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Wormholes

 
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Marauders, Bastion Mode, and Wormholes

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M1k3y Koontz
House of Musashi
Stay Feral
#81 - 2013-09-03 18:07:02 UTC
Roime wrote:
M1k3y Koontz wrote:

I'm sure we'll see plenty of funny officer derpfit Marauders this Winter.


We'll as often see battlereports with lolmarauder topping every lossmail or the overconfident gank fleet who go lolmarauderinbastionlol, warp their useless HIC on it, followed by their soontodie T3s. Well at least they get their own HIC on the mails.

Is that guy really soloing sites, or is he baiting us, surrounded by a cloaky trapfleet? Only one way to find out.



That will be an excellent use, lolbait.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
Keith Planck
Hi-Sec Huggers
#82 - 2013-09-03 18:51:18 UTC
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
Roime wrote:
M1k3y Koontz wrote:

I'm sure we'll see plenty of funny officer derpfit Marauders this Winter.


We'll as often see battlereports with lolmarauder topping every lossmail or the overconfident gank fleet who go lolmarauderinbastionlol, warp their useless HIC on it, followed by their soontodie T3s. Well at least they get their own HIC on the mails.

Is that guy really soloing sites, or is he baiting us, surrounded by a cloaky trapfleet? Only one way to find out.



That will be an excellent use, lolbait.


That's not just bait, that's a goddamn brick tied to the end of a fishing pole

♞
Keith Planck
Hi-Sec Huggers
#83 - 2013-09-03 18:52:57 UTC
ITT

PvPers saying how easy the ship is going to be able to gank with a 30 man T3 fleet.

&

PvEers commenting on it's increased resistance to small gang/solo gankers.

♞
M1k3y Koontz
House of Musashi
Stay Feral
#84 - 2013-09-03 19:00:38 UTC  |  Edited by: M1k3y Koontz
Keith Planck wrote:
M1k3y Koontz wrote:
Roime wrote:
M1k3y Koontz wrote:

I'm sure we'll see plenty of funny officer derpfit Marauders this Winter.


We'll as often see battlereports with lolmarauder topping every lossmail or the overconfident gank fleet who go lolmarauderinbastionlol, warp their useless HIC on it, followed by their soontodie T3s. Well at least they get their own HIC on the mails.

Is that guy really soloing sites, or is he baiting us, surrounded by a cloaky trapfleet? Only one way to find out.



That will be an excellent use, lolbait.


That's not just bait, that's a goddamn brick tied to the end of a fishing pole


A brick made of gold Twisted

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
Evangelina Nolen
Sama Guild
#85 - 2013-09-04 09:03:56 UTC
Good luck finding them...

Too expensive/inefficient for anything in C1-C3.
It will however beast mode C4's with MJD use.
Incindir Mauser
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#86 - 2013-09-04 17:51:17 UTC  |  Edited by: Incindir Mauser
This whole change to Marauders feels like it should belong on a separate set of hulls. Shoehorning mini dread mode on to a
Billion plus hull makes me think... Why not just bring a dread?


This change is just going to pigeonhole marauders further into the pve role than they already are. If ccp wants to see more mjd sniping going on nerf ongrid combat scanning so sniping at extend ranges is an actual viable tactic.
This just feels like they are trying to make a hammer do a screwdrivers job.
Keith Planck
Hi-Sec Huggers
#87 - 2013-09-04 22:07:02 UTC  |  Edited by: Keith Planck
Incindir Mauser wrote:
This whole change to Marauders feels like it should belong on a separate set of hulls. Shoehorning mini dread mode on to a
Billion plus hull makes me think... Why not just bring a dread?


This change is just going to pigeonhole marauders further into the pve role than they already are. If ccp wants to see more mjd sniping going on nerf ongrid combat scanning so sniping at extend ranges is an actual viable tactic.
This just feels like they are trying to make a hammer do a screwdrivers job.


Why not just bring a dread? Have you ever done any anoms in nullsec or any sleeper sites or ever been in highsec...

♞
Rek Seven
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#88 - 2013-09-04 22:54:18 UTC  |  Edited by: Rek Seven
CCP Ytterbium wrote:
Time for another update.

We discussed the Marauder situation further and came with the following changes:


  • Shield, armor and hull 30% resistance boosts have been removed on the Bastion Module - instead, all Marauders will now get proper tech2 resists. This will allow Marauders to have better RR use outside Bastion and reduce overall tanking effectiveness inside the mode.

  • We have removed all tanking bonuses on the Marauders hulls (Armor Repairer amount on the Paladin and Kronos, Shield Boost amount on the Golem and Vargur). Instead, we are giving them 7.5% bonus to the velocity factor of stasis webifiers per level. This will not only help reducing their tanking effectiveness, be more in theme with the ship role itself and help anyone using them with short range weapons. We are not giving them a full 10% per level back as this would be extremely powerful in conjunction with the other bonuses / Bastion. We are going to leave the full 10% web strength amount on the Serpentis ships for now and see how things evolve with time.

  • Also, we are removing the mass penalty on the Bastion mode. Tests have shown you can't really turn when it's active anyway, and we don't want to have players abuse that to collapse wormholes.


I will change the OP to match the changes.


Bastion seems pretty uninspired to me now.... You will have slightly better damage application, be immune to E-war but not be able to receive reps... Great. In pvp, people will probably not fit the bastion mod and just fit tracking computers and ECCM mods.

The wishlist is pretty much complete...
Incindir Mauser
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#89 - 2013-09-05 01:46:28 UTC
Keith Planck wrote:
Incindir Mauser wrote:
This whole change to Marauders feels like it should belong on a separate set of hulls. Shoehorning mini dread mode on to a
Billion plus hull makes me think... Why not just bring a dread?


