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Disappointed with the Domi - Lvl 4 PVE
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John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#1 - 2013-09-06 10:21:42 UTC
I have max sentry skills, so thought I'd leave my RNI in the Station and take a Domi out to run a Guristas mission. I was pretty disappointed with how poorly it performed. I was in a Fleet with a Corp mate who was also in a Domi with all drones assigned to me. The DPS was crap. Ten T2 sentries couldn't outperform a solo RNI.

The Domi fit I was using is:

[Dominix, PVE - T2]
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Drone Damage Amplifier II
Armor Thermic Hardener II
Armor Kinetic Hardener II
Large Armor Repairer II

Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
Omnidirectional Tracking Link II
100MN Afterburner II
Cap Recharger II

Drone Link Augmentor II
Drone Link Augmentor II
Drone Link Augmentor II
Small Shield Transporter II
Small Shield Transporter II
Small Shield Transporter II

Large Anti-Explosive Pump II
Large Capacitor Control Circuit II
Large Capacitor Control Circuit II


Garde II x5
Bouncer II x5


Other than the underwhelming DPS, it was 'OK', but I didn't experience anything that indicated the Domi to be a superior PVE platform. Having to recall drones is a PITA. The variable drone DPS is a PITA as well. Would you guys do the fit differently?

The RNI is still King. Although, I am a day away from Large Projectiles V on an alt, so I'll be able to compare it with a Maelstrom and Tempest FI.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Kasutra
No Vacancies
No Vacancies.
#2 - 2013-09-06 10:37:15 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
I was in a Fleet with a Corp mate who was also in a Domi with all drones assigned to me. The DPS was crap. Ten T2 sentries couldn't outperform a solo RNI.

Sounds like your positioning/coordination was off. All tracking-dependent weapon systems run into this to some degree, and you being new to deploying sentries (and not new to whooshing out missiles) messed with your results.
John Ratcliffe wrote:
I didn't experience anything that indicated the Domi to be a superior PVE platform.

It isn't. It's a cheap, safe, moderately efficient option for newish Gallente pilots who want to run anoms or L4s.
Caitlyn Tufy
Perkone
Caldari State
#3 - 2013-09-06 10:41:17 UTC
Quote:
It isn't. It's a cheap, safe, moderately efficient option for newish Gallente pilots who want to run anoms or L4s.


This. Besides, Domi is usually used with MJD, as Sentries need a bit of a distance before they can actually apply decent damage. The Domi's advantage is that it can apply Garde's dps at around 80 km with virtually no threat to itself. If you want better performance, other ships will do better, but with other disadvantages.

Side note, you'll find projectile guns total fail if you'll try them with Maelstrom or Fleet Tempest. Machariel trully is in a league of its own, whereas the Typhoon is far better as a missile boat.
Alticus C Bear
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#4 - 2013-09-06 11:15:27 UTC
You should have had something like 1600dps with 10 sentries, find it hard to understand how you had any problems.

As for the fit. Would probably swap cap recharger for micro jump drive and cap rigs for drone scope chips and ionic field projector for targeting range.
Morrigan LeSante
Perkone
Caldari State
#5 - 2013-09-06 11:26:16 UTC
Were the drones 'assisting' you? Because with no guns, they wont assist if you tell drones to engage alone, you have to fire a weapon.

You dont want a 'Pest , You want a 'phoon [of the fleet pedigree] and have the fortitude to trade tank for absolutely ridiculous gank.
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#6 - 2013-09-06 12:10:07 UTC
Morrigan LeSante wrote:
Were the drones 'assisting' you? Because with no guns, they wont assist if you tell drones to engage alone, you have to fire a weapon.

You dont want a 'Pest , You want a 'phoon [of the fleet pedigree] and have the fortitude to trade tank for absolutely ridiculous gank.


I changed one of the Shield Transports to a Blaster. They were assisting. I'll look at the Typhoon.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#7 - 2013-09-06 12:15:00 UTC
Alticus C Bear wrote:
You should have had something like 1600dps with 10 sentries, find it hard to understand how you had any problems.


