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Eve Miners Guide to the New Order of Highsec (A.K.A. James 315 and his gang), Part 1
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embrel
BamBam Inc.
#41 - 2013-09-10 07:18:17 UTC
People demanding KM and questioning veracity of OP's claim could have just looked for the KM themselves. I did. It exists.
So, congratulations.
What I don't understand why his stabber has empty high-slots.
well, no guns needed for bumping I guess.
In other threads gankers are celebrated and here people try to find something.
She ganked Jimbo (I'm missing Starkiller's update regarding his PvP experiences with Jimbo)
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#42 - 2013-09-10 07:22:16 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
embrel wrote:
People demanding KM and questioning veracity of OP's claim could have just looked for the KM themselves. I did. It exists.
So, congratulations.
What I don't understand why his stabber has empty high-slots.
well, no guns needed for bumping I guess.
In other threads gankers are celebrated and here people try to find something.
She ganked Jimbo (I'm missing Starkiller's update regarding his PvP experiences with Jimbo)

Battleclinic Ugh, eve-kill and zKillboard show no losses for James in the last year or so.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
embrel
BamBam Inc.
#43 - 2013-09-10 07:24:46 UTC  |  Edited by: embrel
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
embrel wrote:
People demanding KM and questioning veracity of OP's claim could have just looked for the KM themselves. I did. It exists.
So, congratulations.
What I don't understand why his stabber has empty high-slots.
well, no guns needed for bumping I guess.
In other threads gankers are celebrated and here people try to find something.
She ganked Jimbo (I'm missing Starkiller's update regarding his PvP experiences with Jimbo)

Battleclinic Ugh, eve-kill and zKillboard show no losses for James in the last year or so.


ooops, shame on me!

the Killmail exists but was not an API mail and is dated 12/02/11 on battleclinic. my bad.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#44 - 2013-09-10 07:25:03 UTC
Benny Ohu wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
boomerang went on for years.

CCP cant do much in this case as concord is meant to stay on grid for a while. The issues comes when people start throwing ibis into the grinder to keep the concord spawn in place to act as bodyguards.

From what I saw, boomerang was declared an exploit and nerfed with the instant-web and 15-minute timer within days of CCP finding out about it?

I'm just a bit miffed that one exploit is ruled against, declared and mechanics implemented immediately to combat it, but another is ruled against, kept quiet and nothing happens

Also, I'm stil not entirely clear on this. Is pulling CONCORD onto grid for protection once an exploit?


What did boomerang in was that one guy abused it massively over the span of a few weeks which lead to a huge amount of outraged highsec pubbies flailing on the forums so CCP acted. It had been used since the days of M0o.
S Byerley
The Manhattan Engineer District
#45 - 2013-09-10 07:28:02 UTC  |  Edited by: S Byerley
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
S Byerley wrote:
Benny Ohu wrote:
Also, I'm stil not entirely clear on this. Is pulling CONCORD onto grid for protection once an exploit?


What motivation could a suicide ganker possibly have to convince you that a suicide ganking defense is an exploit?

What motivation could a suicide ganker possibly have to tell their victims how to protect themselves? Yet they do, on a regular basis, and have done so for some time.


Mostly ridicule, also a little bit of misdirection. The suggestions are always wildly impractical so it really doesn't hurt any. Pre-spawning Concord, in contrast, is very cost-effective and can be a significant nuisance.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#46 - 2013-09-10 07:28:54 UTC  |  Edited by: baltec1
S Byerley wrote:
Benny Ohu wrote:
Also, I'm stil not entirely clear on this. Is pulling CONCORD onto grid for protection once an exploit?


What motivation could a suicide ganker possibly have to convince you that a suicide ganking defense is an exploit?


Please use this tactic. We enjoy getting clueless miners banned as much as killing them.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#47 - 2013-09-10 07:34:22 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
embrel wrote:

ooops, shame on me!

the Killmail exists, but is dated 12/02/11 on battleclinic. my bad.

Not your fault, it's mine, I read the OP as being a recent event. Oops

That kill in 2011 is pre minerbumping afaik, it's definitely pre New Order.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#48 - 2013-09-10 07:36:41 UTC
S Byerley wrote:

Mostly ridicule, also a little bit of misdirection. The suggestions are always wildly impractical so it really doesn't hurt any. Pre-spawning Concord, in contrast, is very cost-effective and can be a significant nuisance.

So telling people how to tank their barges and exhumers, how to use the standings mechanism to highlight people who would do them harm, how to use the overview and to not AFK is ridicule and misdirection?

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
S Byerley
The Manhattan Engineer District
#49 - 2013-09-10 07:42:34 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
S Byerley wrote:

Mostly ridicule, also a little bit of misdirection. The suggestions are always wildly impractical so it really doesn't hurt any. Pre-spawning Concord, in contrast, is very cost-effective and can be a significant nuisance.

So telling people how to tank their barges and exhumers, how to use the standings mechanism to highlight people who would do them harm, how to use the overview and to not AFK is ridicule and misdirection?


Repeating wildly known and freely available information while goading someone to sit intently at their screen in highsec while they.... wait - yes, yes it is.
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#50 - 2013-09-10 07:42:46 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Please use this tactic. We enjoy getting clueless miners banned as much as killing them.


Oh come on baltec, don't say things like that... who would you turn your sociopathic affection (yea, that's a contradiction Blink) to, if all the "clueless miners" got banned!?

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#51 - 2013-09-10 07:46:57 UTC
Shalua Rui wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Please use this tactic. We enjoy getting clueless miners banned as much as killing them.


