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[ISODE] Live coverage of the Mantenault Referendum

Author
Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#41 - 2013-09-14 02:03:30 UTC
Constantin Baracca wrote:
As someone unfamiliar to the complexities of this situation, would anyone mind bringing me up to speed, please? I think I may just be missing a few key details in order to understand everything going on in this thread.

I do like to be informed, though.


In a nuthsell, colonist of Mantenault VI are voting on whether or not to keep the National Administrative Government or NAG. The NAG was set up as a way to govern the colony during an emergency situation, such as Mantenault being brought into the war. The four major Gallente political blocs (Progressors, Sociocrats, Unionist, and U-Nats) ruled the planet through this system. The colonist are now voting to either return to their own democratic system of government or continue to be controlled indirectly by different blocs that lobby for power.

Voting commenced and went well for a while. However U-Nats experienced several technical difficulties and blamed sabotage. They protested vehemently and thus earned sympathy from the voters. The U-Nats also did some collaboration with the Sociocrats and both worked together to lobby against removing the NAG.

The U-Nats and Sociocrats prevailed. The Progressors believe that U-Nats staged the alleged sabotage to gain support. Overall unrest began on the planet and there was an explosion that knocked out communications.

In a nutshell, the democratic system was manipulated, which caused a huge flustercluck.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!

Constantin Baracca
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#42 - 2013-09-14 03:25:13 UTC
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
Constantin Baracca wrote:
As someone unfamiliar to the complexities of this situation, would anyone mind bringing me up to speed, please? I think I may just be missing a few key details in order to understand everything going on in this thread.

I do like to be informed, though.


In a nuthsell, colonist of Mantenault VI are voting on whether or not to keep the National Administrative Government or NAG. The NAG was set up as a way to govern the colony during an emergency situation, such as Mantenault being brought into the war. The four major Gallente political blocs (Progressors, Sociocrats, Unionist, and U-Nats) ruled the planet through this system. The colonist are now voting to either return to their own democratic system of government or continue to be controlled indirectly by different blocs that lobby for power.

Voting commenced and went well for a while. However U-Nats experienced several technical difficulties and blamed sabotage. They protested vehemently and thus earned sympathy from the voters. The U-Nats also did some collaboration with the Sociocrats and both worked together to lobby against removing the NAG.

The U-Nats and Sociocrats prevailed. The Progressors believe that U-Nats staged the alleged sabotage to gain support. Overall unrest began on the planet and there was an explosion that knocked out communications.

In a nutshell, the democratic system was manipulated, which caused a huge flustercluck.


Thank you for the summary, Fred.

I suppose that corruption is another of those universal constants and every system can be manipulated. My own personal experience with democracy is that it almost encourages corruption. In a way, the people who rise to power are not necessarily the most able to govern, but those most able to win an election. So it would stand to reason that manipulation would serve you better than honesty. You do not necessarily have to be right or well-learned (although it would surely help), but instead need to be sufficiently likable and get people hooked on a feeling.

So I suppose that this might be a somewhat extreme example, but I see Eran's point that this is somewhat common to what those of us outside Gallentean space generally see in democracy. There are, of course, plenty of working exceptions, but it seems to encourage factionalism.

My other experience is that, for as much investment as it takes to win a major election, most people want to see a return on that investment. I am sure there are altruistic politicians out there, but it seems that it would be easier for a politician to raise funds for an election, then spend his time in office making back his money.

Again, all government systems have their issues, even my own Imperial (i.e. fascist) government. Staying on topic though, this seems to be an endemic problem in democracies. The entire system is built on the idea that every single citizen will become thoroughly educated about every single politician and issue and vote on merit. It more often seems that you get a job in, say, the ministry of education not by being an excellent educator or administrator of educators, but by being a great politician. It almost seems that you would get better results by lottery, randomly appointing some citizen to be said minister of education every five years and giving him perhaps five years to prepare while his predecessor serves his term. That way, politicians could not be bought, could not manipulate the system, and could not say they won a popularity contest. I suppose that wouldn't necessarily be a democracy anymore, though it would certainly be the rule of the common people. I believe that is the basic intent.

