Intergalactic Summit

Not at all, please do interject! I did not come only to preach the Word, but to listen to the cluster. You can't say that you want to spread the Word to every corner of the universe without understanding where it is going.

I think where we are perhaps not arriving at the same conclusion is based on how much time we allow. In the short term, such things are quite true. Internal cohesion can be a fairly tough nut, as we in Amarrian space well know. However, internal cohesion also means that, as I stated, a spark that turns into fire burns bright and quick. We are talking about Gallente and Matari people literally needing to be converted person by person, bottom to top, until inertia itself brings the Word to the rest of the cluster. That is going to take a long time. The Caldari situation means that is not necessarily so. It may take longer, but I doubt it. Simply put, we would need to convert far more than a majority of the other two Empires for such a widespread conversion to take place. In Caldari space, we probably need less than a majority. It simply needs to be acceptable.

Still, I do also think that most people feel our entire culture will subsume those who join us. That has never been the case, as I am hoping Nicoletta can attest to. Really, the Amarr Empire is united and held together by religion and loyalty, with our only inviolate laws being the Scriptures. As such, I certainly would not claim that the Amarrian Empire you see today was even the same as it was five hundred years ago, much less at the dawn of our Empire. We've absorbed quite a bit from other cultures over the millenia. Much as some of us hate to admit, throughout history the nature of the word "Amarr" has only ever retained one meaning: those people who follow the religion of the Amarrian Empire and swear fealty to it.

So one thing I should disavow is that I'm not talking about a complete subsumation, nor would I think that the healthiest recourse available to us. I feel the Amarrian church will spread and absorb the rest of the cluster to form a new Empire. I think it would be fun, but not necessarily fruitful, to guess as to what the outcome of that merger shall be.

What I can almost certainly say is that the Scriptures will form a basis for it. Their eternal wisdom is, I think, worthy of praise simply on its own merits even if you believe in nothing else. It preaches moderation, discipline, unity, mercy, charity, steadfastness, and more. It sets up a system by which the strong reach down and help the weak become stronger, for the good of the Empire.

I know simply that it will be a large part of it, but the rest? Who knows for certain who will be Emperor in a thousand years or more. What our legal system might be like in and around the Scriptures? Who knows what the future will bring?

All I know is that we are being driven together simply by social gravity. Safeguards in place to divide us will slowly weather into nothing if they are not forcibly broken down first. While perhaps more conservative and feudal interest in the Empire dislike the idea, the simple matter is that the Scriptures provide for cultural unifications. It has happened before, it will happen again on a larger scale.

I think the best parts of our Empire will facilitate this process and truly bring our peoples together. I hope the best parts of other peoples remain with us as well. God separated all of us and gave us all purpose. We all have something to give back to God when his Empire spans the cluster.

The real question begins not 'if,' but 'when.' When God's will brings us together into a great multitude to create a shining harmony across the stars, what will your people bring with you? What will you leave behind?

I know my answers to both of those questions.

So, let's talk end game here for a minute.

Suppose that Baracca's fantasy becomes a reality. Somehow the Amarr end up conquering the rest of humanity. Somehow all holders and task masters suddenly become compassionate and humane. What happens next? From what I understand best case scenario is after some period of time (to be determined at some unknown point in the future by some undetermined person/persons solely at their discretion but not to exceed nine generations--at least that's the ruling from the present monarch) we would then be eligible to become the lowest level commoners working at menial low wage jobs for the benefit of the ruling oligarchy as is the case with the overwhelming majority of Amarr society today. At that point how would we be better off than the working poor in Luminaire, Saisio or Hek now? Would we share in the profits derived from our labor? With the rigid caste system in the Empire how feasible would it be for someone to advance (short of an advantageous marriage or extraordinary good luck)? Where is the security that Baracca talks about for the non slave should one fall upon hard times?

And what of our original cultures and identities? I know how the Ni Kunni and others the Amarr have conquered are viewed by the so-called True Amarr; as second class inferiors. Even the Udorians, who are now a royal house, are looked down upon by some. I can only imagine how someone of Brutor, Jin Mei or Achuran heritage would be looked upon.

So, tell me Baracca, how would your people handle being the undisputed masters of the universe?

Any serious study of historical Amarr integration policies will show that different races have had remarkably different trajectories in Amarr society.

Baracca has explicitly stated that he wishes the conversion of the Caldari to mirror that of the Khanid. My family was never enslaved. While we were only granted peerage after the secession, the Hanayas were a wealthy family that proudly served as military officers for many generations.

