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What is wrong with wormhole space?

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jonnykefka
Adhocracy Incorporated
Adhocracy
#261 - 2013-08-28 12:31:16 UTC
Apologies for not reading the entire thread, but I'm posting in a bit of a rush.

Here's the one that I really care about and want to emphasize, followed by a list of others that I think are important:

1. Lore stagnation. The attraction of W-space was its mystery, the feeling of jumping into the unknown. This has largely been lost. While some aspects of this can't be recovered (we know how WH mass works, for example), at a minimum the mysteries in the lore could be reopened. W-space during Arek'Jaalan was a lively, curious, lore-involved place. Given a mystery to unravel, and ideally some new PvE content to go with it, W-space could draw in new players and provide exciting new content for us bittervets.

Other stuff:

2. T3 sub changes at POSes, and the lack thereof. Enough has been said about why this is important already, just adding my voice to the clamor.

3. POSes in general. Enough has been said about why this is important already as well.

4. Aged aesthetics. WH nebulae, some sites, POSes haven't received any art team work since they came out in '09. The effect on gameplay is negligible, but there was a time when w-space was the most beautiful part of the universe. It could be again. Because they don't need the spatially conscious nebulae of k-space (though it would be cool) a quick redo with non-crap textures would be sufficient for nebulae at least.

5. PvE has become predictable. Sleepers used to be the most terrifying NPCs in the game, and that made PvE engaging. Throwing a few wrenches in our site-running routines would certainly liven things up, again making W-space a more engaging place for bittervets and new converts alike.
Cylin Rath
#262 - 2013-08-28 17:55:11 UTC
Winthorp wrote:
Cylin Rath wrote:
Problem:

With a small percentage of the player base transversing wormhole space, it is extremely time intensive to find other active players to interact with. I think it would be great to have more tools available to detect and track the movement of ships within wormhole chains. Enabling more ways to track could bring players together more quickly. Any solution should also maintain the tactics of stealth particular to w-space.

Proposed Solution:

Make it possible for scouts to examine/scan a wormhole for evidence of ships that have passed through it. These “tracks” would fade over time becoming harder to detect, or the results detected have a greater chance of being inaccurate. The wormhole scanner could be a mid slot module that is affected by a skill. The higher the skill level the greater accuracy of scans. It would work something like:

Scout jumps through an unexplored wormhole and scans out the system. He finds a few wormholes. After warping to the hole he de-cloaks, locks the wormhole, and activates his hole scanner.

The results would not have to be text, cool multicolor visual effects showing up on the wormhole would be sweet, but the scan output would give the scout info such as:

“A single small ship has has transversed this wormhole very recently.”

The output would stack and vary based on approximate ship quantity, size, and time since passing through.

“A single small ship has has transversed this wormhole very recently.”
“A few mid-sized ships have transversed this wormhole within the past hour.”
“A large ship traversed this wormhole many hours ago.”

As time passes the scans could become more inaccurate based on the age of the ship tracks, pilot skill level, random environmental effects etc.

Possible Result:

The addition of a system like this could help provide players with more information while exploring, reward good decision making, and bring players together faster for potential interactions.


Ahh back to the days of pullable jump data. I am not sure it's possible now i though that was yet another thing they broke as a consequence of introducing something else in the game and they couldn't be assed to fix it for the insignificant people of WH space.

I actually do like your idea it is well thought out, but well CCP will make it into some stupid minigame that you need LVL V skills to do sanely and not want to shoot yourself in the face after doing it twice....


I definitely think a system like this should not provide information outside the game client via the API etc.
Jonnie Concrete
You're Doing It Wrong
#263 - 2013-09-01 19:58:05 UTC
whats with the new circuit board lottery that is the hacking mini game.

just feels completely out of place in the context of this MMO and is an utterly soul destroying pursuit.
Jonnie Concrete
You're Doing It Wrong
#264 - 2013-09-01 21:02:21 UTC
as a follow on from my previous post...

I've just finished shooting all the sleepers in a relic site, before moving onto this new mini "game" for hacking the cans.

Considering I am a fee paying customer, I find it hard not to resent having to endure what feels like a game that would be better placed in a PoW camp as a way of extracting information from prisoners. Just make them play it for an hour and they will tell you anything to stop having to search for that fcking red arrow.

God.
DrBmN
Lippstadt Creed
Solyaris Chtonium
#265 - 2013-09-01 22:19:32 UTC
- New system scanner mechanics took the fun out of whs
- Redo POSes
- Add nebulas to whs (we deserve them)
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#266 - 2013-09-01 22:51:09 UTC
WHs are the only place (as far as i know) that still have rats at the data/relic sites, yet they also have the awful new minigame.
needs to be fixed one way or the other; either remove the rats or remove the minigame.

having both is inconsistent and annoys everyone since people who like the minigame dont want to have to shoot the sleepers and the people who want to shoot the sleepers dont want the do the mini game.