I didn't have problems, it's just that the rate at which the NPCs were dispatched compared to the RNI was disappointing. I thought 10 Sentries with 1600 DPS would own.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#8 - 2013-09-06 12:34:28 UTC  |  Edited by: Onictus
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Alticus C Bear wrote:
You should have had something like 1600dps with 10 sentries, find it hard to understand how you had any problems.


I didn't have problems, it's just that the rate at which the NPCs were dispatched compared to the RNI was disappointing. I thought 10 Sentries with 1600 DPS would own.



......am I the only one that wants to see this RNI fit?

and what are your drone/ship skills like, because two domi mow through rats faster than a sentry carrier

I usually end up breaking assist because I can barely target fast enough.
D35
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
#9 - 2013-09-06 12:43:20 UTC
Clearly you had problems, even though you're trying to say you didn't.

1600dps with max drone damage projection skills and 3 omni II's shreds through big guristas ships like butter. Are you saying this is not enough DPS? That's why you were disappointed? You are comparing a faction battleship to a regular battleship aswell.


"Dominix is not as good for level 4 missions as RNI, better go to the forums and make a thread about it."
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#10 - 2013-09-06 12:52:59 UTC  |  Edited by: John Ratcliffe
D35 wrote:
You are comparing a faction battleship to a regular battleship as well.


What Tier the ship is is irrelevant. DPS and application is all that matters. On paper, the Domi should at least hold it's own, but doesn't.

D35 wrote:
"Dominix is not as good for level 4 missions as RNI, better go to the forums and make a thread about it."


Was that really necessary? There's no need to be a douche just because that's what other forum members do Roll

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#11 - 2013-09-06 12:55:58 UTC
Onictus wrote:
......am I the only one that wants to see this RNI fit?

and what are your drone/ship skills like, because two domi mow through rats faster than a sentry carrier

I usually end up breaking assist because I can barely target fast enough.


My RNI fit has been posted a number of times - search for it if you want to see it.

Drone skills are great. Sentry V, all support skills at V except Interfacing at IV.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#12 - 2013-09-06 14:06:46 UTC  |  Edited by: Cipher Jones
So you're comparing a Navy issue ship to a t1 ship missing weapons and seriously asking why its lackluster?

Go out and fly 2 Ravens with no drones and remote reps, see what the DPS is like.

Quote:
What Tier the ship is is irrelevant. DPS and application is all that matters. On paper, the Domi should at least hold it's own, but doesn't.


Clearly, your results are not typical. And tier is completely relevant. When Ship X with less total slots and less bonuses out preforms ship Y with more, it is obviously imbalanced.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#13 - 2013-09-06 14:14:13 UTC
Cipher Jones wrote:
So you're comparing a Navy issue ship to a t1 ship missing weapons and seriously asking why its lackluster?

Go out and fly 2 Ravens with no drones and remote reps, see what the DPS is like.


No. Not in a strict comparison sense. This thread wasn't 'The Domi sucks and the Raven rules', it was 'I have used an RNI for the last 2 years, the Domi looks great on paper, but the reality is underwhelming'.

Two RNIs would be completely OP. If I could have one assist the other on one PC then you'd never need anything else.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#14 - 2013-09-06 14:14:19 UTC  |  Edited by: Onictus
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Onictus wrote:
......am I the only one that wants to see this RNI fit?

and what are your drone/ship skills like, because two domi mow through rats faster than a sentry carrier

I usually end up breaking assist because I can barely target fast enough.


My RNI fit has been posted a number of times - search for it if you want to see it.

Drone skills are great. Sentry V, all support skills at V except Interfacing at IV.


Interfacing!

You are down 20% unstacked damage right there. Now run that through all of the DDAs and the ship bonus and I'm willing to bet you are off 45% percent damage overall, you have a trumped up Vexor.
Cipher Jones
The Thomas Edwards Taco Tuesday All Stars
#15 - 2013-09-06 14:20:57 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Cipher Jones wrote:
So you're comparing a Navy issue ship to a t1 ship missing weapons and seriously asking why its lackluster?

