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"How can we get more people into nullsec?"
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MeestaPenni
Mercantile and Stuff
#61 - 2011-11-13 23:03:20 UTC
Akirei Scytale wrote:

you check intelligence reports, communicate with allies, and take it slow and safe. or just ask a friend. but you specified single player, as though EVE was some sort of single player game where everything was intended to do solo.


Back the truck up Akirel....many residents of high-sec are like, "wut?", if you mention "intelligence reports." It's like, "is that a skillbook?" Are you seriously assuming some schlub from Aunia is on the up and up with intel reports.

"Communicate with allies"....you mean the other hundreds of members in the NPC corp blundering around high-sec?

There's a huge proportion of the EvE population that does not read the forums....now, take that same single schlub from Aunia, happily churning out lvl 4 missions....and tell me how he gets a battleship out to null sec.

I'm going to go ahead and guess that you can't even imagine that scenario. But I guarantee you....it happens every day. And every day another high sec dweller says, "screw that."

I am not Prencleeve Grothsmore.
Comrade Commizzar
Eve Revolutionary Army
#62 - 2011-11-13 23:06:23 UTC
Personally the best idea I have seen yet proposed to increase both new participants in zero and increased subscriptions to Eve was here >>>

https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=33108&find=unread

Sounds like a real enema for a system that is "backed up".
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#63 - 2011-11-13 23:09:46 UTC
MeestaPenni wrote:
Akirei Scytale wrote:

you check intelligence reports, communicate with allies, and take it slow and safe. or just ask a friend. but you specified single player, as though EVE was some sort of single player game where everything was intended to do solo.


Back the truck up Akirel....many residents of high-sec are like, "wut?", if you mention "intelligence reports." It's like, "is that a skillbook?" Are you seriously assuming some schlub from Aunia is on the up and up with intel reports.

"Communicate with allies"....you mean the other hundreds of members in the NPC corp blundering around high-sec?

There's a huge proportion of the EvE population that does not read the forums....now, take that same single schlub from Aunia, happily churning out lvl 4 missions....and tell me how he gets a battleship out to null sec.

I'm going to go ahead and guess that you can't even imagine that scenario. But I guarantee you....it happens every day. And every day another high sec dweller says, "screw that."


the real question is, why would said lvl 4 mission runner want to fly a giant target incapable of fighting off 90% of the threats that live in nullsec deep into hostile space, without signing up with a friendly alliance already out there?

first mistake is being a part of an NPC corp. second mistake is trying to take a freaking BS into null.

you know what my first experiences in nullsec were, as a complete newbie years ago? flying a freaking rifter and having locals chase me across entire regions. that was absurdly fun, and i had no ******* clue what i was doing. so don't assume everyone interested in nullsec is the kind of idiot who would try to roam solo in a battleship.
Psychophantic
#64 - 2011-11-13 23:10:22 UTC
I'd rather stay on the other side of the fence than the circle jerking, pubbie pwnin, hardcore blob pvp leetoids.
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#65 - 2011-11-13 23:28:16 UTC
Comrade Commizzar wrote:
Akirei Scytale wrote:
Elrich Kouvo wrote:

So do you support this point of view? It is okay if you do, because it sounds like you believe the guy with the most friends should dominate nullsec, which is okay, but it wont get more people in nullsec.


it is not a matter of supporting or disagreeing with a "view" - it is reality. when 1000 people want one thing, and 15 want another, 1000 will win. end of story. and the guy with the most friends is the guy who will dominate a conflict, whether you're talking politics, a minor disagreement, a video game, whatever.

you can hate it all you want - but we are social creatures who managed to reach the top of the food chain because of one thing and one thing only - we work together better than any animal on earth. we "blobbed" every threat to our survival out of the picture. but please, go on arguing against logic, common sense, and reality.

***************

This statement is patently false on it's face. If it were so Red China would have ruled the world long ago.
The point that the others are attempting to convey is the importance of balanced game mechanics and how they influence player behavior and participation.