Oh come on baltec, don't say things like that... who would you turn your sociopathic affection (yea, that's a contradiction Blink) to, if all the "clueless miners" got banned!?


We have learned there is no end to silly miners.
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#52 - 2013-09-10 08:00:11 UTC
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
S Byerley wrote:

Mostly ridicule, also a little bit of misdirection. The suggestions are always wildly impractical so it really doesn't hurt any. Pre-spawning Concord, in contrast, is very cost-effective and can be a significant nuisance.

So telling people how to tank their barges and exhumers, how to use the standings mechanism to highlight people who would do them harm, how to use the overview and to not AFK is ridicule and misdirection?


Welcome to the high sec way of thinking. Where using an exploit that could get you banned is seen as a better option than fitting a tank in those empty mids.
Jennam Musana
Alternative Management Solutions
#53 - 2013-09-10 08:03:21 UTC
"He who fights with monsters should be careful lest he thereby become a monster. And if thou gaze long into an abyss, the abyss will also gaze into thee." -Some guy with a silly moustache Shocked
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#54 - 2013-09-10 08:04:01 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
S Byerley wrote:
Repeating wildly known and freely available information while goading someone to sit intently at their screen in highsec while they.... wait - yes, yes it is.

Yes it's widely known and freely available information, I never said it wasn't. Yet many people choose to ignore it, and then complain when their pixels explode.

I occasionally gank miners with an alt so I'm aware of how ganking works, and I've taken steps to minimise its impact on my mining character. It's called knowing your enemy.

I mine in a tanked mining barge, while at the keyboard. I use the standings mechanic to highlight known gankers and other nefarious types, I keep an eye on local etc. I'm not asking anybody to do anything I'm not prepared to do myself.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#55 - 2013-09-10 08:04:37 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
We have learned there is no end to silly miners.


As there is no end to risk averse pseudo PvPers that like to exploit them to give them self a questionable ego boost... so all's well. Blink

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
S Byerley
The Manhattan Engineer District
#56 - 2013-09-10 08:11:59 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Jonah Gravenstein wrote:
S Byerley wrote:

Mostly ridicule, also a little bit of misdirection. The suggestions are always wildly impractical so it really doesn't hurt any. Pre-spawning Concord, in contrast, is very cost-effective and can be a significant nuisance.

So telling people how to tank their barges and exhumers, how to use the standings mechanism to highlight people who would do them harm, how to use the overview and to not AFK is ridicule and misdirection?


Welcome to the high sec way of thinking. Where using an exploit that could get you banned is seen as a better option than fitting a tank in those empty mids.


How many people have you run into pre-spawning Concord but not tanking their ship?

This discussion is thoroughly ********; lest it be buried -

CCP Atropos wrote:
How does my reply differ from that you quoted?

The reasoning is that you're deliberately using free ships (noob frigates) and alts to bypass the risk and penalties incurred by angering CONCORD. The incurred penalties are ignored since there's no financial loss, and no meaningful security loss, since you would delete the character afterwards.

Of course, if you're willing to live with these penalties, and don't delete the offending character, then there's no problem, since it is working as intended (you lose your ship, become criminally flagged, and incur a security hit). Although no one will really like you since you're spawning CONCORD to cover your own money making schemes Cool

How about getting some players to help you mine in safety?


ie baltec is full of **** and can't support his claim whereas comments from CCP employees indicate that the activity is fine provided you don't delete characters.
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#57 - 2013-09-10 08:31:50 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
I'll just point out the differences between this thread in the old forums, and the Eve search archive of the very same thread where the pre-spawning of Concord for protection was discussed. The only difference, from what's been suggested here, being the OP was using a trial account to do the do.

Please note the posts edited by mods for discussing an exploit. In particular the very first post was redacted by CCP Navigator for outlining a method to facilitate the pre spawning of Concord using an alt, and then doing it again when Concord leave.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack
baltec1
Bat Country
Pandemic Horde
#58 - 2013-09-10 08:35:31 UTC
S Byerley wrote:


How many people have you run into pre-spawning Concord but not tanking their ship?


All of them so far.




S Byerley wrote:

ie baltec is full of **** and can't support his claim whereas comments from CCP employees indicate that the activity is fine provided you don't delete characters.


Lets see that quote in its context.

Because we have been told that it is a bannable offence and we have reported people for it who have been given warnings and bans.
Shalua Rui
Rui Freelance Mining
#59 - 2013-09-10 08:53:51 UTC
baltec1 wrote:
Welcome to the high sec way of thinking. Where using an exploit that could get you banned is seen as a better option than fitting a tank in those empty mids.


Nice generalization there...

"ginger forum goddess, space gypsy and stone nibbler extraordinaire!" Shalua Rui - CEO and founder of Rui Freelance Mining (RFLM)
Jonah Gravenstein
Machiavellian Space Bastards
#60 - 2013-09-10 08:57:26 UTC  |  Edited by: Jonah Gravenstein
Shalua Rui wrote:
baltec1 wrote:
Welcome to the high sec way of thinking. Where using an exploit that could get you banned is seen as a better option than fitting a tank in those empty mids.


Nice generalization there...

He has a point though Shalua, miners who fit a non cursory tank are few and far between. It's only the minority that fit more than a civilian/ small shield booster; most won't even fit a damage control, even though it can add around 30% to their EHP, because it uses a slot that can be used for an MLU.

In the beginning there was nothing, which exploded.

New Player FAQ

Feyd's Survival Pack