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Could null sec survive without high sec?

First post
Author
Paul Otichoda
Perkone
Caldari State
#1 - 2013-09-29 19:09:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Paul Otichoda
theoretically could null sec players survive if access to low/high sec were severed?

I suspect that they could survive at least either through POS production (assuming that blueprints are around) and fleet mining and internal trading. But the massive profits enjoyed by null sec corps would be gone along with the large scale wars that these empires funded. In fact pretty much all conflict would die of in null sec as the resource cost of ships have massively increased, especially tech 2 items due to the research requirements since those blueprints you need for tech 2 versions are now irreplaceable.

Meanwhile in high sec there are swings and roundabounts. At first the market would crash a bit as the flow of null resources stop and prices of ships rise. But on the other hand the demand for ships to fight the null sec wars decline so after a while the market would return to some form of stability. The main place where this isn't true however would be in mercoxit which would completely cripple tech 2 high sec production.

So in other words on both areas of space the tech 2 industry is crippled.

Edit: And before anyone says all mercoxit comes from sleeper. Shh. We're talking economic systems here.

Also what kind of fleet would you need to completely blockade all entrances to null sec perfectly 24/7?
The Spod
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#2 - 2013-09-29 19:22:00 UTC
There are player and NPC stations in nullsec. Nullsec is independent of highsec, and highsec is independent of nullsec.
ElQuirko
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#3 - 2013-09-29 19:34:50 UTC
The Spod wrote:
There are player and NPC stations in nullsec. Nullsec is independent of highsec, and highsec is independent of nullsec.


Tell that to all those L4 alts.

Dodixie > Hek

Johnny Marzetti
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#4 - 2013-09-29 19:43:11 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:

Also what kind of fleet would you need to completely blockade all entrances to null sec perfectly 24/7?


You don't even know what a jump freighter is. Go home.
Paul Otichoda
Perkone
Caldari State
#5 - 2013-09-29 19:50:56 UTC  |  Edited by: Paul Otichoda
Johnny Marzetti wrote:
Paul Otichoda wrote:

Also what kind of fleet would you need to completely blockade all entrances to null sec perfectly 24/7?


You don't even know what a jump freighter is. Go home.


You can't jump into highsec only out of it

if you gatecamp both the gates on the null sec entrance system. We might not be able to see a covert jump field but if we put up warp jammers all around the gate to pull you out of warp and then blow you apart before you've got to the gate.

If its a big enough camp we should have the dps.
Mara Rinn
Cosmic Goo Convertor
#6 - 2013-09-29 19:51:32 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
theoretically could null sec players survive if access to low/high sec were severed?


Of course. Everything that is possible, industry-wise, in hisec is possible in null. You can research BPOs, perform invention, reactions, manufacturing, refining, etc to your heart's content. There's just the difficulty of the poor quality of POS refineries, the need to supply fuel to POSes for all POS-based activity, and logistics.

Paul Otichoda wrote:
I suspect that they could survive at least either through POS production (assuming that blueprints are around) … So in other words on both areas of space the tech 2 industry is crippled.


Why would null have no blueprints?
Paul Otichoda
Perkone
Caldari State
#7 - 2013-09-29 19:54:53 UTC
Mara Rinn wrote:

Paul Otichoda wrote:
I suspect that they could survive at least either through POS production (assuming that blueprints are around) … So in other words on both areas of space the tech 2 industry is crippled.


Why would null have no blueprints?


well if you keep blowing up the POS labs that contain the prints and as so can't access NPC vendors for replacements then the supply of orginals will be reduced. Sure you can make do with copies but you won't be able to do research with them.
Varius Xeral
Doomheim
#8 - 2013-09-29 19:55:19 UTC
Terrible thread.

Official Representative of The Nullsec Zealot Cabal

Sipphakta en Gravonere
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#9 - 2013-09-29 20:09:56 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:

well if you keep blowing up the POS labs that contain the prints and as so can't access NPC vendors for replacements then the supply of orginals will be reduced. Sure you can make do with copies but you won't be able to do research with them.


So you do research in station systems only, where the BPO is safe. The BPO doesn't need to be in the pos.
Karak Terrel
Foundation for CODE and THE NEW ORDER
#10 - 2013-09-29 20:30:40 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:

Edit: And before anyone says all mercoxit comes from sleeper. Shh. We're talking economic systems here.

Care to elaborate on that point?
Adunh Slavy
#11 - 2013-09-29 20:37:10 UTC
You know you have been playing Eve too long when you have seen this topic in GD at least 100 times.

Necessity is the plea for every infringement of human freedom. It is the argument of tyrants; it is the creed of slaves.  - William Pitt

Johnny Marzetti
Imperial Shipment
Amarr Empire
#12 - 2013-09-29 20:44:50 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
Johnny Marzetti wrote:
Paul Otichoda wrote:

Also what kind of fleet would you need to completely blockade all entrances to null sec perfectly 24/7?


You don't even know what a jump freighter is. Go home.