China is far more influential than any western nation in Asia, which has more than half the world's population. So it kinda does? And its on its way to dominate the rest of it. Also, if you analyze why nations like England got to be such a big deal, you merely add more support to the reasons that nullsec alliances maintain superiority - infrastructure, income, organization, etc.

Second, in what ****** up universe is 15 people having a shot at defeating 1000 balanced? it isn't. I don't think you have a concept of how many people are in those "blobs" you hate so much. People with an equal right to do as they please as you. Except 1000 of them decided that what they pleased was to kill you, and you want your opinion, as the extreme minority, to be the decider. what.
Comrade Commizzar
Eve Revolutionary Army
#66 - 2011-11-13 23:36:02 UTC
Akirei Scytale wrote:
Comrade Commizzar wrote:


I see... so YOU don't actually DO ANYTHING but tag along like a little puppy and "sit" or "speak" when you are TOLD to.
Yep, really "Leet" there Chief. I am in awe.


If you really believe what you just said, then you have never been to nullsec.

99% of what you do in nullsec is your initiative and your decision.

And if you couldn't detect how tongue-in-cheek that post was... then what can I say?

****************

Oh I've been to Zero many times with my Main, enough to recognize a "tag along" killmail e-peen when I see one.
Don't be offended. That is what you signed up for when you joined TEST or the GOONS or any other zero "Meat Puppet Machine".
As for your earlier comment about your Alliance finances being "transparent"... I just have to laugh when I hear poor pilots as ignorant of revenue streams as you apparently are. The "books" you are looking at are carefully fabricated to keep the "help" happy with their perceived share. You would be shocked if you saw the real numbers and where it went.

If you really want to fix the game... fix Corporation features to make Corporate revenue sharing a feature of the game that is performed by settings that Corporate members can see. This could be done thru actual "wages" or by fixing the broken stock share system in such a way that any positive Corporate eanings are paid out periodically to the members by game system according to settings that the Corporate management must acknowledge and can't unilaterally change without agreement by the troops. Take the distribution of Corporate revenues out of the arbitrary hands of the leadership and then you will find more wanting to participate. As it is now you are just at the whim of the guy handing out the gravy, with no way of knowing your share of the real benefits.
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#67 - 2011-11-13 23:41:10 UTC
Comrade Commizzar wrote:


Oh I've been to Zero many times with my Main, enough to recognize a "tag along" killmail e-peen when I see one.
Don't be offended. That is what you signed up for when you joined TEST or the GOONS or any other zero "Meat Puppet Machine".
As for your earlier comment about your Alliance finances being "transparent"... I just have to laugh when I hear poor pilots as ignorant of revenue streams as you apparently are. The "books" you are looking at are carefully fabricated to keep the "help" happy with their perceived share. You would be shocked if you saw the real numbers and where it went.

If you really want to fix the game... fix Corporation features to make Corporate revenue sharing a feature of the game that is performed by settings that Corporate members can see. This could be done thru actual "wages" or by fixing the broken stock share system in such a way that any positive Corporate eanings are paid out periodically to the members by game system according to settings that the Corporate management must acknowledge and can't unilaterally change without agreement by the troops. Take the distribution of Corporate revenues out of the arbitrary hands of the leadership and then you will find more wanting to participate. As it is now you are just at the whim of the guy handing out the gravy, with no way of knowing your share of the real benefits.


visiting 0.0 a few times =/= living there full time - you don't learn ****, as is apparent by the hilariously misinformed blathering that followed that claim.

