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The covert haulers must be bad at the game where you live then, or gate camps fully manned with fast decloakers and high scan res tackle if you actually salivate at their arrival. There's nearly 0 risk in jumping anything with a covert ops cloak into a gate camp in low sec.

Such ships passing through merely to stop at a PI office and back out again add to the jumps per hour statistic, but little else.

I'll grant you the economy is interconnected and it all comes back around, but covert ships passing through lowsec briefly add nothing directly to lowsec, and anything that affects them positively or negatively can't be seen as either a positive or negative impact on lowsec. They don't live there, and the 2 UI clicks they perform while vulnerable in lowsec can be performed while already aligning out to the next stargate.

So the less you have jumping into low sec the better, is that your position? The don't "contribute" in your opinion, so better they stay out?

Just trying to see where you're coming from.

The beauty of Eve is that it is not only a PvP game. It is also PvE. For some it is a simple distraction for socializing purposes. CCP has the difficult task of catering to all aspects of the game. One is not inherently 'more right' or 'better' than another, even if the original intention of Eve was PvP or PvE.

Despite practicing Safe Warping techniques for whenever I am in low/null/wh space, I still make mistakes. I off-lined my cloak in a T3 gate camp once by mistake as the module didn't show it was activated fast enough. Mistakes happen, people get complacent, people get lucky/unlucky. Things happen.

And I still fail to see how living in low sec adds to the low sec economy. I live in unknown space, yet I don't add to the economy there (despite Concord somehow billing me for use of customs office in space they have no presence in whatsoever ) I have never heard of this enclosed economy. Perhaps with some guidance more people would go there to do trading etc. Are there trade hubs there that people commonly use, with some relatively safe chance of doing so?

If it is just a bubble, there is no real economy, it is just a little secluded 'village' trading back and forth amongst themselves. Unless there are lots and lots of people in low sec.

The point is, whether someone warps in and out or warps in and does lots of stuff, then warps out or gets blown up, or just lives there, being in low sec adds to it. I bet there are some people in low sec that are always cloaked and doing very little other than stressing other players out. That doesn't add to the economy either.

I guess we'll just have to wait a few weeks to see how this all starts to play out. No change = stagnation. Change = adaptation and hopefully survival and perhaps prosperity.

They can come and go as they please. I don't care one way or the other.

But don't tell me that they contributed to where I live by passing through. My argument is that by giving lowsec dwellers the ability to put up their own POCO it was a buff to lowsec dwellers, not a nerf to lowsec as so many are claiming. It may be a nerf to their free ride on lowsec assets, but lowsec itself benefits.

How long do you think it will take you to make a dent in the 10's of thousands of Custom's offices that will be out there?

You, my friend, have WAY too much time on your hands.

I know people are complaining that his will force you to have to cooperate with other people to do PI but that is not true. You just have to cooperate with other people and take risks with PI if you want to make money with it now. This is how EVERYTHING in EVE should be. I know there are those who say "let me play how I want and you play how you want" But EVE is not this type of game. There are plenty of other games where you can reach max level in a week solo if you want. Sorry but EVE is about your interaction with the player base and that is why it succeeds! :D

+1 for Monty Python reference.

I'm not looking to make a dent. It is a killmail. I like killmails. It is likely a way to force people out to defend their stuff. That means more killmails. Did I mention that I like killmails?

+1 for thinking that maybe there's something to all the complaints rather than chalking it up to the "carebears rule!" mentality.

I will disagree and say that there are plenty of examples now where the player base has stood up, called bullshit on a feature, and it has been reexamined. We don't have to simply chill and adapt. That's the attitude that allowed such imbalances as HICs when they were first introduced. Cargo running was removed as a viable profession in the official framework of the game. It forced unreasonable work arounds that bastardized the core purpose of some ships (see: dread and carrier jump freighters).

If CCP is willing to listen and at least explain how they are addressing at least a large portion of the issues that were called out in the original thread, we would be having a very different conversation in this thread. I have a feeling this particular thread would be filled with, "Spot on team PI", and, "Great job, guys!" Instead, we still see the same complaints being registered over and over again.

Ah, so now it is the grammar that is wrong. That same thing that nearly made it impossible for me to understand CCP Omen. You really have the strongest arguments, WK.


PS. That is irony, in case you have again have difficulties with understanding.