While that may not seem newsworthy to us, I do think the entire communications system going down around the planet is fairly newsworthy. It makes it somewhat important to know who was tampering with the relay network, as it may expose corruption by one of the major parties or, more dangerously, outside tampering. The only prayer democracy has of working seems to lie in the presence of a free, objective, tenacious press (which, by the way, I thank for the reporting of this story). Obviously, someone did not want anyone to know what was happening for a while. If that had happened in any other space, we would be throwing fits trying to figure out what was covered up. It seems even more right to ask that question in this referendum, as so much was at stake for the winners.

Take anything I say with a certain grain of salt. Nobody elected Jamyl and even if we didn't like her we would still have to bow to her judgement. We can only pray she continues to make good decisions for our Empire and that all the people of our Empire are suitably trained for the positions they are expected to fill. I suppose you could call that our personal political problem.

Sometimes, you can be trained from birth to do something and still suck.

"What good will it be for someone to gain the whole world, yet forfeit their soul? Or what can anyone give in exchange for their soul?"

-Matthew 16:26

Jake Favre
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#43 - 2013-09-14 10:45:43 UTC
Fredfredbug4 wrote:
If it weren't for U-Nats, the Gallente and Caldari would be at peace, hell, you could even argue that the Caldari would of never broken off in the first place.

Though the U-Nats are certainly very good at influencing the magpies, which seem to make up the majority of the voting bloc within the Sociocrat party. Hell considering that the Sociocrats are currently best friends with the Black Eagles, I'm not surprised that they are the puppets of the U-Nats. Supporting Sociocrats and U-Nats while scoffing at the totalitarian nature of the late Provist Regime over in the State is horribly ironic and outright hypocritical.

I'm quite confident that the explosions and dissent are all the U-Nats doing, they are well known for this type of thing.


Sir, your message is a complete conflation of various facts that are not linked together, trying to make sense out of them, but you are actually mixing things up pretty badly.

- The magpies do not make up the majority of the sociocrat voting bloc. The magpies, by the definition of this very colloquial term, have very "short attention to politics" and by such, would be unable to form a during, core voting bloc for any political party.

- The Sociocrats are not best friends with the Black Eagles, but Mr Blaque is certainly a member of the sociocrat party, which is not exactly the same thing.

- Even if the above was true, I can hardly see the link with being puppets to the U-Nat party. As stated above, Mr Blaque is a sociocrat member, and as far as I know, the U-Nats do not control anything at the Black Eagle or SDII level.
Seriphyn Inhonores
Elusenian Cooperative
#44 - 2013-09-14 17:47:04 UTC  |  Edited by: Seriphyn Inhonores
Earlier today, the Elusenian Agora approved the Directorate's proposal to send electoral administrators to Mantenault VI for the purposes of independently facilitating a re-run of the referendum that took place a week ago. The ESS Rosmerta, a Viator-class transport captained by myself, was sent by the Cooperative Republic of Elusenia, ferrying an undisclosed number of administrators from relevant Sub-Directorates, as well as a security attache.

We have set up a command center on the outskirts of the capital city of Latiene, as well as five additional landing sites dispersed across the planet. From here, we will begin the process of organizing and facilitating a re-run of the referendum via traditional pen-and-paper methods. As the relay network has yet to be re-established, this is the only logistically sound method for conducting the plebiscite, to be coordinated via portable radiowave communications. Additionally, this method is the least susceptible to fraud or sabotage when conducted by an independent body such as ourselves.

The referendum will include the original question ("That the National Administrative Government be dissolved and full sovereign authority returned to the citizenry of the colony through a direct democratic model."), as well as an additional question regarding the Elusenian presence and the potential to reconstruct the relay network; "If a direct democratic model is resumed, do you support a reconstruction of the relay network with assistance from outside agencies?"

Public order is stable, and as commander of the Elusenian mission, I would like to stress that we will not be involving ourselves in security matters unless so instructed by local democratic mandate. ELPIDA Carabineros are on-world exclusively for the purposes of providing security at voting stations. Nonetheless, if Elusenians conduct themselves beyond the limits of their station, I will take full responsibility as the highest-ranking officer in the constellation.

