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CCP! Please clarify the future plans for WiS!

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Jerek Mothas
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#1001 - 2011-11-15 03:06:01 UTC
Taiwanistan wrote:
why i am opposed to wis is that people seem to want immersion for immersion's sake alone and that is just not compelling enough

if the "New Stuff" comes out tomorrow i would do a complete 180 and start wis-ing, but i just can't fathom what that "New Stuff" would be


And this is the whole conundrum of WiS. If they introduce exclusive "stuff to do" within the stations, it feels as though they're trying to branch out too much, or just creating a "mini-game". If they just expand on what it is now, people will complain that they're not working on the things that matter. I hold, however, that WiS DOES matter; not in the sense of expanding on existing gameplay, but in the sense of really taking this game to the next level. The longer they take to introduce more WiS content, the more they're missing the opportunity to renovate the game and explore new horizons, which is what this game really needs long-term. Confining themselves to FiS too long will only hurt them, since while there is a lot of polish and balancing they could introduce, there's only so much new content they can really bring at this point (barring more star systems, which should probably be done a little differently next time around to avoid it just being "more of the same").

However, if they begin to explore WiS, they're not only creating content that will interest potential players and current players alike, they're also allowing EVE to evolve to the next level, which is the best thing they could do.

So, while it may not bring in "New Stuff" as you define it, WiS will ultimately be essential if CCP wants to avoid EVE growing too stale.

Failfitting ships since 2007.

"Those who control their tongue will have a long life; opening your mouth can ruin everything." - Solomon
yumike
Doomheim
#1002 - 2011-11-15 04:06:18 UTC  |  Edited by: yumike
@issler and a few others
The reason FiS people are so pissed is because we haven't had any noticeable changes (aside from some sov changes that we've been waiting since like '06 for) SINCE '08's fall expansion.

Nobody outright hates WiS, If they want to do that fine.
But when devblogs talk about how 70%+ of their development staff is actively working on it and half the remaining staff are "tq maintenance staff" yes people are likely to get a tad pissed. We were stagnant for years.

@ Development time
It hasn't been 3 months, they announced their changes in august - its been 5 months.

And I feel the need to remind you that these changes have been ignored for years, some were even previously implemented.

POS fuel? Wow. So we added 4 new blueprints, 4 new items, and changed fuel type on a tower. That took an artist a couple days to do the art for, a database manager an hour and some minor code changes that maybe took a team of five two days to do?

Engine trails? Code already existed, Probably tweaked and thrown back in with updated art. A couple artists two weeks?
New cyno effect? See above. Nothing game changing.

The warping through celestials objects on the other hand is new.. and would of *gasp* required new code to be written, again most the changes here are superficial and could of almost completely been handled via graphics, likely just a check written in to see if a celestial was between you and your target warp destination & at what point it was, so it knows when to trigger said effect.

The majority of the development time is likely artists working on the new ships. The guy's doing the real programming long ago developed a quick way to drop new items in and make sure everythings in place, including ships. (If they haven't then they are crazy, to be frank it was one of the first things I did when working on a certain other MMO I developed.)

None of these are massive changes, And to be honest I imagine polishing will be where the most development time is going at the moment. And features like UI scaling (for absolutely everything, which is a much more grand task then adding a new fuel type for e.g.)


@ the idea that incarna will bring new players.. Your right, I think it will too. Your numbers however are a bit ridiculous, Sub numbers double because we can walk around in a station? Granted a few probably (Hundreds and i'm being generous here) will likely do just that.. But eve is NICHE and the maingame *IS* FiS. You are being ludicrous (and probably realize this, but are just being stubborn) Even if gameplay was added to it (Like those minigames we saw at fanfest year after year.) Again it would attract how many people?