He hasn't mentioned what fate he'd like for you though. Perhaps he does imagine the Bete line collared for eight generations followed by fifteen of toilet bowl scrubbing.


I had to look that up.

It's an interesting term.

One thing I think we can all agree on is that, if after eight generations you haven't converted a line into citizens, it is almost certainly not their fault. It is your fault. The purpose of slavery isn't necessarily to make people citizens as quickly as possible, but it certainly isn't to keep people in bondage for that long. There is a reason the Empress wisely announced her emancipation with the terms she did. If you have slaves working after nine generations, or after learning high tech jobs, or even taking part in ecclesiastical duties, and they don't stay when you offer to send them elsewhere, you have not done your duty as a Holder.

In all honesty, it would be beneficial to educate people on the Scriptures and then induct them as citizens rather than slaves. That need is not as immediate as the problem of the impoverished, but it is quite a bit easier to handle. I speak quite a bit about slavery because it is understandably what most foreigners have questions about. However, there are already conversion programs in place that induct people as citizens. Those have existed for centuries. If we can induct entire Empires that way, it would be ideal. It simply isn't feasible in practice.

I have hope though. One thing I have learned in my travels is that every empire has people that are trying to be good citizens. Certainly, not everyone needs to be re-educated that way. Scriptural education and confession seems to do well enough for the majority of Amarrian citizens. It just isn't often that the well-heeled in life suddenly get the urge to learn about charity, discipline, and confession. They've often by that point spent their entire lives above reproach, spending their money to buy things they've no intention to share, feeling nothing for the plight of their fellow man.

A plague across all empires, and one the Scriptures vehemently damns more than any other sin. Men shall not stand before God and declare themselves righteous. They must learn to pray on hands and knees, knowing that God only grants us responsibilities with every boon. Those of us who are born to or rise to great fortune are expected to use it for the goodness of God.

One of God's most universal truths, and yet the hardest one for us to keep.

Exactly on target brave intrepid pilot, I am not going to help create his fantasy slime pit to wallow with with the likes of you, the impure, tainted, and mongrelized commoners.

Do I really have to explain the difference between a translation and a definition to you? I think it is quite obvious why you focus on such petty things as spelling errors: Lack of real arguments.

Also, again, I agree with Cpt. Ixiris. Cordially so.

That is simply the worst all time response to being proved an idiot in the history of human communication.

If you don't know the definitions of words you run the risk of saying ignorant things like you do quite frequently. Your attempts to sound scholarly in a language that is clearly not your native tongue have fallen woefully short, instead of increasing your vocabulary you choose to cling to your "translation" of a word, laughable and quite sad. Ignorance is easily remedied by learning the facts, so it's nothing you should remain ashamed of, but unreasonable willful incompetence, is just plain distasteful. So lick the boots of your fallen champion, the brave intrepid pilot who also could not stand up to the intensity of my gaze.

The Amarr thug just beat the living crap out of you, in this battle of wits you were unarmed. Your pantomime of a gentile troll got hammered. You got served, now walk away with something that looks like dignity. So that people do not get the idea all Gallente are as gullible as you, i am going to request you follow your own suggestion and stop posting.

No, not really, since I have zero desire to be anywhere near close enough to you to smell you. Which, judging by your posting habits should be... oh, several kilometers, minimum?

As for the smells that actually make me feel at home? Spices, including black pepper and cinnamon, and fruit - both citrus and not.

Very desperate to appear important, aren't you - enough that you got a sock-puppet of your own?

When Kuvakei first reappeared I made this same argument and was chastised for it. It's good to know that I was correct after all. Anyone who's paying even the slightest bit of attention will see the similarities between Kuvakei's vision for universal unification and that of the Amarr.

I'll just echo what the Caldari pilots have stated. No matter the length of the time horizon you're working on Pilot Baracca I believe that you'll find that people do not in fact want to give up their cultural uniqueness, especially in favor of adopting the culture of a totally alien civilization. What you propose has never been done in the entire history of mankind. That you managed to conquer and subsume your neighbors on Amarr Prime and surrounding systems notwithstanding, your spectacular failures to subjugate the Jove and Minmatar should have taught you just how far a people will go in order to resist your supposed inevitable merger.

The basic human desire to maintain cultural uniqueness could not be taken away by tachyon beams and whips and it certainly won't be with flowery prose, no matter how much you desire it