EVE General Discussion

Why do hardcore Carebears get their knickers in a twist when they find out that the central tenet of EVE is PVP?

You are playing a PVP MMO knowing full well that there is non-consensual PVP as a core mechanic, and you complain that there is....PVP?

- How boring would EVE be without non-consensual PVP?
- How boring would it be without conflict?
- How boring would EVE be without risk?
- How boring would it be without consequences?

If EVE was not made the way it is, it would have been a dismal failure. Death should have real consequences, not this mamby pamby die-and-you-only-lose-time BS you find in other MMO's.

EVE is Hard, its designed that way, its what makes it great. Deal with it.
You want to Carebear? Then expect to be treated like the prey you actually turned yourself into.
Don't want to be prey? Then PVP, and be prepared to have fun.

The danger of losing something that you worked hard to create is what gives this game its adrenaline inducing, heart pounding PVP.

If you want to limit your game to no PVP at all, that's your choice, but don't expect to have your cake and eat it too. Expect to have your game limited to boring activities.

Learn to accept the realities of this game. Adapt or die, its as simple as that.

imho there is only one reason people stay in highsec >>> Possession.

A highseccer cannot live in 0.0 because he wants to run his 10 man corp, by himself and with all his possession under his control and in 0.0, there is an absolute requirement to be part of something much bigger. It goes way beyond "me".

As an ex-alliance boss who had managed to grow to an 5 corp, 80 man alliance with a LOT of hard work, I tried desperately to form it into a single corp entity to make ourselves attractive to an 0.0 alliance.

All I got was "what about my towers", "what about me" bla bla bla. I gave up.

Zagdul is partly right that 0.0 is in fact safer than empire most of the time. What he fails to state is that most alliances have ALL of the assets, moons etc. under tight control and consequently there is very little provision for those "me" type corps.

0.0 either needs to be bigger, the lords need to be more generous and/or corp sizes need to reduce.

For me, until there is more to have, do and build for SMALLER corps, apart from endless CTA's and sanctums, I have no need nor any interest in going back.

Last night I roamed 0.0 using bubble avoidance methods posted in a thread on that topic and saw the PVP of 0.0.

Basically what I saw was bubbles in line with gate-to-gate jumps. These are in fact easier to avoid than most people think.


But then it occurred to me that the only people who are not going to know this are going to be noobs, who are not skilled in the ways of 0.0.

Yet, out there lie still these bubble campers, waiting for that one person who comes along who does not know.

Now if the target of such camps is not likely to be someone of stature in the game, for such players know how to stay out of those traps, they why trap the noobs and lesser experienced at all just to kill them?

Is that really PVP? It's more like Player versus Victim.

If I wanted to be a street fighter (again) do I try to best other fighters or do I wait in an alley for some dumb yuppie to make a wrong turn and mug him?
If you see two guys who know how to fight duke it out, we call that a fight. But do we call it a fight when we see one person enact a total beat-down of another? Be honest with how you answer that to yourself.

If I asked some kids to log into COD2, and me, having played the game since 2006, totally dominates the round, could it be said by an observer that I am good at the game?

Gladly we are seeing a lot of threads indicating that people are starting to pick up on the idea that most of the "PVP" outside of high sec is not really PVP to a person who is truly playing the game and killing for game-related reasons. It's really starting to look like the motivation for noob harvesting is not "PVP", nor is it "piracy" or "defending my turf" has more of a metagame value stemming from the desire to simply make other players angry - griefing as it's known. . I saw a lot of bubble camps in NPC space so the "hey man I'm just defending my patch HTFU" argument falls flat on its face.

All I ever asked is that griefers be honest in admitting who and what they are, and the player base has every right to ask not for new mechanics or changes the affect PVP, but for changes that remove such mechanics or atmosphere that are proven advantageous to griefers.

Yes there are some people who would want all PVP removed and turn the game into Carebear heaven, as well as some people who will insist that all space becomes 0.0. We have names for them in game and out and they don't apply to this debate.


I keep seeing the word "sandbox" and use it myself, but if there's only pre-determined paths in the sandbox to get around, instead of being able to point yourself in the direction you want to go, and bullies hang around on those paths, how "sandboxy" is that? And who will be the one still screaming "it's a sandbox" when called to task on their actions?

Did you miss the Multiplayer part of MMO?

Guess what PVP requires?

Turning it into a circular argument does not invalidate the central tenet of EvE....a sandbox.

It si itneresting how this kind of threads are beginning to give voice to what used to be a silent majority....

Let me tell you a story. One of the languages most used in Internet is English, yet, every study around tells the same: most people who speaks english are not native english speakers. Actually, there is a kind of english that only existes outside of english-speaking coutnries; it is an english adapted to the grammar, syntaxes and lexicon of languages that are NOT english. Truly, most people who speaks english in the world speaks "foreigner's english" and not "true" english, and true english speakers are increasingly facing difficulties talking english to people who speaks english as a second language...

The point here is that some players are convinced that they play the "real " EVE (nullsec endgame, and combat PvP), but now they are meeting the harsh reality (a harsh reality CCP must face in order to survive) that most people who pay to play EVE don't play "real " EVE and aren't interested to do so.

We all play EVE, as we all speak english here. But never mistake who is in the majority. The majority here does not speak english outside of EVE, and does no play nullsec nor combat PvP EVE. The majority are not part of an alliance, are not griefers, and never have been to nullsec nor plan to.

Now it's becoming aparent beyond the anual survey:

EVE si NOT what nullsec dwellers and veterans think. EVE is what EVE players do, and what EVE players do it's a hisec, economy PvP, PvE funded sci-fi game.

The exact same reasons you need your kills. Because it's how some measure their success in game. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

And where did I say making isk isn't fun to me?

And I'll ask you again, where did I say making isk isn't fun to me?

You not understanding something doesn't make it an oxymoron.

You should just uninstall because you seem to need handholding wherever you go.