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So what If warp scram and warp disruption was chance based?

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Oswald Bolke
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#1 - 2013-09-19 15:25:51 UTC
All other Ewar is, your damps don't always land.

What I mean is what if we make scram chance be a skill based thing, and also depend on modules installed and meta of the modules.

For example:

-Different metas have higher chance
-low slot modules to increase chance

So:

This makes a gank boat the opposite of a warp stabbed care bear ship. where the person who wants to not be ganked has to sacrifice targeting AND low slot tank, a ganker would have to at least sacrifice some tank

I mean heck, so frigs can still work give all frigates a bonus to warp scram and disrupt chance so they can still fit a good tank

Just an idea to cut down on the ganking, make it a little more skill based to go tackle somebody rather then just fly close lock and click
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#2 - 2013-09-19 15:26:33 UTC
The tears themselves would be so LOUD the game server would have to be shut down for repair.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Icarus Able
Refuse.Resist
#3 - 2013-09-19 15:27:21 UTC
Fairly sure damps always land.

No your idea is awful.
ElQuirko
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-09-19 15:27:50 UTC
What if? Well, it'd be a f*** awful idea.

Dodixie > Hek
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#5 - 2013-09-19 15:28:29 UTC
Oswald Bolke wrote:
Just an idea to cut down on the ganking

Wow, you don't have to just say so ~outright~

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Roime
Mea Culpa.
Shadow Cartel
#6 - 2013-09-19 15:30:31 UTC
Oswald Bolke wrote:
All other Ewar is, your damps don't always land.

What I mean is what if we make scram chance be a skill based thing, and also depend on modules installed and meta of the modules.

For example:

-Different metas have higher chance
-low slot modules to increase chance

So:

This makes a gank boat the opposite of a warp stabbed care bear ship. where the person who wants to not be ganked has to sacrifice targeting AND low slot tank, a ganker would have to at least sacrifice some tank

I mean heck, so frigs can still work give all frigates a bonus to warp scram and disrupt chance so they can still fit a good tank

Just an idea to cut down on the ganking, make it a little more skill based to go tackle somebody rather then just fly close lock and click


TIL that points are only used for ganking, and that making every fight in EVE depend on RNG would be a good idea.

Even Harry has better ideas.

Yes, that is an insult.

.
Bienator II
madmen of the skies
#7 - 2013-09-19 15:35:48 UTC
points are such an important part of pvp that i would probably stop playing as soon they work like ECM. There is no room for random in a competitive environment.

how to fix eve: 1) remove ECM 2) rename dampeners to ECM 3) add new anti-drone ewar for caldari 4) give offgrid boosters ongrid combat value
Oswald Bolke
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#8 - 2013-09-19 15:35:53 UTC
wow I poked a beehive on this one...nice discussion of flame here

so much for rational discourse

adhominim away!
Oswald Bolke
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#9 - 2013-09-19 15:36:39 UTC
Bienator II wrote:
points are such an important part of pvp that i would probably stop playing as soon they work like ECM. There is no room for random in a competitive environment.


I'm talking skill based not random here.
Lykouleon
Noble Sentiments
Second Empire.
#10 - 2013-09-19 15:43:18 UTC
Oswald Bolke wrote:
wow I poked a beehive on this one...nice discussion of flame here

so much for rational discourse

adhominim away!

You posted something exceptionally stupid and expected people to not come out of the woodworks to call you out on it?

Lykouleon > CYNO ME CLOSER so I can hit them with my sword
Whim Aqayn
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#11 - 2013-09-19 15:43:58 UTC
No.
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#12 - 2013-09-19 15:44:09 UTC
Then they would have to be 100% effective, not offer degradation like they do now.

The reason ECM is chance-based is because it only has two states: either you can lock or you can't. So to create different degrees of effect, they employ chance and statistics — you are only locked out x% of the time, rather than having your locking ability be reduced by x%.

Compare this to other ewar: TPs makes you a certain percentage easier to hit, not a guaranteed hit for a certain percentage of the time; TDs reduces your guns' hit chance and range by a certain percentage, rather than simply make a percentage of your shots misses, no matter what the circumstances are.

Or, to use a more closely related module, if you wanted webs to be chance based, they would have to instantly reduce your speed to 0 for a percentage of the time, rather than reduce the speed by some percentage all the time. So by the same token, scrams and disruptors would have to apply infinite scram strength a percentage of the time, rather than just reduce your warp stability by a point or three all the time.

Of course, since degraded performance is a far better mechanism than a binary one with only statistic gradation, the module you are trying to use as a template is actually the one that should be changed so it works like all other types…


In short, hell no.
handbanana
State War Academy
Caldari State
#13 - 2013-09-19 15:45:12 UTC
1/10

feeling generous today.

“It takes a big man to cry, but it takes a bigger man to laugh at that man.”    -Jack Handy
Oswald Bolke
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#14 - 2013-09-19 15:46:04 UTC
Lykouleon wrote:
Oswald Bolke wrote:
wow I poked a beehive on this one...nice discussion of flame here

so much for rational discourse

adhominim away!