If you've ever played other MMO's with minigames in them (RF, WoW, etc) You'd know there was a few people that maybe did them *alot* but at most it was half a dozen people a realm, out of the hundreds of thousands that play them. I find it highly unlikely EVE will be at all different and would honestly like you to cite me an example of where it DOUBLED a playerbase because of a minigame that didn't really matter, I will happily correct myself and tell you how right you are and how wrong I am I love learning new things so please - do!

edit:: because after skimming over my post, it may sound like I am hating on WiS and this is false.
I like EVE, however - This means I don't want it to be stagnant, i want it to see changes, balancing, additions. "Look a salvaging ship!" isnt an addition. nor is it an expansion.
If CCP feels it seriously can't handle doing both WiS and FiS, Then that's fine of course it shouldn't bite the hand that has fed it (And, let's not beat around the bush - that is very much the current playerbase not the potential playerbase).
This should be common sense, Especially for a business!
The fact that they got away with it for as long as they did, doesn't make anyone QQ'ers. It doesn't mean your bad FiS players, it doesn't mean you are whiney WiS players - It means they made poor decisions and are correcting them. You may disagree with that - and there is nothing wrong with that so long as you have reasoning behind it that isn't fallacious.

You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant. -Harlan Ellison
Issler Dainze
Tadakastu-Obata Corporation
The Honda Accord
#1003 - 2011-11-15 07:36:59 UTC
yumike wrote:
@issler and a few others
The reason FiS people are so pissed is because we haven't had any noticeable changes (aside from some sov changes that we've been waiting since like '06 for) SINCE '08's fall expansion.

Nobody outright hates WiS, If they want to do that fine.
But when devblogs talk about how 70%+ of their development staff is actively working on it and half the remaining staff are "tq maintenance staff" yes people are likely to get a tad pissed. We were stagnant for years.

@ Development time
It hasn't been 3 months, they announced their changes in august - its been 5 months.

And I feel the need to remind you that these changes have been ignored for years, some were even previously implemented.

POS fuel? Wow. So we added 4 new blueprints, 4 new items, and changed fuel type on a tower. That took an artist a couple days to do the art for, a database manager an hour and some minor code changes that maybe took a team of five two days to do?

Engine trails? Code already existed, Probably tweaked and thrown back in with updated art. A couple artists two weeks?
New cyno effect? See above. Nothing game changing.

The warping through celestials objects on the other hand is new.. and would of *gasp* required new code to be written, again most the changes here are superficial and could of almost completely been handled via graphics, likely just a check written in to see if a celestial was between you and your target warp destination & at what point it was, so it knows when to trigger said effect.

The majority of the development time is likely artists working on the new ships. The guy's doing the real programming long ago developed a quick way to drop new items in and make sure everythings in place, including ships. (If they haven't then they are crazy, to be frank it was one of the first things I did when working on a certain other MMO I developed.)

None of these are massive changes, And to be honest I imagine polishing will be where the most development time is going at the moment. And features like UI scaling (for absolutely everything, which is a much more grand task then adding a new fuel type for e.g.)


@ the idea that incarna will bring new players.. Your right, I think it will too. Your numbers however are a bit ridiculous, Sub numbers double because we can walk around in a station? Granted a few probably (Hundreds and i'm being generous here) will likely do just that.. But eve is NICHE and the maingame *IS* FiS. You are being ludicrous (and probably realize this, but are just being stubborn) Even if gameplay was added to it (Like those minigames we saw at fanfest year after year.) Again it would attract how many people?

If you've ever played other MMO's with minigames in them (RF, WoW, etc) You'd know there was a few people that maybe did them *alot* but at most it was half a dozen people a realm, out of the hundreds of thousands that play them. I find it highly unlikely EVE will be at all different and would honestly like you to cite me an example of where it DOUBLED a playerbase because of a minigame that didn't really matter, I will happily correct myself and tell you how right you are and how wrong I am I love learning new things so please - do!

edit:: because after skimming over my post, it may sound like I am hating on WiS and this is false.
I like EVE, however - This means I don't want it to be stagnant, i want it to see changes, balancing, additions. "Look a salvaging ship!" isnt an addition. nor is it an expansion.
If CCP feels it seriously can't handle doing both WiS and FiS, Then that's fine of course it shouldn't bite the hand that has fed it (And, let's not beat around the bush - that is very much the current playerbase not the potential playerbase).
This should be common sense, Especially for a business!
The fact that they got away with it for as long as they did, doesn't make anyone QQ'ers. It doesn't mean your bad FiS players, it doesn't mean you are whiney WiS players - It means they made poor decisions and are correcting them. You may disagree with that - and there is nothing wrong with that so long as you have reasoning behind it that isn't fallacious.

You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your informed opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant. -Harlan Ellison


Refocus announcement was 2011.10.19 13:24. Search the forums for the announcement.

