I propose. As to who balanced this game I am sorry dude it was not the "professional devs" [omg Tuxford :D] it was the player base. If you had been pew pewint it since 2005 (like I have) or since 2003 (like many other folks) you would know that. Devs are also helpfull, only when they are competent players at the same time (not always the case).

The irony in your post I wont comment on other than to say that from one such as you it is more aking to self insulting.

Thank you for the good lucks I allready said where I am be my guest :)
Kenrailae
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#40 - 2013-10-03 07:03:13 UTC
Maximus Aerelius wrote:
Darling Hassasin wrote:
Kenrailae wrote:
<- Logi pilot

OP, at the end of the day, if you're having to bribe your logi dudes with Kill mails to get them to fly logi, you need to invest in proper logi pilots. Logi isn't about Kill mails. It's about making an otherwise impossible situation not only possible, but likely.



Not sure what they get out of it but as you are a Logi pilot and I am not, I ll take your word for it. v0v


It's the rush of repping someone back from the brink and knowing you did a pro job...I don't bask in "Killboard Glory" but that's OK, it means I've done my job if we get the kill...not the points on some external website. Just my thoughts, I'm sure some LogiBros want to be on those killboards but changing the Logistics Class isn't the way to go about it IMO.




Being on KB's is nice and all, but sticking another bonus or mod on a logistics ship isn't the answer. The answer is more along the lines of adjusting aggression timers to reflect on KM's. Until then, I'll just use and abuse Drone assist as much as I may. The problem with sticking MORE things on logi boats is they already have their hands full with ECCM, Logistics, cap chains, hardeners, monitoring distances, monitoring watch lists, monitoring broadcasts, monitoring relative position of themselves to friendlies and hostiles, monitoring relative position of themselves in relation to warp ins, listening to fleet comms so they're aligned, or warping, etc, monitoring the heat damage on their mods...... shall I continue? lol

Really the last thing they need is ANOTHER thing to do, or a reason they HAVE to lock hostiles as well as friendlies.

IF logistics were going to get another bonus, I'd think they would benefit most from a capacitor bonus, sig radius bonus, or sensor strength bonus.

The Law is a point of View

The NPE IS a big deal

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