This change is just going to pigeonhole marauders further into the pve role than they already are. If ccp wants to see more mjd sniping going on nerf ongrid combat scanning so sniping at extend ranges is an actual viable tactic.
This just feels like they are trying to make a hammer do a screwdrivers job.


Why not just bring a dread? Have you ever done any anoms in nullsec or any sleeper sites or ever been in highsec...



Yes and you don't need dreads, but they sure are nice.

I think you're deliberately twisting my analogy. The point being, if you want to make a MJD Sniping mini-dread... make it a separate hull and don't try and make Marauders into something they are not. It's like trying to put wings on a schoolbus and then passing it off as a 747. It's big dumb and yellow and does neither job very well.

And looking at the recent backpedaling on the original idea for this. You'd be paying too much for a ship that'll splatter in seconds as they're not going with the Bastion super-tank and range mode, to .... you get more range and webs... trolololol.

**** Marauders, they were overpriced and useless in PvP before these changes, and it'll be the same or worse after CCP gets done turning them into ISKathron the Transfuckingformer.
Incindir Mauser
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#90 - 2013-09-05 01:47:38 UTC
Rek Seven wrote:

Bastion seems pretty uninspired to me now.... You will have slightly better damage application, be immune to E-war but not be able to receive reps... Great. In pvp, people will probably not fit the bastion mod and just fit tracking computers and ECCM mods.


What you mean to say is pretty much like they do now?
Quinn Corvez
Perkone
Caldari State
#91 - 2013-09-05 07:14:01 UTC
I think that was exactly what he was saying.
Lord LazyGhost
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#92 - 2013-09-05 07:23:19 UTC
If ccp back peddle any faster they have a chance to go back in time
Random Woman
Very Professional Corporation
#93 - 2013-09-05 08:22:56 UTC
Well no wh closing anymore, no point in getting em now.
Evangelina Nolen
Sama Guild
#94 - 2013-09-06 06:48:49 UTC
With the bastion nerf, rep nerf, etc... You will only see these things in Highsec mission running{and even that is iffy}.
Keith Planck
Hi-Sec Huggers
#95 - 2013-09-07 04:09:44 UTC
Evangelina Nolen wrote:
With the bastion nerf, rep nerf, etc... You will only see these things in Highsec mission running{and even that is iffy}.


Yeah, without the reps it's not really that great anymore, its basicly slightly faster easy mode for level 4s but won't hold up to any other content worth doing.

Why not give each marauder a unique secondary

Kronos Webs
Vargur Boosts
others ???

♞
M1k3y Koontz
House of Musashi
Stay Feral
#96 - 2013-09-08 17:35:46 UTC
Incindir Mauser wrote:
This whole change to Marauders feels like it should belong on a separate set of hulls. Shoehorning mini dread mode on to a
Billion plus hull makes me think... Why not just bring a dread?


This change is just going to pigeonhole marauders further into the pve role than they already are. If ccp wants to see more mjd sniping going on nerf ongrid combat scanning so sniping at extend ranges is an actual viable tactic.
This just feels like they are trying to make a hammer do a screwdrivers job.


Can't bring a dread into a C1-C4, Dreads cost 3x more.

How much herp could a herp derp derp if a herp derp could herp derp.
Ravay Kanjus
Infinity Blue
#97 - 2013-09-15 06:17:23 UTC  |  Edited by: Ravay Kanjus
Evangelina Nolen wrote:
With the bastion nerf, rep nerf, etc... You will only see these things in Highsec mission running{and even that is iffy}.


You won't see it in Missions. I was considering training Marauders when I saw the first iteration of Bastion Mode... but really, WEBBER bonuses on ships with ranges beyond 60km easily (200km if cruise missiles)? Stasis Webifier can get what, 12km max range? On top of that, a MJD bonus? Why, so you can jump out of the 12km range again? Yipee.

More or less, this is one of the better solutions I've heard:
Keith Planck wrote:
Evangelina Nolen wrote:
With the bastion nerf, rep nerf, etc... You will only see these things in Highsec mission running{and even that is iffy}.


Yeah, without the reps it's not really that great anymore, its basicly slightly faster easy mode for level 4s but won't hold up to any other content worth doing.

Why not give each marauder a unique secondary

Kronos Webs
Vargur Boosts
others ???


As for myself, I'm a fan of the idea of perhaps making black ops BS more pvp oriented and Marauders PVE, or another Battleship T2 type for PVP/PVE. The current Marauder + Bastion seems erratic in what it's trying to decide what it wants to be. Next thing you know, it'll have a random bonus to turret damage, but a nerf to turret damage as well. Seems to make about as much sense as boosting it's optimal and fallout but giving a webifier bonus.
Senn Denroth
Lazerhawks
L A Z E R H A W K S
#98 - 2013-09-16 02:20:00 UTC
Only CCP could buff and nerf a ship type in the same thread. This thread was a funny read 9/10

I hope people use these polished turds so I can blow them up.
Matthias Thullmann
Dynatron Inc.
#99 - 2013-09-16 15:36:35 UTC
Thinking about training marauders, would it be worth it now, or should I just flesh out everything below?
Xequecal
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#100 - 2013-09-16 23:47:13 UTC
Matthias Thullmann wrote:
Thinking about training marauders, would it be worth it now, or should I just flesh out everything below?


If you're willing to risk a 1bil ship in anoms, go ahead and train them. They'll still be far better ISK/hour than any other ship in w-space, because they can salvage the sites while they run them. You can still easily fit out a Marauder to solo C3s and C4s with 1200+ DPS, that kills a sleeper BS worth 15-20m ISK in under a minute.