I could find out that TEST and Goon leadership were embezzling billions of ISK, and honestly, I wouldn't give two *****, because they still dump billions of ISK every week into paying for losses, creating fun things to do, hilarious projects, etc. The CFC is very member-centric.
Comrade Commizzar
Eve Revolutionary Army
#68 - 2011-11-13 23:43:13 UTC
Akirei Scytale wrote:
Comrade Commizzar wrote:
Akirei Scytale wrote:
Elrich Kouvo wrote:

So do you support this point of view? It is okay if you do, because it sounds like you believe the guy with the most friends should dominate nullsec, which is okay, but it wont get more people in nullsec.


it is not a matter of supporting or disagreeing with a "view" - it is reality. when 1000 people want one thing, and 15 want another, 1000 will win. end of story. and the guy with the most friends is the guy who will dominate a conflict, whether you're talking politics, a minor disagreement, a video game, whatever.

you can hate it all you want - but we are social creatures who managed to reach the top of the food chain because of one thing and one thing only - we work together better than any animal on earth. we "blobbed" every threat to our survival out of the picture. but please, go on arguing against logic, common sense, and reality.

***************

This statement is patently false on it's face. If it were so Red China would have ruled the world long ago.
The point that the others are attempting to convey is the importance of balanced game mechanics and how they influence player behavior and participation.


China is far more influential than any western nation in Asia, which has more than half the world's population. So it kinda does? And its on its way to dominate the rest of it. Also, if you analyze why nations like England got to be such a big deal, you merely add more support to the reasons that nullsec alliances maintain superiority - infrastructure, income, organization, etc.

Second, in what ****** up universe is 15 people having a shot at defeating 1000 balanced? it isn't. I don't think you have a concept of how many people are in those "blobs" you hate so much. People with an equal right to do as they please as you. Except 1000 of them decided that what they pleased was to kill you, and you want your opinion, as the extreme minority, to be the decider. what.

*****************

I never suggested that 15 should defeat 1000. I suggested that thousands in highsec had no interest in becoming the slaves serving the isk interests of 15 guys in zero who control the weak minded in zero, like yourself.
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#69 - 2011-11-13 23:45:34 UTC
Comrade Commizzar wrote:

I never suggested that 15 should defeat 1000. I suggested that thousands in highsec had no interest in becoming the slaves serving the isk interests of 15 guys in zero who control the weak minded in zero, like yourself.


it is quite clear you simply have no idea what you are talking about. good day, sir, and good luck with your nova bombs. lol.
Andski
Science and Trade Institute
Caldari State
#70 - 2011-11-13 23:46:56 UTC
Comrade Commizzar wrote:
words


Andski wrote:
Hi, I'm part of the largest non-renter nullsec alliance. We have a comprehensive ship reimbursement program that covers all PvP losses in regions of strategic interest, and a fleet reimbursement program that covers losses of fleet doctrine ships in full. We also subsidize and reimburse capital and supercapital ships, pay out bounties to our members who suicide gank mining barges as part of our Gallente ice interdiction program and, in general, spend as much of the alliance's money on our members as we can within reason. We don't want our members to be forced endure the misery that is PvE.

Please tell me more about all of our moon mineral income going to our directorate.


Twitter: @EVEAndski

"It's easy to speak for the silent majority. They rarely object to what you put into their mouths."    - Abrazzar
Comrade Commizzar
Eve Revolutionary Army
#71 - 2011-11-13 23:48:28 UTC
Akirei Scytale wrote:
Comrade Commizzar wrote:


Oh I've been to Zero many times with my Main, enough to recognize a "tag along" killmail e-peen when I see one.
Don't be offended. That is what you signed up for when you joined TEST or the GOONS or any other zero "Meat Puppet Machine".
As for your earlier comment about your Alliance finances being "transparent"... I just have to laugh when I hear poor pilots as ignorant of revenue streams as you apparently are. The "books" you are looking at are carefully fabricated to keep the "help" happy with their perceived share. You would be shocked if you saw the real numbers and where it went.

If you really want to fix the game... fix Corporation features to make Corporate revenue sharing a feature of the game that is performed by settings that Corporate members can see. This could be done thru actual "wages" or by fixing the broken stock share system in such a way that any positive Corporate eanings are paid out periodically to the members by game system according to settings that the Corporate management must acknowledge and can't unilaterally change without agreement by the troops. Take the distribution of Corporate revenues out of the arbitrary hands of the leadership and then you will find more wanting to participate. As it is now you are just at the whim of the guy handing out the gravy, with no way of knowing your share of the real benefits.


visiting 0.0 a few times =/= living there full time - you don't learn ****, as is apparent by the hilariously misinformed blathering that followed that claim.