All the work was on the vampire game, NeX store and dust, not WiS. Do you think CCP is so incapable that one CQ is all that can be delivered in 3 years of effort?

So I agree POS fuel was pretty easy. We should all be hella pissed that we didn't get that sooner, Should have been in a patch. No parties and balloons for CCP for that.

Engine trails, seriously, who cares. Cyno effect, about time, it was better before they broke it.

I think if I really unwind what I'm trying to say, CCP has spun us once again, This was all incremental work that could have happened long ago. Celebration of this expansion is celebrating the greatest spin job in CCP history.

For a while a big part of my job was to evaluate of MMOs. I have also been trying to drag other gaming friends into Eve since I started. Almost all of them tried Eve and left soon after. The inability of them to leave their ship and be in the station was cited as the reason for not liking Eve more often than any other factor. They couldn't understand how something so simple was left out. So I am confident in my subscription predictions.

We saw all the unsubs WiS was was going to cause already. Most of those called WiS unsubs were actually other reasons. So we kill the future for the bitter vets is not a solution for long term health. All I wanted when I started this thread was CCP to say WiS is still in plan in a reasonable amount of time.

Issler
yumike
Doomheim
#1004 - 2011-11-15 08:27:27 UTC
Issler Dainze wrote:
Refocus announcement was 2011.10.19 13:24. Search the forums for the announcement.

Refocus announcement was beginning of the turn around? Highly unlikely - More to the point the refocus has to deal with CCP as a company (and even more so about the abortion of whitewolf titles) This is unlikely to have an effect on content in the expansion. Correlation isn't causation.

Issler Dainze wrote:
All the work was on the vampire game, NeX store and dust, not WiS. Do you think CCP is so incapable that one CQ is all that can be delivered in 3 years of effort?

In short? Sadly, Yes.
http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=777
Your welcome, Took me ten damn minutes to find that devblog.

Issler Dainze wrote:
So I agree POS fuel was pretty easy. We should all be hella pissed that we didn't get that sooner, Should have been in a patch. No parties and balloons for CCP for that.

Thank you for taking note of that.

Issler Dainze wrote:
Engine trails, seriously, who cares. Cyno effect, about time, it was better before they broke it.

Well, it's kind of cool, and some people do get excited about these sorts of changes (Frankly, It seem's rather inane to me. But it might just show how desperate people are for some real FiS changes.)
I cite this as an example of desperation:
http://www.reddit.com/r/Eve/comments/mcm8n/thats_new/
Such a minor thing, Yet people are so used to nothing ever happening to the rest of the game for so long that people are excited for it and I can't blame them for it.

Issler Dainze wrote:
I think if I really unwind what I'm trying to say, CCP has spun us once again, This was all incremental work that could have happened long ago. Celebration of this expansion is celebrating the greatest spin job in CCP history.

I can't disagree, CCP pushed too hard on one front, and pissed it's flank off in doing so and is now back pedalling - It is the smart thing to do though. Player retention has always been an issue (QEN reports average life expectancy of a sub is 7 months, Anything more is a 'vet' and should frankly have a bit more attention, They are the ones that keep EVE online year after year.)
yumike
Doomheim
#1005 - 2011-11-15 08:27:46 UTC  |  Edited by: yumike
Issler Dainze wrote:
For a while a big part of my job was to evaluate of MMOs. I have also been trying to drag other gaming friends into Eve since I started. Almost all of them tried Eve and left soon after. The inability of them to leave their ship and be in the station was cited as the reason for not liking Eve more often than any other factor. They couldn't understand how something so simple was left out. So I am confident in my subscription predictions.


Well, Then I can't help but laugh a little bit. That's a ridiculous methodology - as if sitting in a station and having a different interface to purchase the same good through the current market layout would seriously encourage retention for more then a handful of people is simply unprecedented in modern MMO's and the gaming market in general, but it's an undefendable position that is you making a positive claim without trying to assert why. "because I have a feeling"

Issler Dainze wrote:
We saw all the unsubs WiS was was going to cause already. Most of those called WiS unsubs were actually other reasons. So we kill the future for the bitter vets is not a solution for long term health. All I wanted when I started this thread was CCP to say WiS is still in plan in a reasonable amount of time.