You posted something exceptionally stupid and expected people to not come out of the woodworks to call you out on it?


I don't think it's stupid really. to me i makes sense. everything else has a skill attached to it for hit chance, so why not this?

besides just because its a bad idea does not mean a rational person can't put out a counterpoint rather than just a stream of anger.
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
#15 - 2013-09-19 15:48:59 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Then they would have to be 100% effective, not offer degradation like they do now.

The reason ECM is chance-based is because it only has two states: either you can lock or you can't. So to create different degrees of effect, they employ chance and statistics — you are only locked out x% of the time, rather than having your locking ability be reduced by x%.

Compare this to other ewar: TPs makes you a certain percentage easier to hit, not a guaranteed hit for a certain percentage of the time; TDs reduces your guns' hit chance and range by a certain percentage, rather than simply make a percentage of your shots misses, no matter what the circumstances are.

Or, to use a more closely related module, if you wanted webs to be chance based, they would have to instantly reduce your speed to 0 for a percentage of the time, rather than reduce the speed by some percentage all the time. So by the same token, scrams and disruptors would have to apply infinite scram strength a percentage of the time, rather than just reduce your warp stability by a point or three all the time.

Of course, since degraded performance is a far better mechanism than a binary one with only statistic gradation, the module you are trying to use as a template is actually the one that should be changed so it works like all other types…


In short, hell no.

He just wants a nerf, a chance-based degradation

Triggered by: Wars of Sovless Agression, Bending the Knee, Twisting the Knife, Eating Sov Wheaties, Bombless Bombers, Fizzlesov, Interceptor Fleets, Running Away, GhostTime Vuln, Renters, Bombs, Bubbles ?
Oswald Bolke
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#16 - 2013-09-19 15:50:10 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Then they would have to be 100% effective, not offer degradation like they do now.

The reason ECM is chance-based is because it only has two states: either you can lock or you can't. So to create different degrees of effect, they employ chance and statistics — you are only locked out x% of the time, rather than having your locking ability be reduced by x%.

Compare this to other ewar: TPs makes you a certain percentage easier to hit, not a guaranteed hit for a certain percentage of the time; TDs reduces your guns' hit chance and range by a certain percentage, rather than simply make a percentage of your shots misses, no matter what the circumstances are.

Or, to use a more closely related module, if you wanted webs to be chance based, they would have to instantly reduce your speed to 0 for a percentage of the time, rather than reduce the speed by some percentage all the time. So by the same token, scrams and disruptors would have to apply infinite scram strength a percentage of the time, rather than just reduce your warp stability by a point or three all the time.

Of course, since degraded performance is a far better mechanism than a binary one with only statistic gradation, the module you are trying to use as a template is actually the one that should be changed so it works like all other types…


In short, hell no.


how about something like:
80% chance to point. If pointed then good done....If not...reroll until pointed
have skills and modules increase this. lower cycle time for rerolls to balance accordingly
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
#17 - 2013-09-19 15:51:46 UTC
Oswald Bolke wrote:
I don't think it's stupid really. to me i makes sense. everything else has a skill attached to it for hit chance, so why not this?
Because nothing else has a skill attached to it for hit chance with the exception of ECM, so really, it's ECM that should be brought into the fold rather than have its horrible mechanics spread to other modules.

Quote:
how about something like:
80% chance to point. If pointed then good done....If not...reroll until pointed
have skills and modules increase this. lower cycle time for rerolls to balance accordingly
How about something like this:
100% chance to point.
Have skills and modules that let you apply this chance farther out, like with all other ewar (except that one type that is horribly designed).
Schmata Bastanold
In Boobiez We Trust
#18 - 2013-09-19 15:53:24 UTC
But why?

Invalid signature format
Krixtal Icefluxor
INLAND EMPIRE Galactic
#19 - 2013-09-19 15:54:57 UTC
Oswald Bolke wrote:
wow I poked a beehive on this one...nice discussion of flame here

so much for rational discourse

adhominim away!



Post somewhere besides GD then. I'm wearing a hazmat suit atm.

"He has mounted his hind-legs, and blown crass vapidities through the bowel of his neck."  - Ambrose Bierce on Oscar Wilde's Lecture in San Francisco 1882
Oswald Bolke
Pator Tech School
Minmatar Republic
#20 - 2013-09-19 15:56:33 UTC
Tippia wrote:
Oswald Bolke wrote:
I don't think it's stupid really. to me i makes sense. everything else has a skill attached to it for hit chance, so why not this?
Because nothing else has a skill attached to it for hit chance with the exception of ECM, so really, it's ECM that should be brought into the fold rather than have its horrible mechanics spread to other modules.

Quote:
how about something like:
80% chance to point. If pointed then good done....If not...reroll until pointed
have skills and modules increase this. lower cycle time for rerolls to balance accordingly
How about something like this:
100% chance to point.
Have skills and modules that let you apply this chance farther out, like with all other ewar (except that one type that is horribly designed).


thats not bad, lower the range a bit and allow modules.

It's a thought yeah
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