The ESS Rosmerta has made dock at FDU Mercomesier. I and my staff will be making shuttle trips back and forth to Mantenault VI to ensure that matters are proceeding smoothly. I am available for all public relations enquiries.

General Seriphyn Inhonores
Space Forces Commander
Elusenian Peacekeeping, Intelligence and Defence Agency (ELPIDA)
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#45 - 2013-09-14 19:14:01 UTC
I'm very interested to see the Elusenians deployed militarily far outside their borders in support of planetary populations.

I think this is an exciting development of the powers of capsuleer organisations and I have had 4800 Marines in training since early summer , primarily looking at peacekeeping and garrison roles within State territority but you never know this Mantenault thing could set a very interesting precedent!

I'll be watching carefully and with great interest.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.

Laurentis Thiesant
Institute of Social Development
#46 - 2013-09-14 23:38:09 UTC
I was pleased to be able to negotiate the assistance of the Elusenian people on the behalf of Mantenault and its electors. It is my hope that this 'circuit-breaker' will be able to get in, get the job done, and resume the normal state of affairs with Mantenault as a functioning and forward-thinking community in line with the many great Gallentean democracies across, and even outside of, the Federation.

I wish the teams of the Cooperative the best fortune as they conduct the ballot.
Jake Favre
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#47 - 2013-09-17 19:40:07 UTC
While order is still not completely restored, the NAG voted in favor of a new election, and thus validated Elusenian presence on Mantenault soil to help further the process. The Nationalists were eventually unable to turn the vote in their favor.

As promised, everything in due time.
Marnian Veroe
National Republican Party
#48 - 2013-09-17 19:58:09 UTC
This is pristine comedy.

We would like to remind everyone that the No won the referendum, and we are still waiting for proofs that the election was rigged. The progressive and unionist parties should know better than throwing tantrums and shaking fists when they have absolutely no proof to back it up, besides a few unreliable witnesses of "mysterious individuals tampering with the election relays".

This is only another proof that these political parties only care for democratic principles as long as it suits them. And now that they have lost, unable to admit their defeat and swallow their pride, they ask for foreign intervention.

Thanks to sociocracts, who still unfortunately hold the majority of seats at the NAG, the vote for a new vote - how ludicrous is that wording ? - passed. One cannot just re-vote ad vitam eternam until the "correct" decision is taken. The true value of a popular referendum lies in its uniqueness, and any new one on the same matter is indicative of a serious constitutional breach.

As such we would like to point out that we do not recognize any new vote for any new referendum, as per Mantenault and Federal constitution.

- Marnian Veroe
Member of the National-Republican Party and delegate of the National Syndicate of Mantenault.
James Syagrius
Luminaire Sovereign Solutions
#49 - 2013-09-17 20:58:33 UTC  |  Edited by: James Syagrius
Marnian Veroe wrote:
This is pristine comedy.

We would like to remind everyone that the No won the referendum, and we are still waiting for proofs that the election was rigged. The progressive and unionist parties should know better than throwing tantrums and shaking fists when they have absolutely no proof to back it up, besides a few unreliable witnesses of "mysterious individuals tampering with the election relays".

This is only another proof that these political parties only care for democratic principles as long as it suits them. And now that they have lost, unable to admit their defeat and swallow their pride, they ask for foreign intervention.

Thanks to sociocracts, who still unfortunately hold the majority of seats at the NAG, the vote for a new vote - how ludicrous is that wording ? - passed. One cannot just re-vote ad vitam eternam until the "correct" decision is taken. The true value of a popular referendum lies in its uniqueness, and any new one on the same matter is indicative of a serious constitutional breach.

As such we would like to point out that we do not recognize any new vote for any new referendum, as per Mantenault and Federal constitution.

- Marnian Veroe
Member of the National-Republican Party and delegate of the National Syndicate of Mantenault.

It pains me to agree, but it does seem like the more progressive elements are trying, without proof of wrongdoing, to undo an election.
Constantin Baracca
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#50 - 2013-09-17 23:23:44 UTC
James Syagrius wrote:
Marnian Veroe wrote:
This is pristine comedy.