Nowhere close, We're talking about a vocal minority on the forums, even being generous and saying its 3% of the eve online population if 70% of the forumgoers got pissed and unsubbed - extrapolate that onto the playerbase. If that number was 3k people, now picture it in the 220~ range. ((Please don't focus on this, the numbers are not specific more then to give an accurate representation. Whether it was 60% and 2% or 80 and 5% isn't relevant, I more or less pulled the numbers out of my ass vaguely recalling that I belive it was 3k'ish accounts that claimed to unsub))
This was vastly due to WiS taking all dev time, Fis being ignored, AND the leak that hinted at gold ammo, something CCP took weeks to release a proper 'answer' to, which despite their (CCP's) faults in regard to it was very uncharacteristic.

In short:
CCP shouldn't dump WiS completely, But it definetely shouldn't be killing the rest of the game due to lack of developer time.
For some people wis may be used a bit more, but for the vast majority that are current players it will likely see as much attention as PI or faction warfare. Let's remember that not even all of the playerbase uses stations - Some of us live in wormholes in pos's, others in null where there is no or little station access.
CCP Should most certainly be focusing on FiS, It is their game that we pay to play currently (Plex, or RL is not relevant). This shouldn't be more or less ignored for three years to add something that a few people may use and enjoy but for the most part will likely go unnoticed.
Nypheas Azurai
Azimuth Enterprises
#1006 - 2011-11-15 08:37:49 UTC
I'm also one of those unsubs and will be again shortly.
I left because Incarna was a failure of commitment to EVE players on so many levels. And to be fair to myself, the only reason why I joined EVE in the first place was because of the promise of an expanding world.

That CCP is peddling and sadly some of the playerbase now believes that micro-patches scrambled together in the last few months trumps the need for real expansive content... it's a trend away from all the reasons I joined.

I'll likely resub to check out the winter expansion (indeed a great set of patches, but to be clear patches is all they are and ones that should have occurred long ago), and probably look for any signs of life for WiS or if not (how could it be not?) whatever the next expansive new content will be (even fully realizing planetary interaction would be cool).

I think all players of EVE, FIS and WIS, are tired of paying for the mistakes of WoD and DUST; it's not fair to starve off the future of EVE in some bid for forgiveness through false penance.
Niko Takahashi
Yoshitomi Group
#1007 - 2011-11-15 09:29:18 UTC
We can conclude this thread with 3 statements.

1 Winter expansion is nothing but a Patch of problem with solutions already pointed out by the players long time ago.

BC with BS guns POS fuels Hybrids ....

All was there posted in the forums


2

WIS is just fluff and most the people do not give a rats ass Not actively hating it but do not care about it.
And no it will not bring too many subscribers at least stable ones.

Like me


3

Since the October announcement it will take CCP maybe till next summer to bring something truly game expanding.
Until then it is patch the most obvious errors and small things we can throw together quickly mode in CCP with probably FW updates saved for summer. What I would like to see is addition of Epic arc missions for all the major and pirate factions for all level up to 5 with the 5 being in low sec.




Vertisce Soritenshi
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#1008 - 2011-11-15 14:56:52 UTC
Nypheas Azurai wrote:
I'm also one of those unsubs and will be again shortly.
I left because Incarna was a failure of commitment to EVE players on so many levels. And to be fair to myself, the only reason why I joined EVE in the first place was because of the promise of an expanding world.

That CCP is peddling and sadly some of the playerbase now believes that micro-patches scrambled together in the last few months trumps the need for real expansive content... it's a trend away from all the reasons I joined.

I'll likely resub to check out the winter expansion (indeed a great set of patches, but to be clear patches is all they are and ones that should have occurred long ago), and probably look for any signs of life for WiS or if not (how could it be not?) whatever the next expansive new content will be (even fully realizing planetary interaction would be cool).

I think all players of EVE, FIS and WIS, are tired of paying for the mistakes of WoD and DUST; it's not fair to starve off the future of EVE in some bid for forgiveness through false penance.


This has to be one of the dumbest things I have ever read. You joined EvE "because of the promise of an expanding world." yet you are opposed to WiS and DUST? Oh right...by expanding you mean "more empty and unused systems". That must be it...