(personally i would prefer the minigame go since it really is awful.)

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Riel Saigo
Facta.Non.Verba
#267 - 2013-09-01 23:31:14 UTC
The minigame is fine - it gives PvPers more time to gank explorers. That's a good thing.

But the flying loot cans is pretty stupid.
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#268 - 2013-09-02 04:25:17 UTC
Riel Saigo wrote:
The minigame is fine - it gives PvPers more time to gank explorers. That's a good thing.
But the flying loot cans is pretty stupid.

You missed my point.
I dont care about the minigame one way or the other but the inconsistency of having rats at WH data/relic sites while theyre nowhere else is, well, inconsistent.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
Johnson 1044
Johnson Organic Produce
#269 - 2013-09-02 05:12:35 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Riel Saigo wrote:
The minigame is fine - it gives PvPers more time to gank explorers. That's a good thing.
But the flying loot cans is pretty stupid.

You missed my point.
I dont care about the minigame one way or the other but the inconsistency of having rats at WH data/relic sites while theyre nowhere else is, well, inconsistent.



Sadly exploration as a whole has been really screwed up by this "exploration" expansion. Ironic.
Johnson 1044
Johnson Organic Produce
#270 - 2013-09-02 05:19:26 UTC
What's wrong with WH space is the same thing that is wrong with all PVE in eve: it's completely scripted and predictable.
Ya Huei
Imperial Collective
#271 - 2013-09-02 12:10:19 UTC
Riel Saigo wrote:
The minigame is fine - it gives PvPers more time to gank explorers. That's a good thing.

But the flying loot cans is pretty stupid.



Ye because shooting at T1 frigates is totally worth my time.
Mr Kidd
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
#272 - 2013-09-02 14:35:36 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Riel Saigo wrote:
The minigame is fine - it gives PvPers more time to gank explorers. That's a good thing.
But the flying loot cans is pretty stupid.

You missed my point.
I dont care about the minigame one way or the other but the inconsistency of having rats at WH data/relic sites while theyre nowhere else is, well, inconsistent.



Yeah, the sleepers need to be removed in lower end w-space. A majority of the loot to be had from data sites has largely been de-valued by overlap from k-space which anyone can access. The market has been flooded with these items. But, in w-space our players have to spend time to clear these sites. It's a big FU from CCP.

Don't ban me, bro!
Riel Saigo
Facta.Non.Verba
#273 - 2013-09-02 14:50:03 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
Riel Saigo wrote:
The minigame is fine - it gives PvPers more time to gank explorers. That's a good thing.
But the flying loot cans is pretty stupid.

You missed my point.
I dont care about the minigame one way or the other but the inconsistency of having rats at WH data/relic sites while theyre nowhere else is, well, inconsistent.



I didn't miss it, I just responded to only part of it. Your idea about removing the game from Sleeper sites sounds reasonable.
Dring Dingle
Viziam
Amarr Empire
#274 - 2013-09-02 16:04:51 UTC
Things I believe will make wh space cooler/better.

- More backstory / lore development. Where did sleepers come from who built them, are they coming back...? O_o

- fix pos's (duh)

- fix t3 fitting (duh)

- high level spawns occurring in lower level wormholes maybe a 1 or 2 level jump i.e. a c3 could get a c5 anom (very rarely) it will encourage people to effectively try out harder wormholes in the 'safety' of their own

- Sleeper home systems... Might tie into my first point. But a connection to systems that have no moons, where sleepers run rampant. - camp wormholes (like gate rats) you can never set up a pos in system, but the sheer number of sleepers/sites will encourage people to day trip / live out of ships, (and orcas ???? >:D) for periods of time. These systems can also be levelled like the wormhole systems currently are.

- FOR THE LOVE OF GOD... Just give the radar / mag sites the chance of dropping some cool 'treasure' even if its books / lore items that might come in handy some time (a sleeper acceleration gate key for the nifty sleeper systems I suggested maybe ??? Blink) or even a book that just proves a cool read. (Sleeper language ??ShockedQuestion) - I was gonna say sleeper modules.... But then there's a balancing debacle and I don't wanna head down that road. NUL sites can get faction towers...... Give wormholer's that awesome 'FU#K YEAH" moment of striking it lucky ON SOMETHING INTERESTING.