We would like to remind everyone that the No won the referendum, and we are still waiting for proofs that the election was rigged. The progressive and unionist parties should know better than throwing tantrums and shaking fists when they have absolutely no proof to back it up, besides a few unreliable witnesses of "mysterious individuals tampering with the election relays".

This is only another proof that these political parties only care for democratic principles as long as it suits them. And now that they have lost, unable to admit their defeat and swallow their pride, they ask for foreign intervention.

Thanks to sociocracts, who still unfortunately hold the majority of seats at the NAG, the vote for a new vote - how ludicrous is that wording ? - passed. One cannot just re-vote ad vitam eternam until the "correct" decision is taken. The true value of a popular referendum lies in its uniqueness, and any new one on the same matter is indicative of a serious constitutional breach.

As such we would like to point out that we do not recognize any new vote for any new referendum, as per Mantenault and Federal constitution.

- Marnian Veroe
Member of the National-Republican Party and delegate of the National Syndicate of Mantenault.

It pains me to agree, but it does seem like the more progressive elements are trying, without proof of wrongdoing, to undo an election.


Sometimes, after living for an ideal after so long, you forget that the ideal defines you, not the other way around. As it has happened in other cultures and in other places throughout eternity, idealists for democracy sometimes forget that they should bow to the principle and not bend the principle to them.

It will be important to see how it develops, though. It is difficult, from so far away and with so little contextual information, to make assumptions about much.

We have to live and die by our morals, though. Even if you don't believe you need to answer for them in the afterlife, it seems the Gallente just as quickly fear the god of History judging them poorly.

"What good will it be for someone to gain the whole world, yet forfeit their soul? Or what can anyone give in exchange for their soul?"

-Matthew 16:26

Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#51 - 2013-09-18 00:16:28 UTC
Jake Favre wrote:


Sir, your message is a complete conflation of various facts that are not linked together, trying to make sense out of them, but you are actually mixing things up pretty badly.

- The magpies do not make up the majority of the sociocrat voting bloc. The magpies, by the definition of this very colloquial term, have very "short attention to politics" and by such, would be unable to form a during, core voting bloc for any political party.

- The Sociocrats are not best friends with the Black Eagles, but Mr Blaque is certainly a member of the sociocrat party, which is not exactly the same thing.

- Even if the above was true, I can hardly see the link with being puppets to the U-Nat party. As stated above, Mr Blaque is a sociocrat member, and as far as I know, the U-Nats do not control anything at the Black Eagle or SDII level.


-Magpies are the core voters in every party, simply because they are the largest and most fickle. Your group managed to win them over this time around.

- Mr. Blaque is more than a member of the Sociacrats, he's the leader of the Sociocrats. At least he was. I'd imagine running the Black Eagles keeps him busy. Regardless he's still certainly calling the shots.

- You are puppets to the U-Nats because of how easily winned over you were. At the beginning of this whole debacle, our two parties actually agreed for once. As always, what's too good to be true usually is. It's either you were being manipulated by them, or were on their side the whole time. Either option doesn't speak so well for your party.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!

Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#52 - 2013-09-18 00:28:02 UTC
Constantin Baracca wrote:


We have to live and die by our morals, though. Even if you don't believe you need to answer for them in the afterlife, it seems the Gallente just as quickly fear the god of History judging them poorly.


Our society has always been about self improvement, primarily learning from past mistakes. Assuming there was a "god of history" we would certainly worship him, for those who do not know their history are doomed to repeat it.

The greatest component of Gallente Individualism is that constant desire to improve ourselves. It's why the Federation has managed to stay influential and powerful, both in good times and in bad.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!

Jake Favre
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#53 - 2013-09-18 18:45:58 UTC
Fredfredbug4 wrote:

-Magpies are the core voters in every party, simply because they are the largest and most fickle. Your group managed to win them over this time around.

- Mr. Blaque is more than a member of the Sociacrats, he's the leader of the Sociocrats. At least he was. I'd imagine running the Black Eagles keeps him busy. Regardless he's still certainly calling the shots.