Both WiS and DUST are designed to expand the world of EvE. Not just in terms of more systems but in gameplay and demographic. Those that are opposed to WiS and DUST simply want more and more of the same. More and more of the same is what kills games. People grow bored of the same old same old in games. Right now the reason I am playing EvE is because I look forward to what DUST will bring. I play because I want to see WiS realized and experience what it will bring. Ive shot and killed enough people in EvE. I want to experience new things now. Shooting people from a new ship is still shooting poeple from a ship.

Bounties for all! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=2279821#post2279821
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#1009 - 2011-11-15 16:11:00 UTC
Nypheas Azurai wrote:
You're still confused about what WiS and what Incarna was. Incarna is the name of an expansion that gave us a half-heated attempt at WiS. Just like you can recognize every other expansion as half-delivered content, why do you seem to have trouble recognizing this one for what it was?


Huh? I know convinced sounds pretty similar to confused as they both begin with 'con' but how anyone can confuse the two... is just beyond me.

Seriously though, I feel as if I am a new person, you have really changed me. It is beautiful and I think we oughta hug. Oh wait, no, I still think that WiS is a complete waste of time and resources. But if it makes you happy, I'll call it for what it really is: pointless minigame for socially akward people.

Happy? Good. I am glad you're happy.

Nypheas Azurai wrote:
What did WiS offer, and did it offer more than fixing old game mechanics? It offered a vision to the new player, the same vision CCP shared about the future, and yes it offered more than fixing old hardened game mechanics, to me and many others I know. Why? Because very minute game mechanics don't matter to a person that's not playing your game. As I mentioned earlier, I and many others started with Freelancer; I already enjoyed its mechanics and despite many friends telling me about EVE, after the trial I wasn't compelled enough to try a new sci-fi game (especially since EVE's flight mechanics are worse than Freelancer's). On-again off-again trials with EVE was all I could muster for a while, until I saw the E3 2008 WiS video. That was awe inspiring and enough to send me over the edge with a single message: EVE had a future larger than simply shooting in space.


I couldn't give a flying toss about your hopes and dreams for EVE or what games you previously played.

Nypheas Azurai wrote:

And I'm willing to bet there are as many if not more here for that future, that sense of expansiveness and completeness, as there are here only for PvP.


Yes, it seems to be a common thing among you, rather be playing with space barbie instead of actually playing the game. You play with dolls in real life too?

Nypheas Azurai wrote:

I might have thought the same until you actually get out there and start to discover how secretly notorious this game is. From casual mentions among friends, to the obvious in circles of gamers, it wasn't until I accidentally brought it up with a waitress at a bar (and even asked her several 'test' questions to prove she wasn't bs-ing) that I started challenging just how niche this game is. One thing is for sure, just as I was, though millions may not be playing, they're aware of the game and millions are on the outside looking in for just any reason to get them started. WiS is that reason, and it's a reason that has the potential to bring in more players than any other feature. But like I said, they're watching, and Incarna and indefinitely delaying WiS... it's not helping our image.


I am honestly more interested in the waitress than the rest of your post. Was she hot? Did you get her number? HOW DOES THIS TALE END?

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
Alpheias
Tactical Farmers.
Pandemic Horde
#1010 - 2011-11-15 16:11:35 UTC
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
I don't remember CCP ever saying they wouldn't fix existing issues, in fact it was just the opposite. They said they were going to do that with their 'Commitment to Excellence' campaign and then they never made good on it.

Again you label Incarna as WiS. That was Incarna, Dust and WOD they were working on.

Incarna's CQ is a malformed mutated version of Ambulation's WiS which is completely different.


Maybe if you spent less time hiding in a NPC corp, doing missions, crying about the lack of interactivity between space barbies on a forum, you'd notice a thing or two.

So what? Different name, same ****.

It was conceptulized as 'walking in stations' to later be called 'ambulation' and it was implemented through the 'incarna' expansion and again it is still different name, same ****.

DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Sorry, but your conclusions are wrong if you think Eve is still the same as it was back in 2003. Back then it was indeed a 'Niche' game.

Niche = relating to or aimed at a small specialized group or market
Mainstream = belonging to or characteristic of a principal, dominant, or widely accepted group, movement, style, etc.

When CCP decided to do it's massive advertizing campaign, they in fact decided to change Eve from being a 'Niche' game into a 'Mainstream' game.