If you start to scratch the surface the possibilities are endless, only after now living in wormhole space for a few months am I a little bit underwhelmed at the depth of it all. :/ however it is still my favourite part of eve :D


Dringy o7

P.s I just now realised I'm on my nul alt xD don't be judging Roll
unimatrix0030
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
#275 - 2013-09-02 18:49:43 UTC
Mr Kidd wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
Riel Saigo wrote:
The minigame is fine - it gives PvPers more time to gank explorers. That's a good thing.
But the flying loot cans is pretty stupid.

You missed my point.
I dont care about the minigame one way or the other but the inconsistency of having rats at WH data/relic sites while theyre nowhere else is, well, inconsistent.



Yeah, the sleepers need to be removed in lower end w-space. A majority of the loot to be had from data sites has largely been de-valued by overlap from k-space which anyone can access. The market has been flooded with these items. But, in w-space our players have to spend time to clear these sites. It's a big FU from CCP.

I though it was actualy asked by w-space players to keep the sleepers because they always were the most amount of isk in those sites... .

No local in null sec would fix everything!
Jack Miton
School of Applied Knowledge
Caldari State
#276 - 2013-09-02 22:51:19 UTC
unimatrix0030 wrote:
Mr Kidd wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
Riel Saigo wrote:
The minigame is fine - it gives PvPers more time to gank explorers. That's a good thing.
But the flying loot cans is pretty stupid.

You missed my point.
I dont care about the minigame one way or the other but the inconsistency of having rats at WH data/relic sites while theyre nowhere else is, well, inconsistent.

Yeah, the sleepers need to be removed in lower end w-space. A majority of the loot to be had from data sites has largely been de-valued by overlap from k-space which anyone can access. The market has been flooded with these items. But, in w-space our players have to spend time to clear these sites. It's a big FU from CCP.

I though it was actualy asked by w-space players to keep the sleepers because they always were the most amount of isk in those sites... .

that wouldnt surprise me at all but if CCP want to ruin hacking, they should do it everywhere equally. WHs are not special snowflakes.

There is no Bob.

Stuck In Here With Me:  http://sihwm.blogspot.com.au/

Down the Pipe:  http://feeds.feedburner.com/CloakyScout
CeNSeR
Sebiestor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
#277 - 2013-09-03 00:46:41 UTC
Jack Miton wrote:
unimatrix0030 wrote:
Mr Kidd wrote:
Jack Miton wrote:
Riel Saigo wrote:
The minigame is fine - it gives PvPers more time to gank explorers. That's a good thing.
But the flying loot cans is pretty stupid.

You missed my point.
I dont care about the minigame one way or the other but the inconsistency of having rats at WH data/relic sites while theyre nowhere else is, well, inconsistent.

Yeah, the sleepers need to be removed in lower end w-space. A majority of the loot to be had from data sites has largely been de-valued by overlap from k-space which anyone can access. The market has been flooded with these items. But, in w-space our players have to spend time to clear these sites. It's a big FU from CCP.

I though it was actualy asked by w-space players to keep the sleepers because they always were the most amount of isk in those sites... .

that wouldnt surprise me at all but if CCP want to ruin hacking, they should do it everywhere equally. WHs are not special snowflakes.


The envioronment is totaly different to the rest of the eve universe, so yes in my opinion they are special snow flakes.
Nexus247
Imperial Academy
Amarr Empire
#278 - 2013-09-03 01:44:21 UTC
1. More Wormhole space! WH space used to be this deep and mysterious side of the game that was totally unpredictable. Now its just like null sec with a few different rules.

2. The Blackhole system effect needs to be redone. - my personal are, reduction to targeting time, align time, max speeds, tracking speed and rate of fire. It would be like a permanent tidi on the system which would could produce some funny results when connected to a null-effect wormhole.

3. There should be more sites and proportionally less loot in each one, to give wh'ers more to do.
Robert Harrison
Ronin Interstellar Industries
Weapons Of Mass Production.
#279 - 2013-09-03 07:20:38 UTC  |  Edited by: Robert Harrison
Nexus247 wrote:

3. There should be more sites and proportionally less loot in each one, to give wh'ers more to do.



How about fewer sites with more loot! So we can spend more time shooting carebears and less time shooting robots?

Or even better a module that we can anchor and upgrade over time that makes more sites spawn.... Straight

I disagree with about 80% of the suggestions I've found in this thread. If you don't like wormholes, move to null sec.
Trinkets friend
Sudden Buggery
Sending Thots And Players
#280 - 2013-09-03 07:26:05 UTC
All this hate on the radars and mags. I actually like the loot bukake. Especially at 2 a.m. on a "caffeine" bender, it really gives me something to do aside fom scratching at the cockroaches which are crawling underneath my skin.

~~ Localectomy Blog ~~