- You are puppets to the U-Nats because of how easily winned over you were. At the beginning of this whole debacle, our two parties actually agreed for once. As always, what's too good to be true usually is. It's either you were being manipulated by them, or were on their side the whole time. Either option doesn't speak so well for your party.


- If core voters always equals to the majority or at least one of the most numerous group of voters, then I am afraid that we might not share the same definition for "core voters". What people flippantly call magpies are indeed one of the most wooed groups of voters in politics, considering the sheer size of their numbers and their ability to quickly change side, and thus, to be gained to one's cause. However, they do not constitute a core group of loyal voters that bear with your party through thick and thin, and for those we are eternally grateful for their support. Without them, a political party is no more than thin air, because who else will convince our dear "magpies" to place their trust in our vote, in the first place ?

- Mr Blaque, being leader of the Sociocrat movement, is also one of its members first and foremost. This is how it works at the Sociocrat party. It may differ from a few others parties, but it is also a part of what defines what we are... In any case, are you trying to say that he could face some conflicts of interest ? And if he is, then, which politician holding executive functions does not ?

- I think you confused who is the puppet of who here. Who holds the majority at the NAG ?
Fredfredbug4
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#54 - 2013-09-18 20:52:35 UTC
Jake Favre wrote:


- If core voters always equals to the majority or at least one of the most numerous group of voters, then I am afraid that we might not share the same definition for "core voters". What people flippantly call magpies are indeed one of the most wooed groups of voters in politics, considering the sheer size of their numbers and their ability to quickly change side, and thus, to be gained to one's cause. However, they do not constitute a core group of loyal voters that bear with your party through thick and thin, and for those we are eternally grateful for their support. Without them, a political party is no more than thin air, because who else will convince our dear "magpies" to place their trust in our vote, in the first place ?

- Mr Blaque, being leader of the Sociocrat movement, is also one of its members first and foremost. This is how it works at the Sociocrat party. It may differ from a few others parties, but it is also a part of what defines what we are... In any case, are you trying to say that he could face some conflicts of interest ? And if he is, then, which politician holding executive functions does not ?

- I think you confused who is the puppet of who here. Who holds the majority at the NAG ?


- Magpies tend to have loyalties, I don't know what you're going on about. They register for a party like every other bloc. Whether or not they make informed decisions on what party the vote for is besides the point, they do have loyalties but can easily be winned over.

- Your point?

- And now the typical sociocrat "Tu Quoque" defenses.

I like how you dodged literally everything I stated. You've made no effort to disprove me, and instead ran your mouth, diverting the topic and hoping I would be too eager to respond to notice. Your typical Sociocrat antics may work on the soap box, but they won't work against any educated voter and party member, sorry.

Watch_ Fred Fred Frederation_ and stop [u]cryptozoologist[/u]! Fight against the brutal genocide of fictional creatures across New Eden! Is that a metaphor? Probably not, but the fru-fru- people will sure love it!

Ailer Stane
Doomheim
#55 - 2013-09-19 01:51:47 UTC
Franseza Quiniou wrote:
Reports have surfaced that the Elusenian government may move to involve itself in the current political crisis on Mantenault VI,

While the Federation has nominally involved itself by dispatching FIO investigators to the planet, communications are currently down and the situation on the ground remains unclear.

How Elusenia may involve itself is not currently known, nor is it known if it will be able to acquire approval to do so from the Mantenault government.

For the timebeing, it is speculated that the Elusenian government may send electoral officers to independently facilitate a re-run of the referendum in a move to restore the Mantenaultian political order.

This report is speculation and thus its content is subject to individual verification.

I would humbly suggest that any involvement by another Federal entity, registered or not, be undertaken after the FIO has issued its report. Then said involvement be reviewed, in minimum, by the District Parliament should permission from the "elected" planetary government be granted.
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#56 - 2013-09-19 04:22:45 UTC
Ailer Stane wrote:
I would humbly suggest that any involvement by another Federal entity, registered or not, be undertaken after the FIO has issued its report. Then said involvement be reviewed, in minimum, by the District Parliament should permission from the "elected" planetary government be granted.