I am more concerned with the actual marketshare of EVE and compared to WoW and others out there, EVE is indeed a niche game... thanks for pointing out how right I really was though.

DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Again you view the monstrosity of Incarna's CQ as Ambulation's WiS. If CCP had stayed with the original design and graphics engine of Ambulation's WiS, we wouldn't be having this discussion. The graphics engine for Incarna's CQ was indeed a test for WOD. Everyone was expecting Ambulation's WiS and it's graphics engine. What was promised and what we got is two different things.


If there was ever a post by you where I'd conclude that you are a clown with downs, this would be it. Once and for all, you proved to be a blithering idiot. Now the news.

Agent of Chaos, Sower of Discord.

Don't talk to me unless you are IQ verified and certified with three references from non-family members. Please have your certificate of authenticity on hand.
Astrid Stjerna
Sebiestor Tribe
#1011 - 2011-11-15 16:36:52 UTC
Alpheias wrote:

Yes, it seems to be a common thing among you, rather be playing with space barbie instead of actually playing the game. You play with dolls in real life too?


Here we go, in bold, itaicized, underlined text so that not even you can fail to see it:

If you don't like it, don't use it.

Honestly, you bi*** about 'space barbie' but refuse to acknowledge that you don't have to participate in that part of the game. Nobody's going to come to your house and superglue your hands to the mouse.\

Again, if you don't like it, don't use it!

I can't get rid of my darn signature!  Oh, wait....
yumike
Doomheim
#1012 - 2011-11-15 18:01:16 UTC  |  Edited by: yumike
Astrid Stjerna wrote:
If you don't like it, don't use it.

Again, if you don't like it, don't use it!


That's only a viable choice, When CCP learns to balance things and release features involving both concurrently, however it seems they can't balance features/releases properly and releases little to no features for nearly 3 years '08->'11 to the game I pay to play.
And apparently their refocus is on FiS and they are shelving WiS.

I really do not understand how they cant leave two teams on WiS and have everyone else churning out features for the game we currently play. But apparently they can't, and you are being silly if you think WiS should take priority over FiS.
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#1013 - 2011-11-15 19:07:37 UTC
Alpheias wrote:
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
I don't remember CCP ever saying they wouldn't fix existing issues, in fact it was just the opposite. They said they were going to do that with their 'Commitment to Excellence' campaign and then they never made good on it.

Again you label Incarna as WiS. That was Incarna, Dust and WOD they were working on.

Incarna's CQ is a malformed mutated version of Ambulation's WiS which is completely different.


Maybe if you spent less time hiding in a NPC corp, doing missions, crying about the lack of interactivity between space barbies on a forum, you'd notice a thing or two.

So what? Different name, same ****.

It was conceptulized as 'walking in stations' to later be called 'ambulation' and it was implemented through the 'incarna' expansion and again it is still different name, same ****.

DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Sorry, but your conclusions are wrong if you think Eve is still the same as it was back in 2003. Back then it was indeed a 'Niche' game.

Niche = relating to or aimed at a small specialized group or market
Mainstream = belonging to or characteristic of a principal, dominant, or widely accepted group, movement, style, etc.

When CCP decided to do it's massive advertizing campaign, they in fact decided to change Eve from being a 'Niche' game into a 'Mainstream' game.


I am more concerned with the actual marketshare of EVE and compared to WoW and others out there, EVE is indeed a niche game... thanks for pointing out how right I really was though.

DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Again you view the monstrosity of Incarna's CQ as Ambulation's WiS. If CCP had stayed with the original design and graphics engine of Ambulation's WiS, we wouldn't be having this discussion. The graphics engine for Incarna's CQ was indeed a test for WOD. Everyone was expecting Ambulation's WiS and it's graphics engine. What was promised and what we got is two different things.


If there was ever a post by you where I'd conclude that you are a clown with downs, this would be it. Once and for all, you proved to be a blithering idiot. Now the news.


Alpheias, why you so mad?

lol, just because you fail is no reason to get all butt hurt and then try to insult me. The only thing your posted reply proves is that you're an immature narrow minded little pubbie who is consumed with trying to look superior by flashing EPEEN and insulting others every chance you get. Nice try but you still fail.