You can't jump into highsec only out of it

if you gatecamp both the gates on the null sec entrance system. We might not be able to see a covert jump field but if we put up warp jammers all around the gate to pull you out of warp and then blow you apart before you've got to the gate.

If its a big enough camp we should have the dps.


I'm probably falling for a troll here but have you ever even looked at a map?
Turelus
Utassi Security
The Curatores Veritatis Auxiliary
#13 - 2013-09-29 20:45:01 UTC
Paul Otichoda wrote:
Johnny Marzetti wrote:
Paul Otichoda wrote:

Also what kind of fleet would you need to completely blockade all entrances to null sec perfectly 24/7?


You don't even know what a jump freighter is. Go home.


You can't jump into highsec only out of it

if you gatecamp both the gates on the null sec entrance system. We might not be able to see a covert jump field but if we put up warp jammers all around the gate to pull you out of warp and then blow you apart before you've got to the gate.

If its a big enough camp we should have the dps.

I think this just goes to prove the other guys comment was correct.
Jump Freighters normally jump to a LowSec Station (with a nice undock) in a system next to HighSec then warp directly to the gate and are safely into HighSec.
With the exception of a 24/7 camp of those stations and maybe smartbombing camps on the gates to try and take out the JF before it makes the jump through you wont stop one getting into HighSec.

In relation to your question yes NullSec could survive but it would be a dark ages time while everyone has to actually build infrastructure, recruit industrialists and get used to the fact Jita shopping trips for supplies wont be happening any more.
There would most likely need to be some form of new free port or trade hub as otherwise you wouldn't see much T2 being produced as each region would need to trade the moon goo.

Turelus CEO Utassi Security

To Be Me
Doomheim
#14 - 2013-09-29 20:45:33 UTC
Lmfao your cray mang??

thumbs up if you like :))))

Qolde
Comms Black
Pandemic Horde
#15 - 2013-09-29 22:21:51 UTC
Let's say that the stargates were simply removed, and the actual star systems became unreachable by jump drives, and whatever's there is there, on both sides, so there's no need to gatecamp and blockade JF's. One part of this equation is missing though, does lowsec belong on hisec side or nullsec side? Is it its own category?

The NPC null systems would be the freeports, and there would be a tremendous depression in hisec, since so much of the business comes from null. Hi end minerals would obviously skyrocket in the empire, or if lowsec was severed as well, they'd be nonexistent. I've never seen mercoxit or arkonor in hisec and you can't moon mine. T2 ships in high would be as valuable as alliance tourney prizes. Faction ships would be the new normal.

There'd be a very strong industrial bubble in null, as there'd be a severe lack of ships and modules, and the ones that are already there are pretty expensive as it is. It would be possible to build anything as long as the blueprints are actually out there. Not copies. No NPC's sell any ship blueprints in null except outer ring's industrial ships. Everyone would have to use faction here as well.

Lowsec would be the only one that could really truly survive without the others. There's all blueprints(except outer ring and syndicate stores) moons, ore, missions, and exploration. You'd be able to build anything, or have it drop from faction rats.

If someone craps in your sandbox: 1. Light it on fire 2. Grab your shovel 3. Throw it back at them.

Vincent Athena
Photosynth
#16 - 2013-09-29 22:30:54 UTC
If null sec were totally cut off from high the thing null would eventually run out of is players.

New players start in the rookie systems, in high sec. With a total cut off they could not get to null. Eventually as null sec players lost interest and moved to other activities null would run out.

High sec would have a different issue: High end minerals. There is only a tiny supply of megacyte, and no supply of Morphite. (Unless high would still have access to W space).

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Falin Whalen
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#17 - 2013-09-29 22:44:39 UTC
Vincent Athena wrote:
If null sec were totally cut off from high the thing null would eventually run out of is players.

New players start in the rookie systems, in high sec. With a total cut off they could not get to null. Eventually as null sec players lost interest and moved to other activities null would run out.

High sec would have a different issue: High end minerals. There is only a tiny supply of megacyte, and no supply of Morphite. (Unless high would still have access to W space).

I guess you haven't heard of Pod jumping.

"it's only because of their stupidity that they're able to be so sure of themselves." The Trial - Franz Kafka 

Mara Pahrdi
The Order of Anoyia
#18 - 2013-09-29 23:28:49 UTC
Varius Xeral wrote:
Terrible thread.

I agree. He's stopped crying, which is a progress. But his threads are still... interesting.

Remove standings and insurance.

Tauranon
Weeesearch
CAStabouts
#19 - 2013-09-29 23:34:03 UTC  |  Edited by: Tauranon
Paul Otichoda wrote:


Also what kind of fleet would you need to completely blockade all entrances to null sec perfectly 24/7?


You'd need about 85% of the active playerbase dedicated to it.

Jump clones and the cyno field make that impossible anyway.
Karak Terrel
Foundation for CODE and THE NEW ORDER
#20 - 2013-09-29 23:37:45 UTC
Mara Pahrdi wrote:
Varius Xeral wrote:
Terrible thread.

I agree. He's stopped crying, which is a progress. But his threads are still... interesting.

Oh right, was that the t2 guns guy? That would explain a lot.
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