Too late. Didn't you read? The Elusenians have 'boots on the ground' already.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.

Laurentis Thiesant
Institute of Social Development
#57 - 2013-09-19 11:43:15 UTC
ALERT

The Institute of Social Development will be hosting a referendum day party once the polling places have closed and the count begins.

This event will be held at the Golden Masque on the 21st of this month at 1400 hrs EVE standard time.

We believe that it is important for those who support uniquely Gallentean principles such as democracy and fair and open political freedoms show solidarity to the people of Mantenault as they work to reaffirm their commitment to our Union even in spite of the problems which have troubled them in recent weeks. We also believe that now is an opportunity for those from other races who endeavour to explore our way of life in greater detail to come along and discuss politics in true Federate fashion, with good drinks and good company.

I'll also be taking that opportunity to address attendees on the next way forward for the recovery of Mantenault, and what we can all do to show our humanity and lend a hand.

I hope to see you all there.
Pieter Tuulinen
Societas Imperialis Sceptri Coronaeque
Khimi Harar
#58 - 2013-09-19 16:36:27 UTC
I shall probably be in the area but might be a little too engaged to socialise.

You know how these things are.

For the first time since I started the conversation, he looks me dead in the eye. In his gaze are steel jackhammers, quiet vengeance, a hundred thousand orbital bombs frozen in still life.

Jake Favre
The Scope
Gallente Federation
#59 - 2013-09-19 19:23:54 UTC
Fredfredbug4 wrote:


- Magpies tend to have loyalties, I don't know what you're going on about. They register for a party like every other bloc. Whether or not they make informed decisions on what party the vote for is besides the point, they do have loyalties but can easily be winned over.

- Your point?

- And now the typical sociocrat "Tu Quoque" defenses.

I like how you dodged literally everything I stated. You've made no effort to disprove me, and instead ran your mouth, diverting the topic and hoping I would be too eager to respond to notice. Your typical Sociocrat antics may work on the soap box, but they won't work against any educated voter and party member, sorry.


Not really no, Magpies do not have much loyalties except for what is said on the moment in the media and their attachment to emotional and ephemeral reactions, and are famous for that alone. That is the definition of a magpie, or they would be called hawks or doves if they were so loyal in the first place. Disagree if you will, illogical as it may be, it will only make discussion harder if we are not even able to agree on school-grade definitions.

Also, if you do not see my point about Mr Blaque, then what was yours in the first place ?

I am afraid that I do not understand where you can even see a Tu Quoque in what I wrote. I never implied that you were a puppet. Maybe you should read again what I wrote, and what I implied. I will clarify, in any case : the sociocrats are currently the only ones opposing the Nationalists at the NAG, and are currently the ones in power by democratic majority. Thus the puppets are certainly not us.

I am also afraid that your last paragraph is a rather good definition of your answers. You are not even trying to read what I write, only what you want to fantasize about. The only thing I see here is a cumbersome attempt to slander sociocrat policies. You have not even made a damn single relevant point since you started opening your mouth. You spout inconsistencies on what magpies are and how the sociocrat party only relies on them for the situation they are in and how the sociocrats owe their place to them, then to tell me that everyone does - which is the truth. You try to imply that sociocrats control the Black Eagles through Blaque, and yet you fail to notice that Blaque answers to the president, who is certainly not of sociocrat vocation, and conveniently forget that every political figure in charge of an executive power, starting with the president, following your "logic", could be then subject to the same criticism. By your very reasoning, would you then say that democracy favors conflicts of interests ?

And again, how does that even makes the Mantenault sociocrat party a puppet of the U-Nats ? I provided evidence how this is certainly not the case, but where is yours ?
Marnian Veroe
National Republican Party
#60 - 2013-09-19 19:40:02 UTC
Pieter Tuulinen wrote:
Ailer Stane wrote:
I would humbly suggest that any involvement by another Federal entity, registered or not, be undertaken after the FIO has issued its report. Then said involvement be reviewed, in minimum, by the District Parliament should permission from the "elected" planetary government be granted.


Too late. Didn't you read? The Elusenians have 'boots on the ground' already.


Elusenian boots are not welcome on our soil.