I could find out that TEST and Goon leadership were embezzling billions of ISK, and honestly, I wouldn't give two *****, because they still dump billions of ISK every week into paying for losses, creating fun things to do, hilarious projects, etc. The CFC is very member-centric.

**********
Of course you wouldn't care that you are a serf in an isk farm... that's obvious, since you are there.
Sebastian N Cain
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
#72 - 2011-11-13 23:50:41 UTC
1. Beer
2. Pinup Girls
3. Free Beer
4. Boobs

... and somehow i get the impression that i am a quite single minded person....Cool

I got lost in thought... it was unfamiliar territory.
Nariya Kentaya
Ministry of War
Amarr Empire
#73 - 2011-11-13 23:54:55 UTC
MeestaPenni wrote:
Akirei Scytale wrote:

you check intelligence reports, communicate with allies, and take it slow and safe. or just ask a friend. but you specified single player, as though EVE was some sort of single player game where everything was intended to do solo.


Back the truck up Akirel....many residents of high-sec are like, "wut?", if you mention "intelligence reports." It's like, "is that a skillbook?" Are you seriously assuming some schlub from Aunia is on the up and up with intel reports.

"Communicate with allies"....you mean the other hundreds of members in the NPC corp blundering around high-sec?

There's a huge proportion of the EvE population that does not read the forums....now, take that same single schlub from Aunia, happily churning out lvl 4 missions....and tell me how he gets a battleship out to null sec.

I'm going to go ahead and guess that you can't even imagine that scenario. But I guarantee you....it happens every day. And every day another high sec dweller says, "screw that."

honestly, my corp goes from high-sec to null-sec for roams all the time, heck, sev3rance is fun as hell to harass. so much as a neut enters systema dn they all start freaking out, or if your bored you can always get a covops and go watch a cascade and TEST fleet blow the crap out of eachother, and loot some nice T2 modules off a dead cascade or 2.

honestly, null-sec alliances dont ahve this amazing amount of "manpower" you describe, there are DOZENS of high-low-null sonnections in regions so under-utilized there is rarely if ever patrols keeping people out, for example, the region Devoid. barely anyone ever in that low-sec, and even rarer to find anyone in the null-sec connecting systems, no gatecamps, no "mega blobs" just a sev3rance miner or 2 waiting to get his face blown off whoever wanders in.

i think basically what im trying to say is, have a buddy in a frigate fly thorugh on some SCOUTING MISSIONS, and check around to see about system activity, chances are there are several null-sec systems in a constellation near you that have been almost forgotten about by the null-sec entities. The reason why most "high sec" players dotn go to null is that it requires EFFORT, thats the big thing about high sec players, they arent necessarily RISK ADVERSE, but rather WORK ADVERSE.
Comrade Commizzar
Eve Revolutionary Army
#74 - 2011-11-13 23:55:15 UTC
Andski wrote:
Comrade Commizzar wrote:
words


Andski wrote:
Hi, I'm part of the largest non-renter nullsec alliance. We have a comprehensive ship reimbursement program that covers all PvP losses in regions of strategic interest, and a fleet reimbursement program that covers losses of fleet doctrine ships in full. We also subsidize and reimburse capital and supercapital ships, pay out bounties to our members who suicide gank mining barges as part of our Gallente ice interdiction program and, in general, spend as much of the alliance's money on our members as we can within reason. We don't want our members to be forced endure the misery that is PvE.

Please tell me more about all of our moon mineral income going to our directorate.