I don't understand why you and all the other anti-WiS people keep insisting on posting in this thread. Every time a negative reply is posted, a positive reply is posted. The only thing you're doing is keeping this thread alive.

Actually now that I think about it, that just might be a good thing.


Anyway, I really need to start following the #1 Forum rule - Don't feed the trolls.

lol, that means no more food for you.

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Jita Alt666
#1014 - 2011-11-15 19:14:33 UTC
DeMichael Crimson wrote:


u mad?

lol, you fail butt hurt. immature narrow minded little pubbie flashing EPEEN insulting others. you still fail.

Don't feed the trolls.

lol, that means no more food for you.


heh.
Bloodpetal
Tir Capital Management Group
#1015 - 2011-11-15 19:32:58 UTC


WIS is going to be a great addition when they work out the details - I am actually annoyed at the mishandling of the situation. Incarna was not the problem, it's how CCP ignored and refused to acknowledge concerns.

Where I am.
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#1016 - 2011-11-15 19:43:47 UTC
Jita Alt666 wrote:
DeMichael Crimson wrote:


u mad?

lol, you fail butt hurt. immature narrow minded little pubbie flashing EPEEN insulting others. you still fail.

Don't feed the trolls.

lol, that means no more food for you.


heh.


Not sure why you feel the need to quote someone and then edit the quote so that it's portrayed out of context.


'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
yumike
Doomheim
#1017 - 2011-11-15 19:58:38 UTC
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Jita Alt666 wrote:
DeMichael Crimson wrote:


u mad?

lol, you fail butt hurt. immature narrow minded little pubbie flashing EPEEN insulting others. you still fail.

Don't feed the trolls.

lol, that means no more food for you.


heh.


Not sure why you feel the need to quote someone and then edit the quote so that it's portrayed out of context.




Because the majority of them respond with argumentum ad hominem and think it will actually get them somewhere, These are usual the people that believe all opinions are equal.
So long as we're getting enjoyment out of this dara o briarn does a really good skit "Science doesn't know everything" easily found on youtube that explains that mentality really good :D
Jita Alt666
#1018 - 2011-11-15 20:14:22 UTC
DeMichael Crimson wrote:
Jita Alt666 wrote:
DeMichael Crimson wrote:


u mad?

lol, you fail butt hurt. immature narrow minded little pubbie flashing EPEEN insulting others. you still fail.

Don't feed the trolls.

lol, that means no more food for you.


heh.


Not sure why you feel the need to quote someone and then edit the quote so that it's portrayed out of context.




I'm merely illustrating the volume of negative fluff you included in an otherwise useful post. Everything I quoted was not necessary for your point, in-fact everything I quoted detracted from the point you were attempting to make.
6 Internet memes (3 of them misused)
3 direct insults
1 valid point
DeMichael Crimson
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
#1019 - 2011-11-15 23:11:22 UTC
Jita Alt666 wrote:

I'm merely illustrating the volume of negative fluff you included in an otherwise useful post. Everything I quoted was not necessary for your point, in-fact everything I quoted detracted from the point you were attempting to make.
6 Internet memes (3 of them misused)
3 direct insults
1 valid point



And I merely stated the fact that you quoted me and then edited that quote to portray it out of context by listing specific words, especially since your reply was 'heh'.

Heh = (onomatopoeia) Weak amusement, sometimes signaling boredom. A cold word mistaken for a chuckle, a semi-cynical connotation. Heh is a short reply, where usually the person typing it is feeling down or is annoyed.

yumike gave a good reason why someone would post a quote and then edit it to portray it out of context.

Argumentum ad hominem = attempt to negate the truth of a claim by pointing out a negative characteristic or belief of the person supporting it.

Since you decided to edit the quote and then replied with 'heh', that clearly portrays annoyance, disdain and or contempt in an attempt to discredit me.

Now you try to rationalize and justify your actions by saying those words weren't needed to get my point across when the intent of your entire post is to redirect attention and portray me as the bad guy.

I believe you're intentionally trying to derail this thread which I don't want to happen. From now on I'll be sure to stay on topic and disregard any off topic replies directed personally towards me.

'The Plan' | California Eve Players | Proposal - The Endless Battle
Lateris
#1020 - 2011-11-15 23:16:05 UTC
Have you guys noticed that much of the avatars that we have made look like the singer from Radio head?

0/