Go out and fly 2 Ravens with no drones and remote reps, see what the DPS is like.


No. Not in a strict comparison sense. This thread wasn't 'The Domi sucks and the Raven rules', it was 'I have used an RNI for the last 2 years, the Domi looks great on paper, but the reality is underwhelming'.

Two RNIs would be completely OP. If I could have one assist the other on one PC then you'd never need anything else.


Well what I am saying is try the Domi with as much SP in gunnery as you have in missiles, load it out for solo missions and then compare it to the RNI after you practice a bit. It will be just as good and You'll see how OP it still is.

internet spaceships

are serious business sir.

and don't forget it
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#16 - 2013-09-06 14:35:39 UTC
Onictus wrote:

Interfacing!

You are down 20% unstacked damage right there. Now run that through all of the DDAs and the ship bonus and I'm willing to bet you are off 45% percent damage overall, you have a trumped up Vexor.


According tp EFT it's the difference between 800 DPS and 675 DPS. So nothing like 45%, but I accept it's not insignificant.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
John Ratcliffe
Tradors'R'us
IChooseYou Alliance
#17 - 2013-09-06 14:36:24 UTC
Cipher Jones wrote:
Well what I am saying is try the Domi with as much SP in gunnery as you have in missiles, load it out for solo missions and then compare it to the RNI after you practice a bit. It will be just as good and You'll see how OP it still is.


OK. It'll take a while before I can use Large Rails, but I'll give it a go.

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose
Onictus
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
#18 - 2013-09-06 14:37:24 UTC  |  Edited by: Onictus
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Onictus wrote:

Interfacing!

You are down 20% unstacked damage right there. Now run that through all of the DDAs and the ship bonus and I'm willing to bet you are off 45% percent damage overall, you have a trumped up Vexor.


According tp EFT it's the difference between 800 DPS and 675 DPS. So nothing like 45%, but I accept it's not insignificant.


Tried to simulate that...and teh program crashed.

....and rails have no place on a sentry Domi, if you want to do guns you pretty much must have the navy, and then you have to shield tank it.

Either way, dominix takes down rats faster than pretty much everything that I've ever flown that isn't a machariel and there isn't a fraction of the travel time.

That being said this toons's missile skills aren't that great (as in I can't even fit a cruise launcher) and the toons I have that can don't have caldari BS at any meaningful level so I can't compare them.
Alticus C Bear
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#19 - 2013-09-06 14:43:11 UTC
Onictus wrote:
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Onictus wrote:
......am I the only one that wants to see this RNI fit?

and what are your drone/ship skills like, because two domi mow through rats faster than a sentry carrier

I usually end up breaking assist because I can barely target fast enough.


My RNI fit has been posted a number of times - search for it if you want to see it.

Drone skills are great. Sentry V, all support skills at V except Interfacing at IV.


Interfacing!

You are down 20% unstacked damage right there. Now run that through all of the DDAs and the ship bonus and I'm willing to bet you are off 45% percent damage overall, you have a trumped up Vexor.

This. Also what level are your friends skills?

Cruise faction BCU RNI pushes out around 1000dps. Mission wise I would feel the Domi would be competitive when you are engaging a mix of ship sizes.

If you are serious about the Domi then train the skill and faction omni's are worthwhile.
Alberik
Eusebius Corporation
#20 - 2013-09-06 17:40:19 UTC
John Ratcliffe wrote:
Onictus wrote:

Interfacing!

You are down 20% unstacked damage right there. Now run that through all of the DDAs and the ship bonus and I'm willing to bet you are off 45% percent damage overall, you have a trumped up Vexor.


According tp EFT it's the difference between 800 DPS and 675 DPS. So nothing like 45%, but I accept it's not insignificant.


strange as (1+ 4 * 0.2)*a*b*c will always be 10% smaller than (1 + 5 * 0.2)*a*b*c with no difference at all how large a, b and c are .....
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