**************

Hi ! I'm the Mittanni and I am a river of benefits to my slav.. er, uh people !
Trust me! No .. Really.. Trust me! I mean no Goon ever scammed anyone... ever.. well .. almost never....
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#75 - 2011-11-13 23:56:42 UTC
Comrade Commizzar wrote:


Hi ! I'm the Mittanni and I am a river of benefits to my slav.. er, uh people !
Trust me! No .. Really.. Trust me! I mean no Goon ever scammed anyone... ever.. well .. almost never....


except those benefits? they actually happen.
Comrade Commizzar
Eve Revolutionary Army
#76 - 2011-11-14 00:00:32 UTC
Akirei Scytale wrote:
Comrade Commizzar wrote:


Hi ! I'm the Mittanni and I am a river of benefits to my slav.. er, uh people !
Trust me! No .. Really.. Trust me! I mean no Goon ever scammed anyone... ever.. well .. almost never....


except those benefits? they actually happen.

************

Cents on the dollar mate.
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#77 - 2011-11-14 00:01:33 UTC
Comrade Commizzar wrote:
Akirei Scytale wrote:
Comrade Commizzar wrote:


Hi ! I'm the Mittanni and I am a river of benefits to my slav.. er, uh people !
Trust me! No .. Really.. Trust me! I mean no Goon ever scammed anyone... ever.. well .. almost never....


except those benefits? they actually happen.

************

Cents on the dollar mate.


yes, free supercaps are cents on the dollar.
fracking moron.
Grarr Dexx
Now Look What You've Made Me Do
#78 - 2011-11-14 00:03:17 UTC
poor testies so easily trolled
Akirei Scytale
Okami Syndicate
#79 - 2011-11-14 00:07:39 UTC  |  Edited by: Akirei Scytale
Grarr Dexx wrote:
poor testies so easily trolled


welcome to the internet, home of Poe's Law.

Except this guy was the same moron who suggested this, so all signs point to mouthbreather, considering his terrible attempts to self-upvote and disguise himself while retaining precisely the same writing style, down to those stars after every quote.
Elrich Kouvo
Doomheim
#80 - 2011-11-14 00:09:10 UTC
Nariya Kentaya wrote:
MeestaPenni wrote:
Akirei Scytale wrote:

you check intelligence reports, communicate with allies, and take it slow and safe. or just ask a friend. but you specified single player, as though EVE was some sort of single player game where everything was intended to do solo.


Back the truck up Akirel....many residents of high-sec are like, "wut?", if you mention "intelligence reports." It's like, "is that a skillbook?" Are you seriously assuming some schlub from Aunia is on the up and up with intel reports.

"Communicate with allies"....you mean the other hundreds of members in the NPC corp blundering around high-sec?

There's a huge proportion of the EvE population that does not read the forums....now, take that same single schlub from Aunia, happily churning out lvl 4 missions....and tell me how he gets a battleship out to null sec.

I'm going to go ahead and guess that you can't even imagine that scenario. But I guarantee you....it happens every day. And every day another high sec dweller says, "screw that."

honestly, my corp goes from high-sec to null-sec for roams all the time, heck, sev3rance is fun as hell to harass. so much as a neut enters systema dn they all start freaking out, or if your bored you can always get a covops and go watch a cascade and TEST fleet blow the crap out of eachother, and loot some nice T2 modules off a dead cascade or 2.

honestly, null-sec alliances dont ahve this amazing amount of "manpower" you describe, there are DOZENS of high-low-null sonnections in regions so under-utilized there is rarely if ever patrols keeping people out, for example, the region Devoid. barely anyone ever in that low-sec, and even rarer to find anyone in the null-sec connecting systems, no gatecamps, no "mega blobs" just a sev3rance miner or 2 waiting to get his face blown off whoever wanders in.

i think basically what im trying to say is, have a buddy in a frigate fly thorugh on some SCOUTING MISSIONS, and check around to see about system activity, chances are there are several null-sec systems in a constellation near you that have been almost forgotten about by the null-sec entities. The reason why most "high sec" players dotn go to null is that it requires EFFORT, thats the big thing about high sec players, they arent necessarily RISK ADVERSE, but rather WORK ADVERSE.

Yeah that sounds tedious. As you know for everynight you catch that one miner there are serveral nights that you come up empty.